Step 5- another human being

[Pete55]

This part of the step, "to another human being" is, I don't know how to say it, I just feel there is more to it than meets the eye.
I consciously made a decision during the process of taking the steps with my then sponsor, there is NO WAY he is going to know EVERYTHING.

I do understand the step,( self delusion) but there is something about the part "with another human being" that rings a bell that says, "stop and think before who you do this with".

This is what happened since coming to AA by listening to a few long term sobers.

1. First month in AA, I was having coffee and just probing about AA, steps etc.
He gave good directions, but he warned me about Step 5 from his own expirience. That is, his sponsor slipped, got drunk and blab about his sponsees.
OK, this is probably 1 in a million chance it happens, but it happened.

2. My sponsor may not understand because he has not been where I have been.
For example, let's say I was a bank robber and I robbed a bank on such and such street, on such and such date.
Do I tell him I was a thief, ( nature of our wrongs )?
Or do I tell him the whole deal, address, bank, amounts stolen etc etc?

3. The steps sa's "another human being", does that mean specifically my sponsor?

4. Page 61 in 12 & 12 writes, "Here we ought to take much care......,"
Then it writes, "this individual may be entirely outside of AA"

And even goes further to say, "a complete stranger may prove the best bet."


I don't mean to rip this step apart, but I also know that I really don't want to know EVERY bit of gory detail of future sponsees, definatley not.
If they robbed a bank for example and have not been caught, do I rerally want to know this stuff? No I don't, what if then I am forced by the law to reveal what I know or get done for what ever it is, perjury I think it is.

Can someone please enlighten on this topic, not to shoot it down, but some clarity.

Thanks

[keithj]

Originally Posted by AA BB 1st

We must be entirely honest with somebody if we expect to live long or happily in this world. Rightly and naturally, we think well before we choose the person or persons with whom to take this intimate and confidential step.

Entirely means entirely. Directions are given on how to choose this person. Understanding and close-mouthed are mentioned.

Although I have found that a sponsor is uniquely qualified to give feedback and help someone see the truth about their past conduct, I always give guys an out. I tell them if there is something they haven't been able to share, something they just can't tell me, then find a priest or some other individual to share that with. It doesn't have to be me, but it has to be someone.

After I've heard a 5th Step (and I've heard some things I really didn't want to hear), I do a 6th and 7th Step as well to have God remove from me anything I don't need to be useful. I don't need to be carrying around that weight any more than the guy 5th Stepping does.

[LatteLady]

I am so new to this that right now I am just reading. I will find it difficult to offload my mental junk to ANYone who is not a licensed/certified therapist or of the clergy so you have that seal of the confessional.
Maybe by the time I get there, things will change. But we shall see.
Were a sponsor become drunk and discuss my issues, I could foresee tremendous emotional damage to the sponsee.

[mfanch]

BB page 74 has clear directions. We find the "person" and get to it.

And it's not "people". We don't give out snippets to different confidants so that no one person knows all. We tell ALL to another human being. Not your sponsor? Ok, then go find another understanding person and get 5th-stepping.

I've done horrible awful things in my addiction and should be dead or at least incarcerated. I found that person with whom I did my 5th and got to it without delay.

Freedom awaits!!

[Gottalife]

Originally Posted by LatteLady

I am so new to this that right now I am just reading. I will find it difficult to offload my mental junk to ANYone who is not a licensed/certified therapist or of the clergy so you have that seal of the confessional.
Maybe by the time I get there, things will change. But we shall see.
Were a sponsor become drunk and discuss my issues, I could foresee tremendous emotional damage to the sponsee.

Quite right. The book does not say it has to be an AA member. It has to be an understanding close mouthed individual in whom you have confidence. It could be a counsellor, doctor or priest. I took mine with my sponsor and godd some useful feedback, mainly that I was a run of the mill alcoholic, and I lost my lonliness and shame. So that was a plus. But it can be anyone you choose. The important thing is to get it done. You will be amazed at the result.

[Gottalife]

Originally Posted by mfanch

BB page 74 has clear directions. We find the "person" and get to it.

And it's not "people". We don't give out snippets to different confidants so that no one person knows all. We tell ALL to another human being. Not your sponsor? Ok, then go find another understanding person and get 5th-stepping.

I've done horrible awful things in my addiction and should be dead or at least incarcerated. I found that person with whom I did my 5th and got to it without delay.

Freedom awaits!!

Great point Mfanch. My strategy when drinking was to ensure no one new the whole truth, a great way of fooling myself and perpetuating the disease. I had to look at the whole sorry picture with one person or I am sure I would not have survived.

A Note of caution though, that came to light due to a local criminal case. The person taking the 5th step ought to try not to incriminate the listener. AA sponsors have no special privileges under the law in this regard. Even counsellors and doctors are bound to report certain things they hear, possibly priests are the only ones left with this privilege and even that may be in doubt.

So to get it all out without incriminating the listener, I suggest keeping the discussion general, without names places and dates. If it is an unresolved or current criminal matter, it is implicit in the program that the intent is to eventually front up and make amends in anycase.

If the intent is to conceal and hopefully get away with something, then its probably a waste of everyone's time to take this step.

[Fernaceman]

Great responses. If you feel you can't do it with your sponsor (and actually doesn't ever mention a sponsor in the book), find a priest, pastor, therapist, good friend, whatever...Someone trustworthy to say the least.

Get at it and move on! I put a lot of fear into this and once I was done with it, I didn't feel super free, but I felt good that it was done and I could finally move on.

[sugarbear1]

I don't think I would have had the same results if I hadn't done my 5th step with my sponsor, but that is my experience.

[paul99]

The whole point is that someone knows the whole story, not bits and bobs scattered about, as mentioned. I spent my whole life giving little tidbits about myself, and in the end not one person knew the whole me. It was a defense mechanism for me - keep people at arm's length by revealing only portions of myself., and not letting them in to the true me. I feared they wouldn't want to be around me if I did so.

But in the 5th, we let one person know us all, warts and all. This is where we get free at a strong level. And knowing that my sponsor knows all of me, and still loves me and accepts me, well, that's a first for me. And that starts to build more trust in every one else.

The chances of a sponsor getting drunk and revealing all - I don't have a stat for that, but I don't imagine it happens often. I could also fall down a sewer grate. Who knows. But for me someone who has done this, gone down this road,is important. But if a therapist or clergyperson is what does it for someone, then let it be. As long as it's getting done.

[Cephas]

Originally Posted by LatteLady

I am so new to this that right now I am just reading. I will find it difficult to offload my mental junk to ANYone who is not a licensed/certified therapist or of the clergy so you have that seal of the confessional.
Maybe by the time I get there, things will change. But we shall see.
Were a sponsor become drunk and discuss my issues, I could foresee tremendous emotional damage to the sponsee.

Don't even worry about this step right now. When you get to it you will probably have a different perspective. Trust is important. My sponsor was the only one I trusted enough to do this step with when I got to it. If you don't trust the sponsor you have when you get to this step then you might consider finding a different sponsor.

[tomsteve]

as mfanch poiinte out, an understanding person, one who understands what we are doing. a comatose lithuanian wouldnt be a good choice.