Message Boards and Forums Directory
ALCOHOL ADDICTION
12 STEPS
Discuss and learn more about these
following steps for AA
CHAT MEETINGS
Sunday
Monday
Tuesday
Wednesday
Thursday
Friday
Saturday
NARCOTICS ADDICTION
12 STEPS
Discuss and learn more about these
following steps for NA

Go Back   SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information > Special-Interest Groups > Spirituality
Register Blogs FAQ Calendar Arcade Mark Forums Read Chat Room [5]


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-16-2009, 04:38 PM   #1 (permalink)
Member
 
MycoolFitz's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Here, Now
Posts: 450
Buddhism and Recovery--Being the Path

Greetings all. Is anyone interested in participating in, and keeping a thread going, on the practice of Buddhism as it relates to recovery with or without the 12-steps? I have been a Buddhist for 40 years (mostly non-denominational with a leaning toward Soto Zen, which like the 12-steps is simple but not easy), clean for 23 years and sober for 5 months, a little disparity. Topics could include experiences with Buddhism and Recovery, practices and progress or problems, questions and answers, resources and recommendations and so on. Buddhist sponsors tend to be hard to find and this would provide a nice peer led supprt in our recovery endeavors. If so here this is, sobriety to all, may you find it now. Namaste
MycoolFitz is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to MycoolFitz For This Useful Post:
digderidoo (08-26-2009), indigo (08-17-2009), liveweyerd (08-16-2009), NewBeginning010 (08-16-2009), readyforhelp (08-17-2009), Rusty Zipper (08-16-2009), Tosh (08-20-2009)
Old 08-16-2009, 07:12 PM   #2 (permalink)
boleon
 
Boleo's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 937
Maya - self-centeredness! That, we think, is the root of our troubles.
__________________
True sobriety rides on the coat-tails of Serenity
(H + B = S)

- All Big Book quotes are from first Edition -
Boleo is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Boleo For This Useful Post:
liveweyerd (08-19-2009), MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), NewBeginning010 (08-16-2009), Rusty Zipper (08-17-2009)
Old 08-16-2009, 07:51 PM   #3 (permalink)
Member
 
NewBeginning010's Avatar
 

Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,300
I am interested ;-) I have been reading about Buddhism, putting things into daily practice is sometimes challenging.

Glad you are doing well MCF

Take Care,

NB
__________________
"Today is the first day of the rest of your life"
NewBeginning010 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to NewBeginning010 For This Useful Post:
liveweyerd (08-19-2009), MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), Rusty Zipper (08-17-2009)
Old 08-17-2009, 07:30 AM   #4 (permalink)
boleon
 
Boleo's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 937
12. Having had a spiritual awakening (an Awakened-One) as the result of these steps (Karma), we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles (Dharma) in all our affairs.
__________________
True sobriety rides on the coat-tails of Serenity
(H + B = S)

- All Big Book quotes are from first Edition -
Boleo is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Boleo For This Useful Post:
liveweyerd (08-17-2009), MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), Rusty Zipper (08-17-2009)
Old 08-17-2009, 11:37 AM   #5 (permalink)
Member
 
liveweyerd's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 8,275
Blog Entries: 5
I am neither alcoholic or 12 step however I am interested.

I fell into a mindfulness practice yesterday...I say fell because there was no prior thought nor intention of this, but as I became involved in a practice of love, it naturally developed or evolved, (as you will) into a mindful excercise of love....was good for me and felt very good. I need this practice! LOL
__________________
Each small candle lights a corner of the dark....Roger Waters

liveweyerd is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to liveweyerd For This Useful Post:
indigo (08-18-2009), MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), Rusty Zipper (08-17-2009)
Old 08-17-2009, 01:08 PM   #6 (permalink)
Member
 
MycoolFitz's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Here, Now
Posts: 450
Well one certainly needed to be alcoholic addict though craving implies dissatisfaction in all of us. Noah Levine in Dharma Punx states: "Though we speak of, for example, drug addicts, what we are really addicted to isn’t substances—drugs or sex or food or alcohol—but our own minds. We are addicted to that part of the mind that craves, that says we must satisfy this desire or that. Even in twelve-step recovery programs it is said that the drugs and alcohol are only a symptom of an internal imbalance. That’s why I said earlier that our relationship to craving is the problem, not some substance itself."

__________________________________________________ _____________________
Ven. Robina Courtin says that We're all mentally ill. We're all delusional. We're all junkies.It's just a matter of degree.

I don't think this is negativity as some claim Buddhism is, its just saying we're all human and this is part of our life. The Buddha is likened to a physician who diagnoses and prescribes for the human condition presented to him, and like with our doctor's we go to them when we're feeling ill or in pain, not when we're on top of the world. So itrs not saying that life is just suffering or unsatisfactory, these are just the presenting symptoms for which we seek relief.

Addionally, The Buddha was not interested in theology or cosmology. He didn’t speak on these subjects and in fact would not answer questions on them. His primary concerns were psychological, moral, and highly practical ones:

• How can we see the world as it comes to be in each moment rather than as we think, hope, or fear it is?

• How can we base our actions on Reality rather than on the longing and loathing of our hearts and minds?

• How can we live lives that are wise, compassionate, and in tune with Reality?

• What is the experience of being awake?

These are conditions which condition our sufferings from which we seek relief. Its all very practical and very simple but not easy. To all this flows the underpinning of the love and concern embodied in the Boddichitta. Like Boleo wrote: "Having had a spiritual awakening (an Awakened-One) as the result of these steps (Karma), we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles (Dharma) in all our affairs."
The awakened vow to bring awakening to all beings, not just themselves.
MycoolFitz is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to MycoolFitz For This Useful Post:
liveweyerd (08-17-2009), readyforhelp (08-17-2009), Rusty Zipper (08-17-2009)
Old 08-17-2009, 10:00 PM   #7 (permalink)
Member
 
liveweyerd's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 8,275
Blog Entries: 5
Forgive me for dumbing things down a bit
Yes, I am addicted to substances, my nicotine addiction is deadly.
Earlier I wasn't sure if you wanted a specific gathering type.
I understand the concept of being overly dependent and reliant on unnecessary things and the grasping that comes with that.
I understand that freedom comes about as we release our reliance on these things (whether they be material, habits of thought, emotional habits ad nauseum).
It is very difficult for me, a person raised in Western thought and being a very fallible human being, to begin to understand the practice of Eastern wisdoms I have learned.
My mind may understand and agree with the concept, but putting it to practice is quite confusing to me.
I have the greatest respect for His Holiness the Dalai Lama. He teaches us not to abandon whatever our theology or religious upbringing has been, he seeks no converts and teaches that all are paths along the same journey. He seems to be spending and exerting his greatest efforts on teaching compassion and shoring up ethical systems and behaviors. He is hopeful and optimistic.
I wish to learn more about the practice of ethical compassion, as well as whatever is offered in this dialogue.
__________________
Each small candle lights a corner of the dark....Roger Waters

liveweyerd is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to liveweyerd For This Useful Post:
MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), readyforhelp (08-18-2009), Rusty Zipper (08-18-2009)
Old 08-17-2009, 10:49 PM   #8 (permalink)
Member
 
liveweyerd's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 8,275
Blog Entries: 5
PS I am currently reading, SLOWLY, Robert Thurman's book "Infinite Life".
As this is the first time I have read this book, I am taking it in small bits slowly.
I think that I shall begin re-reading "Destructive Emotions" by Daniel Goleman for further reinforcement of those teachings.

If any of you have not heard of this: MindandLife.org it is the consortium wherein the 14the Dalai Lama meets with Western scientists to explore scientific research in conjunction with Eastern wisdoms which I find utterly intriguing and valuable.
__________________
Each small candle lights a corner of the dark....Roger Waters

liveweyerd is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to liveweyerd For This Useful Post:
MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), readyforhelp (08-18-2009)
Old 08-18-2009, 08:55 AM   #9 (permalink)
boleon
 
Boleo's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 937
Quote:
Originally Posted by MycoolFitz View Post
Ven. Robina Courtin says that We're all mentally ill. We're all delusional...
I have come to appreciate how big a role that "Delusional Thinking" plays in addiction of any kind.

What treats this ailment is what awakens us to the TRUTH. It can be the 12 steps of recovery, the Dharma of Buddhism, the sanctity of Christianity or the Pu of Taoism.

"And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free."
__________________
True sobriety rides on the coat-tails of Serenity
(H + B = S)

- All Big Book quotes are from first Edition -
Boleo is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Boleo For This Useful Post:
liveweyerd (08-18-2009), MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), readyforhelp (08-18-2009)
Old 08-18-2009, 11:09 AM   #10 (permalink)
Member
 
MycoolFitz's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Here, Now
Posts: 450
Really didn't have a specific gathering type in mind. Just a chance to get together and share our beliefs, practices, recovery, life. I can really relate to understand in the sense of being the complexity of the simplisticity of the teachings. I struggle not to crave not craving then realize struggling is an issue itself. Even simply letting the breath be without subtley controlling it as I am aware of it can be difficult for me. I too am interested in and have followed the Mind Life Institutes. Strangely my two favorite passions are Buddhism and Quantum Mechanics. An excellent book is the Dali Lama's "The Universe in a Single Atom". I also agree that delusional thinking is critical to the survival of addiction. Steve Hagen in "Buddhism Plain and Simple" states that Because we’re so caught up in our intellectualizing, our emotions, and our mental constructions, the objects of our concern seems compellingly real for us—and gripping. Furthermore, virtually everyone around us is caught in the same way. Thus we create shared delusions."
Gerald G. May, M.D., in Addiction and Grace, defines addiction as "any compulsive, habitual behavior that limits the freedom of human desire. It is caused by attachments, or nailing, of desires to specific objects. Five essential characteristics mark true addiction: (1) tolerance, (2) withdrawal symptoms, (3) self-deception, (4) loss of will power, and (5) distortion of attention." May indicates that "Self-Deception" is One of the most significant hallmarks of addiction is the exquisite inventiveness that the mind can demonstrate in order to perpetuate addictive behaviors. These tricks of mind include denial, rationalization, displacement, and every other defense mechanism that psychoanalysis has identified, and then some.

I think that denial and delusion are survival mechanisms that can end up killing us.
Namaste
MycoolFitz is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to MycoolFitz For This Useful Post:
indigo (08-20-2009), liveweyerd (08-18-2009), readyforhelp (08-18-2009)
Old 08-18-2009, 11:59 AM   #11 (permalink)
Member
 
liveweyerd's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 8,275
Blog Entries: 5
I am still trying to realize the practice of ethical compassion.
There is someone whom I care about who has many delusions and has asked me to understand them but not challenge them. This person suffers greatly. I have been asked to "dance around" and not speak of sensitive areas, however I see that these areas are the cause of much of this person's suffering. I feel rather insane when attempting to relate to this person within the parameters they require. Compassion asks that I have compassion for my self and not participate in this crazy-making relating and interaction.
Compassion also asks that I love this person as they are and have empathy and care with their suffering. How might I reconcile this? What is truly the ethical approach with this dilemna?
I am working to realize the concepts in my daily life.
Sunday was a special day as serene mindfulness came easily and naturally in everything from cleaning the toilet to excercising giving love to another. However, I do set aside a day a week to focus and this week it was Sunday.
I know it should be an every day thing, all of life should be like that, but I have not evolved into that yet. Most days I set aside time 3 times a day to center myself and focus and settle myself, to clear my mind, to listen. While I love intellectual concepts, I need to bring them down to earth, so to speak, into daily living and practice.
I will share some of the things from my readings later.
Peace.
__________________
Each small candle lights a corner of the dark....Roger Waters

liveweyerd is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to liveweyerd For This Useful Post:
MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), readyforhelp (08-18-2009)
Old 08-18-2009, 12:12 PM   #12 (permalink)
Member
 
liveweyerd's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 8,275
Blog Entries: 5
Wisdom is the first virtue, the other five transcendent virtues:

"Generosity keeps you open through deeds, making you aware of other's needs. It seals your insight into selflessness by allowing you to let go of all possessions-including your body, your mind, and even your good deeds-in order to find true contentment in helping other beings."

Robert Thurman in "Infinite Life"
__________________
Each small candle lights a corner of the dark....Roger Waters

liveweyerd is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to liveweyerd For This Useful Post:
MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), readyforhelp (08-18-2009)
Old 08-18-2009, 02:12 PM   #13 (permalink)
Member
 
liveweyerd's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 8,275
Blog Entries: 5
"Your infinite life thus becomes a moment-to-moment performance of all the transcendent virtues, all grounded in the greatest of these, transcendent wisdom. Your wisdom deepens constantly throughout, with seeing eroding absolutism, and freedom eroding nihilism. You perform your infinite living engaged with others through generosity, sensitive and empathetic justice, and invincible tolerance, forbearance, and forgiveness. You perforn in engagement with yourself in intensifying your serenity, your contemplative concentration, your one-pointed control of your mental focus, which intensifies your wisdom transcendence, gradualy erases the division between meditation and action, and fills you and your expanding field of infinite living with joy and bliss. Your creativity energizes both your altruistic and your self-eveloving performances, and your become an inexhaustible node of the infinite life-force, feeling more and more saturated with the sense of indivisible union with all enlightened beings. There is evolution without anxiety or stress, energy without restlessness, relentless progress without greed or feelings of deprivation.

Once you see the truth of your self-addiction and gain some measure of release from it, then you can begin to have a positive influence on other beings and effect change in your society. There is no need for you to formally promote certain doctrines: your very presence becomes a teaching example to others, a liberating art that opens their imaginations to the potential freedome they aso can experience."

ibid
__________________
Each small candle lights a corner of the dark....Roger Waters

liveweyerd is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to liveweyerd For This Useful Post:
MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), readyforhelp (08-18-2009), Rusty Zipper (08-18-2009)
Old 08-19-2009, 09:34 AM   #14 (permalink)
boleon
 
Boleo's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 937
Quote:
Originally Posted by MycoolFitz View Post
Five essential characteristics mark true addiction: (1) tolerance, (2) withdrawal symptoms, (3) self-deception, (4) loss of will power, and (5) distortion of attention. May indicates that "Self-Deception" is One of the most significant hallmarks of addiction...
Bad faith (self-deception) is a philosophical concept first coined by existentialist philosopher Jean-Paul Sartre to describe the phenomenon wherein one denies one's total freedom, instead choosing to behave as an inert object. It is closely related to the concepts of self-deception and ressentiment.
__________________
True sobriety rides on the coat-tails of Serenity
(H + B = S)

- All Big Book quotes are from first Edition -
Boleo is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Boleo For This Useful Post:
liveweyerd (08-19-2009), MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), readyforhelp (08-19-2009)
Old 08-19-2009, 12:48 PM   #15 (permalink)
Member
 
AstroGirl's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 27
Me!Me!Me! I want to be part of this conversation. I'm still working out some stuff that comes up for me because I was such a diligent vipassana meditator and yoga practitioner/instructor. Clocked lots of hours with my butt on the cushion and thought I had an inkling about living life on a spiritual basis - until my partner left and I drank a little wine, then a little more, then the whole sad mess that we all go through. What I didn't have an inkling about was alcoholism. So count me in on this thread!!!
AstroGirl is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to AstroGirl For This Useful Post:
liveweyerd (08-19-2009), MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), readyforhelp (08-19-2009)
Old 08-19-2009, 12:50 PM   #16 (permalink)
Member
 
AstroGirl's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 27
"Meditation is an evolutionary sport." ---Robert Thurman
AstroGirl is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to AstroGirl For This Useful Post:
liveweyerd (08-19-2009), MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), readyforhelp (08-19-2009)
Old 08-19-2009, 12:58 PM   #17 (permalink)
Member
 
AstroGirl's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 27
We're not drunk with out drinking, we're drunk with out thinking!" ---Byron Katie

Just taking this opportunity to reveal my interest in taking the addiction thing out of the realm of "pathology" and include it as a part of the human condition and path.

Live - I've got all the books from the "Mind and Life series" going back for quite a while, I even watched and downloaded the whole thing last April. Also got to do a meditation retreat for scientists with Richie Davidson and some of the folks from his lab who have been doing all the neurological studies of the effects of meditation. Whoop! This is my favorite subject. Pardon me if I get over-enthusiastic!
AstroGirl is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to AstroGirl For This Useful Post:
liveweyerd (08-19-2009), MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), readyforhelp (08-19-2009)
Old 08-19-2009, 01:07 PM   #18 (permalink)
Member
 
liveweyerd's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 8,275
Blog Entries: 5
oh YAY!!!! Welcome!
Well, I am jealous that you have all the books and etc! LOL
I roamed around the web last night and found Thurman's site.
I am wonderfully glad to meet other enthusiasts!
I have so much to learn!

More Thurman:
"JUSTICE encourages you to make your relationships with others as fruitfully harmonious as they can be. Its positive resonance with others reinforces within you a personal ethical system that leads you away from conflict and anxiety and toward peace and happiness."

I am still trying to figure out how to put this into practical application in the relationship I referred to above. ???????????
__________________
Each small candle lights a corner of the dark....Roger Waters

liveweyerd is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to liveweyerd For This Useful Post:
MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), readyforhelp (08-19-2009)
Old 08-19-2009, 01:16 PM   #19 (permalink)
Member
 
MycoolFitz's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Here, Now
Posts: 450
This is all so cool. I spent so many years thinking I was meditating when actually I was medicating. Without the drugs and booze it is so different, I don't know how to describe it. However, it was meeting Ram Dass and acid that got me hooked on the Buddha trip, so very interconnected. But like Ram Dass said about the drug aspect, once you receive the message it's time to hang up the phone. A great mix of gene pool on the thread, glad I'm not the only one with the scientific/Buddhist interest although as I go deeper into Soto Zen I'm tending to shed a lot of layers of intellectual skin.

In terms of my personal recovery, mindfulness is definately the key. When a drinking thought arises, or a missing something thought, I acknowledge it, look at it, accept it for what it is (a thought) and go on. Its funny but for the first time in 45 years of drugging and drinking, I'm really not having any cravings or desires to pick up. It feels so easy and natural that I need to stay mindful and not wander into the delusion that drugs and alcohol or no longer an issue for me. I quit drugs 23 years ago and I wouldn't risk so much as a toke now. I'm only 135 daze sober and I won't even use cooking sherry in my recipes. My computer is going wacko, thought it was a flashback so I'll
sign off for now. Namaste
MycoolFitz is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to MycoolFitz For This Useful Post:
Firehazard (09-13-2009), indigo (08-20-2009), liveweyerd (08-19-2009), readyforhelp (08-19-2009)
Old 08-19-2009, 01:37 PM   #20 (permalink)
boleon
 
Boleo's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 937
Since we have so many Meditator's gathered together in one place, I would like to know if anyone here can define and distinguish the following;

ZaZen
Wu-nien
Mushin
Pu of Tao
__________________
True sobriety rides on the coat-tails of Serenity
(H + B = S)

- All Big Book quotes are from first Edition -
Boleo is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Boleo For This Useful Post:
liveweyerd (09-15-2009), MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), readyforhelp (08-19-2009)
Old 08-19-2009, 03:34 PM   #21 (permalink)
Member
 
MycoolFitz's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Here, Now
Posts: 450
I can translate some of them I don't know that I will ever be able to define or understand them. Zazen, as you know most commonly refers to sitting meditation, whole-hearted sitting, opening the hand of heart. It could be said if you're "doing" zazen you're not truely doing it, its beyond thought. Mushin I've heard of as delusive mind, no heart, no minds, mind. I have your word for Pu of Tao which I wasn't familiar with Pu is translated "uncarved block", "unhewn log", or "simplicity". It is a metaphor for the state of wu wei and the principle of jian. It represents a passive state of receptiveness. Pu is a symbol for a state of pure potential and perception without prejudice. In this state, Taoists believe everything is seen as it is, without preconceptions or illusion.

Pu is seen as keeping oneself in the primordial state of Tao. It is believed to be the true nature of the mind, unburdened by knowledge or experiences. In the state of Pu, there is no right or wrong, beautiful or ugly. There is only pure experience, or awareness, free from learned labels and definitions. It is this state of being that is the goal of following Tao.
Wu nien I don't know. I do know the meanings are not in the words but in the being. The longer i practice the way the less I know, like Benjamin Buttonsan.
MycoolFitz is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to MycoolFitz For This Useful Post:
liveweyerd (08-19-2009), readyforhelp (08-19-2009)
Old 08-19-2009, 04:42 PM   #22 (permalink)
Member
 
AstroGirl's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 27
Thanks, live for the invite. I'm preparing for a friend of mine from India to arrive tomorrow night, and I'll be really busy for the next couple of weeks - he's 23 or 4 generations of astrologer in his family and he sees his clients here in my home. So it's great for me - busy with stuff I love, no question of alcohol or drugs, time for meditation in the morning . . . just lots of phone calls and keeping up with stuff. After that, I'd love to PM w/ you for a while and get to know you. I'm afraid I'm going to be the simpleton on the board. I've practiced Theravada Buddhism since '87, which pretty much explains all of life as craving (desire), aversion (avoiding), or neutral. The secret (ha ha) is to observe them all with equanimity. But in my experience - the more personal the situation or relationship, the less available the equanimity. I guess that's why my screensaver says "Practice thirty more years."
But great to know your out there adding your mindful vibration to those of all of those of us through the ages who have turned our attention to these things and taken action to bring them into being. Thanks. It really makes a difference.
AstroGirl is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to AstroGirl For This Useful Post:
liveweyerd (08-19-2009), MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), readyforhelp (08-20-2009)
Old 08-19-2009, 06:31 PM   #23 (permalink)
Member
 
liveweyerd's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 8,275
Blog Entries: 5
Boleo, nope...I don't know any of them. I would like to enhance my rudimentary Spanish but that is it as far as learning other languages!

I have had no formal instruction and frankly don't even consider myself a Buddhist...however I have been studying certain teachings by Buddhists for a few years.
I don't know that I can even be considered a meditator, my excercises in that direction are so simple!
Nevertheless, I have found my studies to be very valuable and will continue to study and hope I learn to incorporate my learnings into practical, daily application.

One of the things that I so love about the books by the Dalai Lama are that he speaks simply so as not to exclude anyone and deprive them of His wisdom. I do believe that is a compassionate endeavor!
__________________
Each small candle lights a corner of the dark....Roger Waters

liveweyerd is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to liveweyerd For This Useful Post:
MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), readyforhelp (08-20-2009), Rusty Zipper (08-19-2009)
Old 08-20-2009, 08:12 AM   #24 (permalink)
Member
 
MycoolFitz's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Here, Now
Posts: 450
Good morning all. Wanted to share something. I suffer from PTSD, a funny thing to have when there exists no past to cause anquish. Anyhow I had one of my nightmares last night, the kind that are especially terrifying because they're not masked in symbolism or subconsious trickery. It was just an in your face this happened and I'm not going to let you forget or let go. It's terrible to wake oneself screaming. I didn't have the nightmares all the years I was drugging and drinking and managed to pass out. They started up again when I became sober. As I lay there in my sweat with my heart racing away I calmed my breath and just let it all be without fighting or fearing. I thought what a gift to mhave this terror come upon me, how else am I to get the poison out. Like wearing a bandage over a wound that needed to be exposed to light and air for healing I spent 40 years keeping them covered as they festered inside. Even my many years of meditating along with medicating were in a way my attempt to keep my nightmares in check. I was reminded of something I read awhile back and kept reading every now and then.

If we do not uncover [our] problems--and I saw this in myself--we risk placing a veneer of spirituality over deeply buried emotional wounds from childhood that do not simply go away.-- Rigdzin Shikpo

Opening the cage, letting my nightmares out, facing the truth of a past that only truely exists illusionary is a gift of my recovery. Some of the greatest gifts come in painfilled wrappings. Namaste
MycoolFitz is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to MycoolFitz For This Useful Post:
liveweyerd (08-20-2009), readyforhelp (08-20-2009)
Old 08-20-2009, 08:44 AM   #25 (permalink)
Member
 

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Chepstow
Posts: 128
Hi MCF,

I can't add anything interesting to this post, but I'd like to thank you for a good read, even if I understood very little of it.

However I've started a six week 'course' called The Meaning of Life and it's ran by a British Budhist guy. I thought it was a medititation course (to help me with Step 11), but there was more to it than just that.

So far everything the budhist guy has said has made perfect sense; next week we will be meditating on 'death' which when he explained why sounded great!!!

I think it'll be a while before I start wearing orange dresses and shaving my head, but something about budhism clicks with me, and don't they say when the student is ready, the teacher will appear.

Regards
__________________
I was a "top end basic alcoholic with some characteristics of a chronic alcoholic", saved by AA and the grace of that external force that's greater than myself.
Tosh is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Tosh For This Useful Post:
liveweyerd (08-20-2009), MycoolFitz (08-21-2009), readyforhelp (08-20-2009)
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:14 AM.


 

© 2007 SoberRecovery, LLC.
A proud member of the SoberRecovery® Network of Addiction and Recovery Websites

The SoberRecovery Forums are operated under a grant from The Mulligan Group


1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360 361 362 363 364 365 366 367 368 369 370 371 372 373 374 375 376 377 378 379 380 381 382 383 384 385 386 387 388 389 390 391 392 393 394 395 396 397 398 399 400 401 402 403 404 405 406 407 408 409 410 411 412 413 414 415 416 417 418 419 420 421 422 423 424 425 426 427 428 429 430 431 432 433 434 435 436 437 438 439 440 441 442 443 444 445 446 447 448 449 450 451 452 453 454 455 456 457 458 459 460 461 462 463 464 465 466 467 468 469 470 471 472 473 474 475 476 477 478 479 480 481 482 483 484 485 486 487 488 489 490 491 492 493 494 495 496 497 498 499 500 501 502 503 504 505 506 507 508 509 510 511 512 513 514 515 516 517 518 519 520 521 522 523 524 525 526 527 528 529 530 531 532 533 534 535 536 537 538 539 540 541 542 543 544 545 546 547 548 549 550 551 552 553 554 555 556 557 558 559 560 561 562 563 564 565 566 567 568 569 570 571 572 573 574 575 576 577 578 579 580 581 582 583 584 585 586 587 588 589 590 591 592 593 594 595 596 597 598 599 600 601 602 603 604 605 606 607 608 609 610 611 612 613 614 615 616 617 618 619 620 621 622 623 624 625 626 627 628 629 630 631 632 633 634 635 636 637 638 639 640 641 642 643 644 645 646 647 648 649 650 651 652 653 654 655 656 657 658 659 660 661 662 663 664 665 666 667 668 669 670 671 672 673 674 675 676 677 678 679 680 681 682 683 684 685 686 687 688 689 690 691 692 693 694 695 696 697 698 699 700 701 702 703 704 705 706 707 708 709 710 711 712 713 714 715 716 717 718 719 720 721 722 723 724 725 726 727 728 729 730 731 732 733 734 735 736 737 738 739 740 741 742 743 744 745 746 747 748 749 750 751 752 753 754 755 756 757 758 759 760 761 762 763 764 765 766 767 768 769 770 771 772 773 774 775 776 777 778 779 780 781 782 783 784 785 786 787 788 789 790 791 792 793 794 795 796 797 798 799 800 801 802 803 804 805 806 807 808 809 810 811 812 813 814 815 816 817 818 819 820 821 822 823 824 825 826 827 828 829 830 831 832 833 834 835 836 837 838 839 840 841 842 843 844 845 846 847 848 849 850 851 852 853 854 855 856 857 858 859 860 861 862 863 864 865 866 867 868 869 870 871 872 873 874 875 876 877 878 879 880 881 882 883 884 885 886 887 888 889 890 891 892 893 894 895 896 897 898 899 900 901 902 903 904 905 906 907 908 909 910 911 912 913 914 915 916 917 918 919 920 921 922 923 924 925 926 927 928 929 930 931 932 933 934 935 936 937 938 939 940 941 942 943 944 945 946 947 948 949 950 951 952 953 954 955 956 957 958 959 960 961 962 963 964 965 966 967 968 969 970 971 972 973 974 975 976 977 978 979 980 981 982 983 984 985 986 987 988 989 990 991 992 993 994 995 996 997 998 999 1000 1001 1002 1003 1004 1005 1006 1007 1008 1009 1010 1011 1012 1013 1014 1015 1016 1017 1018 1019 1020 1021 1022 1023 1024 1025 1026 1027 1028 1029 1030 1031 1032 1033 1034 1035 1036 1037 1038 1039 1040 1041 1042 1043 1044 1045 1046 1047 1048 1049 1050 1051 1052 1053 1054 1055 1056 1057 1058 1059 1060 1061 1062 1063 1064 1065 1066 1067 1068 1069 1070 1071 1072 1073 1074 1075 1076 1077 1078 1079 1080 1081 1082 1083 1084 1085 1086 1087 1088 1089 1090 1091 1092 1093 1094 1095 1096 1097 1098 1099 1100 1101 1102 1103 1104 1105 1106 1107 1108 1109 1110 1111 1112 1113 1114 1115 1116 1117 1118 1119 1120 1121 1122 1123 1124 1125 1126 1127 1128 1129 1130 1131 1132 1133 1134 1135 1136 1137 1138 1139 1140 1141 1142 1143 1144 1145 1146 1147 1148 1149 1150 1151 1152 1153 1154 1155 1156 1157 1158 1159 1160 1161 1162 1163 1164 1165 1166 1167 1168 1169 1170 1171 1172 1173 1174 1175 1176 1177 1178 1179 1180 1181 1182 1183 1184 1185 1186 1187 1188 1189 1190 1191 1192 1193 1194 1195 1196 1197 1198 1199 1200 1201 1202 1203 1204 1205 1206 1207 1208 1209 1210 1211 1212 1213 1214 1215 1216 1217 1218 1219 1220 1221 1222 1223 1224 1225 1226 1227 1228 1229 1230 1231 1232 1233 1234 1235 1236 1237 1238 1239 1240 1241 1242 1243 1244 1245 1246 1247 1248 1249 1250 1251 1252 1253 1254 1255 1256 1257 1258 1259 1260 1261 1262 1263 1264 1265 1266 1267 1268 1269 1270 1271 1272 1273 1274 1275 1276 1277 1278 1279 1280 1281 1282 1283 1284 1285 1286 1287 1288 1289 1290 1291 1292 1293 1294 1295 1296 1297 1298 1299 1300 1301 1302 1303 1304 1305 1306 1307 1308 1309 1310 1311 1312 1313 1314 1315 1316 1317 1318 1319 1320 1321 1322 1323 1324 1325 1326 1327 1328 1329 1330 1331 1332 1333 1334 1335 1336 1337 1338 1339 1340 1341 1342 1343 1344 1345 1346 1347 1348 1349 1350 1351 1352 1353 1354 1355 1356 1357 1358 1359 1360 1361 1362 1363 1364 1365 1366 1367 1368 1369 1370 1371 1372 1373 1374 1375 1376 1377 1378 1379 1380 1381 1382 1383 1384 1385 1386 1387 1388 1389 1390 1391 1392 1393 1394 1395 1396 1397 1398 1399 1400 1401 1402 1403 1404 1405 1406 1407 1408 1409 1410 1411 1412 1413 1414 1415 1416 1417 1418 1419 1420 1421 1422 1423 1424 1425 1426 1427 1428 1429 1430 1431 1432 1433 1434 1435 1436 1437 1438 1439 1440 1441 1442 1443 1444 1445 1446 1447 1448 1449 1450 1451 1452 1453 1454 1455 1456 1457 1458 1459 1460 1461 1462 1463 1464 1465 1466 1467 1468 1469 1470 1471 1472 1473 1474 1475 1476 1477 1478 1479 1480 1481 1482 1483 1484 1485 1486 1487 1488 1489 1490 1491 1492 1493 1494 1495 1496 1497 1498 1499 1500 1501 1502 1503 1504 1505 1506 1507 1508 1509 1510 1511 1512 1513 1514 1515 1516 1517 1518 1519 1520 1521 1522 1523 1524 1525 1526 1527 1528 1529 1530 1531 1532 1533 1534 1535 1536 1537 1538 1539 1540 1541 1542 1543 1544 1545 1546 1547 1548 1549 1550 1551 1552 1553 1554 1555 1556 1557 1558 1559 1560 1561 1562 1563 1564 1565 1566 1567 1568 1569 1570 1571 1572 1573 1574 1575 1576 1577 1578 1579 1580 1581 1582 1583 1584 1585 1586 1587 1588 1589 1590 1591 1592 1593 1594 1595 1596 1597 1598 1599 1600 1601 1602 1603 1604 1605 1606 1607 1608 1609 1610 1611 1612 1613 1614 1615 1616 1617 1618 1619 1620 1621 1622 1623 1624 1625 1626 1627 1628 1629 1630 1631 1632 1633 1634 1635 1636 1637 1638 1639 1640 1641 1642 1643 1644 1645 1646 1647 1648 1649 1650 1651 1652 1653 1654 1655 1656 1657 1658 1659 1660 1661 1662 1663 1664 1665 1666 1667 1668 1669 1670 1671 1672 1673 1674 1675 1676 1677 1678 1679 1680 1681 1682 1683 1684 1685 1686 1687 1688 1689 1690 1691 1692 1693 1694 1695 1696 1697 1698 1699 1700 1701 1702 1703 1704 1705 1706 1707 1708 1709 1710 1711 1712 1713 1714 1715 1716 1717 1718 1719 1720 1721 1722 1723 1724 1725 1726 1727 1728 1729 1730 1731 1732 1733 1734 1735 1736 1737 1738 1739 1740 1741 1742 1743 1744 1745 1746 1747 1748 1749 1750 1751 1752 1753 1754 1755 1756 1757 1758 1759 1760 1761 1762 1763 1764 1765 1766 1767 1768 1769 1770 1771 1772 1773 1774 1775 1776 1777 1778 1779 1780 1781 1782 1783 1784 1785 1786 1787 1788 1789 1790 1791 1792 1793 1794 1795 1796 1797 1798 1799 1800 1801 1802 1803 1804 1805 1806 1807 1808 1809 1810 1811 1812 1813 1814 1815 1816 1817 1818 1819 1820 1821 1822 1823 1824 1825 1826 1827 1828 1829 1830 1831 1832 1833 1834 1835 1836 1837 1838 1839 1840 1841 1842 1843 1844 1845 1846 1847 1848 1849 1850 1851 1852 1853 1854 1855 1856 1857 1858 1859 1860 1861 1862 1863 1864 1865 1866 1867 1868 1869 1870 1871 1872 1873 1874 1875 1876 1877 1878 1879 1880 1881 1882 1883 1884 1885 1886 1887 1888 1889 1890 1891 1892 1893 1894 1895 1896 1897 1898 1899 1900 1901 1902 1903 1904 1905 1906 1907 1908 1909 1910 1911 1912 1913 1914 1915 1916 1917 1918 1919 1920 1921 1922 1923 1924 1925 1926 1927 1928 1929 1930 1931 1932 1933 1934 1935 1936 1937 1938 1939 1940 1941 1942 1943 1944 1945 1946 1947 1948 1949 1950 1951 1952 1953 1954 1955 1956 1957 1958 1959 1960 1961 1962 1963 1964 1965 1966 1967 1968 1969 1970 1971 1972 1973 1974 1975 1976 1977 1978 1979 1980 1981 1982 1983 1984 1985 1986 1987 1988 1989 1990 1991 1992 1993 1994 1995 1996 1997 1998 1999 2000 2001 2002 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014 2015 2016 2017 2018 2019 2020 2021 2022 2023 2024 2025 2026 2027 2028 2029 2030 2031 2032 2033 2034 2035 2036 2037 2038 2039 2040 2041 2042 2043 2044 2045 2046 2047 2048 2049 2050 2051 2052 2053 2054 2055 2056 2057 2058 2059 2060 2061 2062 2063 2064 2065 2066 2067 2068 2069 2070 2071 2072