The Zen of Recovery

[MycoolFitz]

was re-reading this book by Mel Ash, a dharma teacher and recovering alcoholic, once again this quote gave me pause to ponder. I take the liberty of sharing it with those interested.

"Your defects, your disease and your suffering: Are they you?

If you say they are the same and a part of you,
you have already denied any possibility of change
short of self-destruction of all or part of you.

If you say they are different and not a part of you,
you have surrendered and become a victim
to something outside yourself over which you feel powerless
and not responsible.

Which is the true way?
Are they the same or different?

Show me the mind that decides and I'll show you
your defects, your disease and your suffering."

[Boleo]

Originally Posted by MycoolFitz

Show me the mind that decides and I'll show you
your defects, your disease and your suffering."

"All expectations are seeds for resentment"

This sounded funny to me the first time I read it, but it's true. When ever I expect something to happen and it doesn't, I get upset. It is equally true both with good and bad expectations. If I expect someone that I admire to stay virtuous and they fail? I feel like I somehow failed as well.

Why? Because I had an unrealistic expectation of them. Whose fault was that - mine and not theirs. If I expect someone who has been nothing but bad in the past to keep acting bad - then do manage to break their bad habits - that upsets me as well. Whose fault is that?

So how do I manage to live life without any judgement, presumptions or expectations? Not by diligence, tenacity or assertiveness on my part, that only makes it worse. I have to live my life based on principles. Whenever there is a decision to made or options to choose between, my first thought is "What is the Principle here?"

When I have ceased fighting everyone and everything. When I have ceased judging everyone and everything. When I have ceased expecting everyone and everything to go my way - I find suffering automatically ceases as well.

"In this life, pain is inevitable - suffering is optional".

[Rusty Zipper]

"Your defects, your disease and your suffering: Are they you?

when, and as long as i'm spiritualy fot...

they were me

"what would the master do" comes to mind here

[SoberJennie]

Hmmm.... are they me? No. They might be a part of my experience at the moment. But... I agree, they're tied to expectation and limited to my own persepctive or "lens"... A good way to put things into perspective is to realize just how people differ in their suffering.... it's relative to other things going on in your life at the moment, it seems.

I think a big key to contentment or "happiness" for me is my imagination or ability to visualize even a possibility of something different...

[SoberJennie]

Zen Corgi is at one with the Universe...

A great little mug to sip your coffee or herbal tea from

[jetsgirl12]

So im only a couple of days sober, Ive tried the meetings for years and they just dont work for me .. I know living a spiritual path is what I need to do but i feel as if i need to find another avenue other than meetings. I live healthily, i work out i eat well ( im in recovery from an eating disorder) but im just having some difficulty cutting alcohol and drugs completely out of my life. Does anyone have any suggestions?

[Boleo]

Originally Posted by jetsgirl12

... Does anyone have any suggestions?

Since this is a Spirituality forum, I am going to suggest something that would sound absurd in a conventional recovery forum.

Stop seeking sobriety!

No it does not make sense to those who have not experienced a spiritual awakening. As long as I thought I could find, achieve or learn sobriety, it alluded me.

So how did I get sober? I surrendered the idea that it was about me achieving anything. I detached from the outcome. Then and only then, sobriety found me. Detachment was the higher virtue that brought sobriety (the lower virtue) into my life like gravity moves water.

"Sought after virtue is not true virtue"
- Lao Tzu

[Tosh]

Originally Posted by jetsgirl12

So im only a couple of days sober, Ive tried the meetings for years and they just dont work for me .. I know living a spiritual path is what I need to do but i feel as if i need to find another avenue other than meetings. I live healthily, i work out i eat well ( im in recovery from an eating disorder) but im just having some difficulty cutting alcohol and drugs completely out of my life. Does anyone have any suggestions?

Yep, fully agree, meetings won't work for a real alkie. How could they? You reckon you can just listen to something in a meeting and that's going to change your life? It doesn't.

Meetings didn't work for me either, I went to many and still drank, I needed to find a sponsor and work the 12 Steps, even if they meant I did have to come out of my comfort zone to do them.

In any spiritual path, coming out of your comfort zone is a must; but unfortunately many of us try for the easier softer way, and the result was nil.

I hope I've been some help; but really; it's time to put that ego to one side, swallow your pride, and get stuck into the steps; and as a student of Buddhism myself; I can see the Buddhist principles and teachings throughout the A.A. program. My own Buddhist teacher (Geshe Tashi Tsering) teaches that self cherishing is the root of all our problems; now where have I heard that before?

But Buddhism wouldn't have gotten me sober!

[Tosh]

Originally Posted by Boleo

So how did I get sober? I surrendered the idea that it was about me achieving anything. I detached from the outcome. Then and only then, sobriety found me. Detachment was the higher virtue that brought sobriety (the lower virtue) into my life like gravity moves water.

You were a very different sort of alcoholic to me, and although I understand the principle you're driving at; I doubt it'll help someone whose clucking for a drink.

There's a time and a place to use the correct spiritual tool, and that is not the time or the place for someone whose struggling to stay sober.

[stacylove]

Can't the defects be a part of me that I can change? I love Zen, and I also own this book, it is very enlightening and it really makes you think. It is best to read it two or three times. One sentence in the book can keep my mind racing for weeks.

[Tosh]

Originally Posted by stacylove

Can't the defects be a part of me that I can change?

From a Buddhist point of view, a better question to ask could be 'What am I?' You can investigate this for yourself by meditating on the Five Aggregates, which is a frame work to help you work out what that "I" we feel actually is.

Once you have some sort of inkling what that "I" is, you will not need to hold onto what could be a 'wrong view' that you want your defects to be part of you, because you will understand that there is no "you" in the way you think there is a "you". Confusing eh? Probably. Have a good look (study of) at the Five Aggregates and meditate on them. You don't have to be an advanced meditation practitioner to benefit from this.

And from a 12 Step point of view, you do not need to trouble yourself about working on your defects; 'God removes them'; but how this actually works is that you work on steps 10, 11, and 12, and by following the principles in these steps, your defects of character will naturally become less troublesome.

[stacylove]

Thanks Tosh, It is almost like word play for me, and I have to read it over a few times to understand it and even then I'm confused. I guess you really have to step outside of yourself to comprehend what is happening, AND is there really an 'I' and/or a 'you' ? What is the meaning of everything or nothing I love buddhism even if I am never able to fully understand it.

[Tosh]

Originally Posted by stacylove

Thanks Tosh, It is almost like word play for me, and I have to read over it a few times to understand yes. I guess you really have to step outside of yourself to comprehend what is happening, and is there really an 'I' or a 'you' ? What is the meaning of everything or nothing I love buddhism even if I am never able to fully understand it.

LOL! Yes! Tell me about it; I'm halfway through a two year Gelupa foundation course; and it does my head in sometimes. "So is it a flipping jar or not?"

Buddhism often gets accused of being too intellectual and my brand of Tibetan Buddhism is probably the most scholastic of 'em all. But this isn't some religion where you just have to believe; Buddhists have to do the hard work of understanding.

A good book my Buddhist teacher uses, if you're interested, (even though we're Mahayanan and the writer is Theravadan) is What the Buddha Taught by Walpole Rahula (from memory so the name could be spelt wrong). It gives a good introduction into Buddhism and isn't some 'airy fairy nonsense' that you may find. Amazon will sell it for pennies.

All the different Buddhist sects hold the Four Seals; that's what makes them all Buddhist; it's just the fine print that they argue about - so look around at the different sects and see if you can find one that suits your psychological profile; for instance Pure Land Buddhism may suit someone with a more devotional bent, whereas Gelug Buddhism suits the more academic person (which is why I'm struggling with it).

I'm also a massive fan of the 12 Steps, so for me, my Buddhist studies and practise is just part of my Step 11 personal journey.

Have fun with it!

[backbeat]

I'm learning about Buddhism right now. It's a huge part of my desire to get sober. Maybe for me, it "is" sobriety, if that makes sense.

I'm one day sober... again. I was sober for 12 years, went back out about 5 years ago and I won't bore you with the details but here I am so you can guess how it turned out. This isn't my first attempt to get back on track lately, but I'm trying hard and need to be here and in the rooms.

From Feb. to May I was caring for my father who had stage 4 cancer. It was a life changing experience, and the decision to move into his house and do this was probably the first positive decision I've made in years. The hospice program that came in to help us care for him had a Doula program, which I'd never heard of. They were volunteers who come into a person's home for 2 hour shifts back to back around the clock during the last 48-72 hours of the person's life. They were amazing; the thought had never occurred to me that that kind of humanity and human kindness existed. That alone was a life changing experience. They sat with my father and held his hand and read to him and let us sleep and woke us up when it was time for medication or any changes in his condition occurred. They thanked us for this opportunity at the end of their shifts. They called during the day to check in. We must have had about 12 different people come in those last days; all volunteers.

Talk about gratitude.

Anyway I was so floored by the Doulas that I looked into them online, once the dust settled and my father was gone. I found out that it seems to have started out as a birthing support system but is being also used at the end of life. I also found out that many of the Doulas who came were Buddhists. So began my journey into Buddhism.

It makes so much sense to me that I can't imagine thinking any other way. And, the insight I'm gaining from what I'm reading and learning has in turn cause me to believe that sobriety, for me, is also the only way.

Thanks for letting me share my two cents.