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Drank last night, learned from it

Old 11-29-2015, 04:02 PM
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Good point. There is definitely a difference. For me, not drinking was really tough. But sobriety is pretty easy. I don't obsess about alcohol now.

Not drinking is all in your head. Sobriety is in your heart, mind and soul. Sobriety for me took sr, plus face to face interactions with sober people. It took a full life shift. But it's benefitted me so much, I would do it over again.

You can do it too.
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Old 11-29-2015, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by thomas11 View Post
Not sure I understand Dee? I will not question your analysis. After all, you are the one with 8+ years under your belt. I am in no position to question you. Or anyone that has significant sober time under their belt for that matter.
My point was I'm not a psychologist Jeff...and I'm not necessarily 8 times or 8 years smarter than you

That being said...

Originally Posted by thomas11 View Post
My current thought process goes something like this "I need to make the transition from not drinking, to sobriety". I am admittedly in the not drinking stage. And even at that, I drank (3) on Friday.
You actually not in a 'not drinking stage'...you're still in a drinking stage - admittedly at this point a 'drinking far less' stage, but like someone else said volume doesn't matter....a tap is on, whether it's a trickle or a flood.

Recovery is where my alcoholism is inactive.

Drinking is a sign my disease, addiction, whatever you want to call it is still active.

When you can get your head around that, I think you'll really start to go places.

D
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Old 11-29-2015, 04:13 PM
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I came back because I hope it doesn't look like I'm being needlessly hard on you - you have come a long way from where you used to be and I recognise that.
I don't want to discourage you or suck the joy out of your efforts.

but... I think it's fundamental to accept that relapse is a part of addiction, not recovery.

I really think that's an ah-ha moment we all have to have?

D
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Old 11-29-2015, 04:19 PM
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We all approach recovery a bit differently, Jeff, but for me, it involved a shift in perspective, a kind of mental shift. I came to the point of wanting to experience life differently, and I knew that to have a good life, a better life, I'd need to approach it soberly. There was no way I could both drink and live life happily and successfully, and achieve and do the things I wanted.

You seem like a motivated, driven type of person from what I've read of your posts. I don't think you really lack the motivation part. Maybe you lack the confidence or specific tools to carry it through.

Tools can be anything. It's whatever you employ to achieve the desired result, sobriety.

For me, like I said, it was that whole mental shift that happened internally that I used as the catalyst and the motivation to go through with it, to have the faith and confidence that I could indeed live my life as a sober, non-drinking person. And that I must live that way, because drinking was a dead-end street for me.

Giving up drinking will allow you to be so much more. At first it's a slog, but you will get through it. And you will be glad you did
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Old 11-29-2015, 05:06 PM
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Manomanomanoman.....I am getting so much out of this thread! The first thought that floats to the top for me is "acceptance". I have found the key to my sobriety is acceptance that I am an alcoholic and that I cannot drink no matter what. Many have accepted that they are an alcoholic but it can be easy to stumble on the "no matter what" part. This is where I am focusing my recovery efforts right now...on the NO MATTER WHAT.
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Old 11-29-2015, 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Soberpotamus View Post
We all approach recovery a bit differently, Jeff, but for me, it involved a shift in perspective, a kind of mental shift. I came to the point of wanting to experience life differently, and I knew that to have a good life, a better life, I'd need to approach it soberly. There was no way I could both drink and live life happily and successfully, and achieve and do the things I wanted.

You seem like a motivated, driven type of person from what I've read of your posts. I don't think you really lack the motivation part. Maybe you lack the confidence or specific tools to carry it through.

Tools can be anything. It's whatever you employ to achieve the desired result, sobriety.

For me, like I said, it was that whole mental shift that happened internally that I used as the catalyst and the motivation to go through with it, to have the faith and confidence that I could indeed live my life as a sober, non-drinking person. And that I must live that way, because drinking was a dead-end street for me.

Giving up drinking will allow you to be so much more. At first it's a slog, but you will get through it. And you will be glad you did
There is an element of fear at play if I am being honest with myself. That mental shift you speak of has not occurred, also as Dee mentioned there is a part of me that I am fighting. The part that wants me to be like "normal" people. It might be a little part of me, but its a big hurdle to cross. Who doesn't want to be normal? I know I do. The advice and comments in this thread are why I am a member. I learn from it. Its clear I don't know everything there is to know, but I keep reading, and digesting information and advice to the best of my ability. I am somewhat proud that I have made measurable progress. I have ingested alcohol 3 times in roughly 187 days (one drink, one drink, three drinks) When I first joined, I was maybe 50% serious about changing my ways. I knew though, that I could not sustain a lifetime of drinking. And if I did, I would be miserable for the duration of my life. So, I read and learn and try to keep my knife sharp against the disease of alcoholism. I realize that I am not there yet, but I am a lot closer than I was 6 months ago.

If I turn the clock back 7-8 months, I was drinking every weekend, and usually 1-2 weekends a month I was drinking to the point of irresponsible stupidity. In hindsight, the injuries may have been the catalyst I needed, albeit a rather severe one.
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Old 11-29-2015, 05:56 PM
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Yeh, but now your injuries are healing, and you've pulled back from your medication. This is the point when your brain is itching for that tickle that the Oxy and the benzos have been giving you since your accident.

I think you need to double down right now, not give in and go back to where you were. At some point you're going to have to let your brain and body be uncomfortable with no numbing effects from pharmaceuticals or alcohol.

It makes sense that you're trying to recapture the feelings you had. I hope you finally "get" what you're up against. It's a physical need you have created by abusing these substances. It's probably a genetic thing, since your dad got hooked too. The only way out is . . . wait for it. . . continuous abstinence. Then the healing can take place.
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Old 11-29-2015, 06:08 PM
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Well first of all you haven't lost it! Maybe you finally have got it! :-) Sometimes it takes people longer to get with it. I found this is a fairly safe place to admit you're not perfect. Keep one thing in mind the more you drink and the more you slip the more you learn as you said. The dangerous part is that we are in deadly situations when we drink. Use your three drinks as a tool. Memorize how you feel right now and when you want to drink, remember how you reached out and how sane that was
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Old 11-29-2015, 06:28 PM
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That kind of sounded like one of those "harm reduction" posts, Thomas. An awful lot of what I call "drinking math." I used to do that too. If I relapsed I would calculate how many drinks I had had in a specific amount of time, versus when I was at my worst.

It made me feel better and worse at the same time, those calculations...

Several of us have said it in different ways... Acceptance is a huge part of the puzzle. It's like the keystone on the arch. I had to accept that I'm not a normal person, I can't drink and expect my life to be what I want. Drinking turns me into someone I don't like.

I don't really worry about not being normal. Can you think of a single person who is normal in every way? Too tall, too short? Bad ankles? Overbite? The list goes on.

Until I faced, no until I owned the fact that I'm not a normal drinker, I couldn't become a happy non drinker.
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Old 11-29-2015, 07:06 PM
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It took me many many years to get from a not drinking mindset to a sobriety one. I wish I could tell you what changed but I don't know. I just got sick and tired of playing the back and fourth game of having good stretches and bad ones over and over. Trying ways to be normal, moderation, not drinking at all, small amounts here and there. Then wham a binge would happen.

Much easier now that I cut it all off.
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Old 12-03-2015, 08:20 AM
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Hi Thomas .

I sometimes love the ''word play '' like ''comfort '' to ''dis -comfort '' or Alcoholism is a disease and at times we have '' dis - ease '' take care .

Stevie
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Old 12-03-2015, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by thomas11 View Post
What I learned from it is that it wasn't the magic elixir that we somehow convince ourselves it is. Its was the same crappy substance.
This comment has been nagging at me since I read it.

Many of your previous comments, including some that were written after your relapses and the disabling accident that came afterwards, and when you've offered your experience to other people, make it clear that you already knew this.

My concern is that -- and one of the reasons why I asked what you learned from your lapse in the first place -- is that, if you already knew that alcohol is not a "magic elixir" before you had your three drinks, then what is it that you're not looking at, that you're avoiding? What is it that brings you back to drinking, whether it's a couple of sips, a few drinks, or any other amounts of alcohol?

When I was drinking, particularly near the end, and continuing in very early sobriety, I had an appallingly boundless capacity for self-deception which often lead to acts of bad faith.

"My (X)GF won't mind if I continue to drink, as long as it doesn't get out of hand." "No one really cares if I come in late for work, or don't come in at all. I've already told them that I'm going through a rough time (another lie)." "I really don't need to get my work done by Monday." "It's both important and necessary for me to lie to other people so that they won't catch on to me."

'Denial' is often a misattribution. In a technical sense, it is a psychological defense that is considered to be either largely or wholly unconscious. When I know what drinking can do to me, and I drink anyway, this is not truly denial, but bad faith. To be clear, I knew that my lies were lies in the service of protecting myself against unwanted realities. I knew that I was lying to myself, and went ahead and did what I wanted to do and not what some conveniently dispossessed part of me "told me" to do. There was no invisible hand or disembodied voice at work.

Being honest, for me, is not an activity, a strategy or a thought. It is not, strictly speaking, "telling the truth;" it is a way of being. It's the way in which I choose to engage the real world as it presents itself, and not a means of hiding from that which I either fear or loathe. We are all naturally predisposed to deception, if only because to do so has survival value, as is demonstrated in our and in other species when their members camouflage themselves in order to avoid harm or death. Or, briefly, to get what we want.

Sobriety, as well, is not for me an activity, a thought or a strategy (though there is, clearly, strategic and tactical planning involved, particularly early on). It's a way of being in the world that affords me multiple and continuous opportunities to choose honesty or deception. People often ask about improving self-esteem and accountability, and about reducing anxiety and worry. Engaging ourselves, our lives and the world as they present themselves is one of the ways out of the considerable damage that we've done, but a road that is also less traveled. When we ask why it is that we cannot achieve sobriety, we benefit from examining the ways in which we deceive ourselves around what living an authentic life truly is. When we don't like the truth, we either retreat or we continue to struggle, retreating representing a life of despair, and no decision at all.

There is a saying a martial arts that a black belt is a white belt that never gave up, the black belt being the most difficult level to achieve, which includes years of rigorous training, pain, and pushing ourselves beyond our self-ordained limitations. Human beings simply are incapable of doing the amazing things that you can find in videos on martial arts. One of my sensei's senseis is now in his seventies. He can still do push-ups on his index fingers alone, and he remains a very dangerous person if circumstances require it.

There is also a saying that has been long and widely misattributed to Charles Darwin that says that it's not the strongest or the smartest who survive, but those who are able to adapt to change. There are fewer changes and requisite adaptations in life that reach the magnitude of living sober after years of active alcoholism.

If I continue to do throughout my life the same things that have made me unhappy, that have lead to isolation in the extreme, that have allowed me the dubious safety of failure, then something else needs to be done. When I climb into the web, it does me no good to blame the spider.
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Old 12-03-2015, 10:50 AM
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A lot of clarity there, Endgame. Thank you.
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Old 12-03-2015, 11:00 AM
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I have nothing to add... thanks EGNYC
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Old 12-03-2015, 11:42 AM
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Just a quick line to say I'm learning so much from this thread. Thank you everyone.

I'm in awe of the wisdom and insight from people here.

I really hope you find your way Thomas.

I really like this too!

...........

Originally Posted by wehav2day View Post

Not drinking is all in your head. Sobriety is in your heart, mind and soul
Thank you Wehav2day
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Old 12-03-2015, 11:56 AM
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Hi Endgame .

Early into alcoholic drinking and after a period of abstinence and after much rationalizing and justifications my head wanting to escape the ''humdrum '' and somewhat boring existence of normality I chased excitement and decided to lift a drink , my mindset was remembering the ''warm glow '' and the feeling of ''ease and comfort '' that booze had given me very early on in my drinking experience . Very shortly usually after a blackout which resulted from lifting that first drink again and experiencing the ''same old same old '' and back on the merry go round of repetitive behavior I thought of quitting again as alcohol that once was ''my only friend '' was now repeatedly letting me down . Compulsion ,obsession call it what you like ? .

Like a heroin addict who's first '' hit '' is an incredible experience and sadly they continue to '' chase the dragon '' never ever to experience that first sensation , my brain remembered alcohol in the same fashion , this time WILL be different etc etc etc . Take care .

Regards
Stevie sober since 14 03 2006 .
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