Reaching out - SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information

steamvessel · 08-18-2009, 04:32 PM

I just wanted to make some contact, I have been having a really hard time. I am really ashamed to admit that I have once again relapsed. I really feel like two people, and I just don't get it. I have been extremely stressed out, my car broke down again yesterday for the second time in two weeks and has cost me over $600 in repairs, which unemployment hardly compensates for. I am extremely lucky to be in a position where I can even be posting. The continuous baggage and daily struggle just to get anywhere, do anything is dragging me down. I am constantly trying to not drink, then it's always the Saturday night at home with my brother and my defenses go. "It's just beer, I don't have to go anywhere"... He even peer pressures me and I find myself too weak to say no. I realize this is my problem, not his. I will have a talk to him about it. I don't come from a family with real open communication, so it would be really hard to talk to him about my alcohol problem, especially since we have a Grandad that died from alcoholism. Today was one of the most hellish days I have ever had, I can't tell you how far this drug will drag you down. I am completely done, I consider myself lucky to be able to post this and still have what I do have in this world. I was watching Lord Of The Rings Trilogy over the weekend, and this last drinking episode reminded me of Gollum or Phroto looking into the ring and seeing the terror, and just so badly wanting it to be over. That's where I am right now, I just want so badly to be sober and to just have some peace of mind.

I am practicing "mindfulness" with my therapist and am awaiting an audio CD in the mail. What I do know of it seems to resonate with me. What I am going to do at this moment is draw a curtain from the past and do my best to not focus so much on all of my issues, drawbacks, etc... and just work with myself on small things, one at a time. Slowly building momentum, like gently teaching an infant to crawl. This is the only way for me right now, I am running into mental walls left and right. I've just got to feel some sort of peace, I really feel like I am going out of my mind, but if I don't take some action that will at least lead me to sobriety, I don't know how I will get myself out of this rut.

gneiss · 08-18-2009, 04:55 PM

*hugs*

Steamvessel, you are not the first around here to relapse. Just keep working on it. I've relapsed about 6 times and always feel like the next one is just around the corner if I'm not careful. It gets better though.

Interesting that the first time I watched LotR when I started trying to sober up, I saw the addiction aspects of the ring, too. "What business is it of yours what I do with my own things?" "It's my precious." "Gollum hates and loves the ring as he hates and loves himself." And then the fact that every time Frodo wears the ring his attachment to it becomes stronger, it's harder to resist, and he wants to put it on again. Sounds like dope to me.

You are right that your alcohol use is your problem, not your brother's. But if he's pressuring you to drink he is part of your problem. I take it you live with him. The fact that he's pressuring you to drink kind of implies he is not comfortable with the amount of alcohol he consumes, so maybe both of you have a problem.

Why feel pressured by your brother though? Peer pressure works because we are afraid that the group will kick us out; he won't stop being your brother. And with someone who won't support you in healthy changes to your life I wonder how much you need him anyway. You have to live your life, be responsible for your actions. You should talk to him sooner rather than later. Perhaps he just doesn't understand that you MUST stop. Maybe he's trying to cover up his own issues by having you as a drinking buddy. I don't know, just tossing out ideas. Whatever it is, if it doesn't change after you talk to him you may have to just man up and not kick it with him anymore. I don't even talk to my sister if I can avoid it because she just makes me want to drink. And guess what? I don't miss her. It took not being around her to realize how much of a black hole she was for my energy. You have to make the right choice for yourself, bottom line.

Good luck, dude. Keep posting!

windysan · 08-18-2009, 05:52 PM

hang in there, man. don't drink...don't do dope.

Bamboozle · 08-18-2009, 06:06 PM

Hey, steam.

I'm supposed to be practicing mindfullness as well...I got a lot of homework to do the last session.

I haven't tried it yet. I think I'll start it tomorrow...I have nowhere to be or any other obligations so I can take my time, try it, and think about how I'm going to do it while I'm at work and whatnot.

Hang in there.

desertdonna · 08-18-2009, 07:45 PM

Hey Steam,

I don't post very often anymore, and only check in once in awhile. I'm so sorry you're struggling so much. I've stared into the abyss myself and only had it reflected back to me. It's not fun at all.

I ran across this site not very long ago; it is a free online course in CBT. Some of it is very simplistic, but I found it really helpful and it can be an adjunct to therapy. There are many worksheets that can be downloaded and printed. Perhaps it will give you some relief.

livinglifetothefull . com

It's amazing that I've struggled so much this past year myself with one kind of hell after another. At least I'm still sober...12 months and counting. Anxiety and depression are thieves, too. They just don't come in a bottle or capsule.

You can get to the other side. We all can.

Hang in there. Keep posting, and keep reaching out. Isolation is our worst enemy.

Good thoughts and many hugs,

Donna

steamvessel · 08-18-2009, 10:10 PM

Thanks, I really like this board, this section particularly. Posting here daily and being honest is a big deal for me, it's what worked for me the first time. So that's what I am going to do, be as honest as possible and start again. I am feeling motivated, it's funny when you kind of know when your time is, and when you know you should just do it. When I found SR, I found it because I wanted sobriety bad but couldn't attain it. Lately I have been feeling like I need sobriety, but it isn't something that I want. I know it can't be all rosey like that, but I think by feeling as low as I did recently that it brought me back to that truth, that I not only need to quit drinking, I want to quit drinking, and I'd be a damn fool not to quit. I want to start out fresh, not complicate things, that is what works for me. I really feel this is a crucial time for me to sort things out. If I fall again, I will be back, but I really don't intend to do that or want to do that. Thanks again

least · 08-19-2009, 05:50 PM

I'm sorry you're having such a rough time SV. I've been living in my own hell lately and there seems to be no relief in sight. I WAS posting on a thread in Daily Support but due to being ignored I'll not post there again. I'm not part of their "god" beliefs, no matter how hard I try to believe in God. I'll just stick to this forum where I know I'll be welcomed and not ignored.

I'm struggling too with wanting to drink. My life is full of sh!t and it's hard to deal with it sober. I'm sick of feeling my feelings and only want to be numb to it all. Facing all that sh!t means having to acknowledge my shortcomings and I'm not ready to face all that.

in the meantime I'm just crawling thru each horrible day waiting for bedtime and the sweet release of a few hours of sleep.

It's taking all my willpower not to drink over this but I'm making it so far... but it's only a matter of time before I cave in to being numb. I don't want to feel anything anymore. I know this isn't possible, but I crave it all the same. I just want to be numb and unaware.

**Dee74** · 08-19-2009, 06:14 PM

I'm sorry it's such a struggle least.

It;s hard to face life sober - we do feel everything that much the greater - and we are presented time and time again with our shortcomings - but that's also the opportunity to work on ourselves.

Don't deny yourself that. No-one is a finished product.

Don't give up either - remember how far you've come....wanting to be numb and run away and hide are red flags to look for, so be on your guard.

D

steamvessel · 08-19-2009, 11:46 PM

I also believe when we get better at things, we have a tendency to look at the downside, to criticize and self-analyze, since we have come so far we feel like there should be an award, or we should be something by now. Unfortunately sobriety isn't this, it is an opportunity to achieve things, but it's not always about achievement for me. I know what my problem is, it's that at my core I feel like something is wrong with me. It's a childhood thing, I don't know if I can correct it at this stage in the game, but I have noticed improvements. The other thing I notice as I get older is that all these other perfect people are really not so perfect either, life is a struggle for most it seems to me. I guess what I am saying is that even though it is hard, I prefer to not be numb. I can live with my shortcomings most times, but I can't live with myself when I am drinking.

Bamboozle · 08-20-2009, 02:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by least

I'll just stick to this forum where I know I'll be welcomed and not ignored.

(((least)))

stone · 08-20-2009, 02:48 AM

Hi steam, mindfulness has been the best thing I ever found, it is the main thing in Buddhism, Eckhart Tolle talks about it (though he calls it "being in the now") and Jon Kabat-Zinn is it's main secular advocate (he does it in a medical setting).

I would really recommend Tolle for the more spiritual approach and Kabat-Zinn for the more secular approach.

I have been trying to meditate each day too, it is like mindfulness in a quiet setting which is good practice for doing it in all settings.

steamvessel · 08-20-2009, 11:44 AM

Yeah, as my therapist said this is a more humane approach, self-help CBT feels like censorship for me, it worked in the beginning because it was new and I thought it would have a long term impact. But it gets old telling yourself that your daily interpretation of events are irrational, every day, for several years. Mindfullness seems like a way of taking it all in the way I want to, but really focusing on my reactions to the events. I haven't started yet, I am still waiting for my CD in the mail

sfgirl · 08-21-2009, 05:35 PM

this is a really good book about mindfulness and recovery:

Mindful Recovery: A Spiritual Path ... - Google Books

urge surfing is probably a particularly good thing to practice since you are struggling with intermittent relapses:

Mindfulness

and I have a question which might seem strange but do you actively try really hard to get rid of whatever you feel is so wrong with you at your core or do actively try to figure it out? Or have you just accepted that feeling?

I ask this because I think I used to have a similar feeling, mine wasn't necessarily that something was wrong with me as that I had a void. However, I was always trying really hard to fix this void. One day, I gave up and stopped trying (surrendered to what, whom, or how, no idea— actually I think I just gave up trying to control reality). The irony was that when I gave up that is when something filled the void.

steamvessel · 08-23-2009, 01:02 PM

I think I know what you are getting at, I think I have always kind of traveled in the dark hoping I could fix this void. But recently, I am noticing that using a broken brain to think through my problems is kind of a bad idea. I am blind in a sense, so I need to use others as my guidance feedback mechanism, which is hard to do because real rejection is inevitable. It is with experience and getting myself out there and used to real rejection that is pushing me ahead right now. I've kind of softened my sensitivity to certain things by conditioning myself to do just that. I know this is confusing. What I am trying to say is that I practice a lot of blind faith when it comes to my shortcomings, I'm not willing to just let what is in my head keep me from moving forward. It is the moving forward that actually gives me the information that I need, and yes it starts to fill the void. Or I should say exposes the void as irrational thinking.

HuskyPup · 08-25-2009, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steamvessel

...CBT feels like censorship for me, it worked in the beginning because it was new and I thought it would have a long term impact. But it gets old telling yourself that your daily interpretation of events are irrational, every day, for several years. :

I had this exact same experience.

I have never been the biggest fan of the cognitive approach, seems mainly to skim the surface. I wish I could afford a shrink again, especially one familiar with Jung, Transactional Analysis, Gestalt, RP............hard to find a good therapist, and I have some I loved and many who were as effective as cinderblocks.

But have been suffering deeply inside, wanting and wishing I had more time to do things that were relaxing, yet so many old medical, dental bills from the years of no insurance, seems to never end the money going out, the wages garnished.....even stopping drinking, I am still broke beyond broke, the difference in savings seems like a penny in the grand canyon, and has ceased to be any motivation. Fells better to drink if I have to work so much, or such has bee n the fall-out.

Well, hi and a similarly struggling welcome.

I hear a lot about mindfulness, and have some idea of what it is. But what is it??!! I am curious how it helps, how it's done, and how it reconciles the long shadow of the past, the way the past has shaped the present person, and the way that person is in the present, perceiving, shaped as they have been and continues to be.

HP

littlefish · 08-30-2009, 09:41 PM

Steam: hang in there. You are going through what a lot of us go through:

Quote:

I know what my problem is, it's that at my core I feel like something is wrong with me.

Recovery showed me that there is something wrong with me, and facing what is wrong with me was frightening but necessary for me to heal.

Quote:

It's a childhood thing, I don't know if I can correct it at this stage in the game, but I have noticed improvements.

Same here! My childhood was hellish and I denied the pain of it for most of my life. I think I can correct it even though it's not going to be easy.

Quote:

The other thing I notice as I get older is that all these other perfect people are really not so perfect either, life is a struggle for most it seems to me. I guess what I am saying is that even though it is hard, I prefer to not be numb. I can live with my shortcomings most times, but I can't live with myself when I am drinking.

My feelings exactly.
You aren't alone. Many of us have these same thoughts and feelings.
Keep coming back and keep sharing these thoughts with us!

tropicalwife · 08-31-2009, 06:48 PM

i feel where your at- me too and i am not sure how to deal with this
what i do know is my problem only has 2 endings-jail or death because i will push it that far because i love it so much- it feels so good and hurts so bad-
i have 2 kids- i have a very good husband- all agree i am a nice, respectable person and good mother. DO THEY EVEN SEE ME?? DO THEY HAVE A CLUE HOW MUCH I HAVE SHAMED MYSELF? NO NO NO-

I am here, somebody please hear my truth.
I

OceanBound · 08-31-2009, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tropicalwife

i feel where your at- me too and i am not sure how to deal with this
what i do know is my problem only has 2 endings-jail or death because i will push it that far because i love it so much- it feels so good and hurts so bad-
i have 2 kids- i have a very good husband- all agree i am a nice, respectable person and good mother. DO THEY EVEN SEE ME?? DO THEY HAVE A CLUE HOW MUCH I HAVE SHAMED MYSELF? NO NO NO-

I am here, somebody please hear my truth.
I

tropicalwife, welcome to SR! You can find a wealth of information and a great support network if you stick around. And most importantly, people understand what you are going thru. You are not alone! You can post in the newcomers section, it gets the most traffic. Or here, among the heretics.

Steam, hang in there! You were one of the first people who welcomed me to SR and your support helped me a lot. I am going thru a rough time too. Relapsed, sick of it, can't seem to stop. But I'm still here.

OB

steamvessel · 08-31-2009, 10:16 PM

Thanks all. I got the mindfulness CD, wow that's a different approach. I am finding it refreshing, but it is taking some used to. I have been so accustomed to fighting my whole life, for good or bad. Fighting for good grades, fighting for good jobs, fighting for my self-esteem. Winning some and losing some. I am so used to this battle in my head, or proving myself. Even cognitive therapy is kind of a battle, between your rational mind and your self critic. The critic is winning recently, and I haden't been able to put up a fight, so I stopped. This is a totally different approach, it is just being and being aware of what you are doing. I am not used to tailoring back, or to be "non-striving", but I have to tell you after doing some of these meditations, it really kind of makes sense. I don't think at this point it can cool me down and I have a hard time taking it seriously when I am going through real stuff, but this is possibly because it is so new to me. I really like that I can be myself, even my martyr self! Because you know what, that is actually who I am. But being aware of the thoughts and not necessarily having to react is a big thing. I am thinking about ordering some anti-depressants online as another measure. I have hit a roadblock trying to get any sort of appointment for them, and I have tried several sources.

sfgirl · 08-31-2009, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steamvessel

Thanks all. I got the mindfulness CD, wow that's a different approach. I am finding it refreshing, but it is taking some used to. I have been so accustomed to fighting my whole life, for good or bad. Fighting for good grades, fighting for good jobs, fighting for my self-esteem. Winning some and losing some. I am so used to this battle in my head, or proving myself. Even cognitive therapy is kind of a battle, between your rational mind and your self critic. The critic is winning recently, and I haden't been able to put up a fight, so I stopped. This is a totally different approach, it is just being and being aware of what you are doing. I am not used to tailoring back, or to be "non-striving", but I have to tell you after doing some of these meditations, it really kind of makes sense. I don't think at this point it can cool me down and I have a hard time taking it seriously when I am going through real stuff, but this is possibly because it is so new to me. I really like that I can be myself, even my martyr self! Because you know what, that is actually who I am. But being aware of the thoughts and not necessarily having to react is a big thing. I am thinking about ordering some anti-depressants online as another measure. I have hit a roadblock trying to get any sort of appointment for them, and I have tried several sources.

Exactly! For me, that basically is what recovery was. It was a major shift from that "striving" mindset to the more mindfulness mindset. It is totally opposite. While "striving" it is like I am not good enough as I am so I am in constant forward motion towards some goal of a different self, with "mindfulness" it is full acceptance of who I am in the present moment and a wonder at who exactly that is and through that wonder and looking deeper change ends up ultimately happening as well as a certain serenity. For me I think it was that shift in thinking that was my surrender. It was a lot of energy to always be trying to better myself. It is a release to just accept myself as I am and then it is a different sort of energy to notice yourself.

This is kind of exactly what my question was about before even though it wasn't really phrased well. But actually "trying hard" for me never worked and was a lot of pain. Giving up was the answer. And if you look at it in terms of acceptance there is just a lot more love in it.

Anyways more incoherent ramblings. A brilliant Zen book is

Everyday Zen by Charlotte Joko-Beck

Title is sort of lame but I am telling you this book is AMAZING

steamvessel · 09-02-2009, 05:29 PM

It's funny, one of the so called guidelines of the CD I got was to not talk about meditation for the first 5 to 10 years, because you get so caught up in the PR of it that you actually aren't focused on meditation. Well, I hope I am not blowing that by posting here. But this might be the therapy I have really been looking for. The non-striving is really the essence of it for me, and the acceptance of the way I am right now. I have never accepted myself, that is my problem. The self-improvement is a way for me to desperately hang on to a different image, a person that I will become or an accumulation of past successes that will paint a picture, an image of myself that is acceptable. This is denial, I really am what I am. My actions are defined by what I believe, and even my interpretations of my actions are defined by my own beliefs about them. I could go on about past mistakes, past successes, times when I have been too selfish, too selfless, I've covered the gamut in terms of my behaviors and personality. I can't wrap it all up in a pretty bow and say I've learned, now I am this so called good person. My mind isn't buying it and hasn't been for a long time. It's all just stuff that I think about. For the most part I try to do good and better for this world, but don't we all?

I guess what I am saying is that mindfullness is teaching me to accept that I am a living, breathing, human being. I don't have to keep putting pressure on myself to become something more than what I am, I don't have to dig to the past for answers. I can simply be what I am, it is quite a relief and as you said SFGirl, really is what self-acceptance and self-love is really about.

***Zencat*** · 09-02-2009, 08:04 PM

I use mindfulness as an experience of my awareness. It helps me be aware of what I'm doing now without examining my past or planning my future, just recognizing whats happen in the now. I bring my full attention to the present and know that this is just how it is, not how I wish it was or wish it wasn't, it just is as it is and that's all right for it to be that way "no matter what".

In my Buddhist practice I can accept my faults or the things that may cause me suffering. I am encouraged to accept my suffering as something that has a deeper meaning. Usually that meaning is caused by craving things to be different that they are. I can honor my struggles by accepting that they are the stuff that has made me who I am. I can also follow the Eight Fold Path as a guide to reducing continued causes for suffering.

scott1959 · 09-02-2009, 08:45 PM

Hello,
I have the same basic problems. Fear for my survival brings me closer to relapsing, SteamVessal. I saw once , "Maslows hierarchy of needs", and think that the basic survival needs have to be met to increase the likelihood of staying sober. Even with this knowledge though, i relapse every six months to a year on average, (with no support). I avoid people who drink and use now, as i tend to fall into agreement with their excuses if i don't.
As much as i hate to admit it, we need face to face support with people who share this problem, get our basic needs met, avoid the drinkers (without abandoning drinking friends and family if possible), get mental help that works, and start a practical, common sense daily practice that we develope through time... speaking only for myself...
Have to go now, am on a library comp., and am running out of time.
....Scott1959....

***Zencat*** · 09-03-2009, 10:00 AM

Welcome scott1959 to SoberRecovery and Secular Connections.

recycle · 09-03-2009, 11:28 AM

Darn it Steam, now that you have talked, we are going to have kick you out of the club

The first rule of mindfulness is that you don’t talk about mindfulness.
The second rule of mindfulness is that you don’t talk about mindfulness.

It is possible to try to move too fast with brain work. Late last winter I was studying and meditating, learning autogenics, self hypnosis, all at the same time. We are talking hours a day, and the addictions fell off me like fall leaves. The epiphanies were coming a mile a minute; I was going to be riffing with Lao Tzu by the end of the year - Real Byron Katie stuff. Of course, the crash was spectacular; in August, I drank just enough to float a canoe. I am back now (I think) and looking for the next step in the adventure.

One other thing, you talk about having a void like it is a bad thing. Voids give things around them shape and texture. Without voids, everything would just be stuff. Often the richness of the stuff around a void, make the void seem larger and darker than they would otherwise be.

Hang in there.

08-18-2009, 04:32 PM	#1 (permalink)
steamvessel Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 977	Reaching out I just wanted to make some contact, I have been having a really hard time. I am really ashamed to admit that I have once again relapsed. I really feel like two people, and I just don't get it. I have been extremely stressed out, my car broke down again yesterday for the second time in two weeks and has cost me over $600 in repairs, which unemployment hardly compensates for. I am extremely lucky to be in a position where I can even be posting. The continuous baggage and daily struggle just to get anywhere, do anything is dragging me down. I am constantly trying to not drink, then it's always the Saturday night at home with my brother and my defenses go. "It's just beer, I don't have to go anywhere"... He even peer pressures me and I find myself too weak to say no. I realize this is my problem, not his. I will have a talk to him about it. I don't come from a family with real open communication, so it would be really hard to talk to him about my alcohol problem, especially since we have a Grandad that died from alcoholism. Today was one of the most hellish days I have ever had, I can't tell you how far this drug will drag you down. I am completely done, I consider myself lucky to be able to post this and still have what I do have in this world. I was watching Lord Of The Rings Trilogy over the weekend, and this last drinking episode reminded me of Gollum or Phroto looking into the ring and seeing the terror, and just so badly wanting it to be over. That's where I am right now, I just want so badly to be sober and to just have some peace of mind. I am practicing "mindfulness" with my therapist and am awaiting an audio CD in the mail. What I do know of it seems to resonate with me. What I am going to do at this moment is draw a curtain from the past and do my best to not focus so much on all of my issues, drawbacks, etc... and just work with myself on small things, one at a time. Slowly building momentum, like gently teaching an infant to crawl. This is the only way for me right now, I am running into mental walls left and right. I've just got to feel some sort of peace, I really feel like I am going out of my mind, but if I don't take some action that will at least lead me to sobriety, I don't know how I will get myself out of this rut. __________________ "We all know grabbing a drink to calm our nerves doesn't really work for us anymore. It always backfires. It can never again work it's old magic. That's not to say this isn't damned hard work." ~ Hevyn

08-18-2009, 04:55 PM	#2 (permalink)
gneiss Have a gneiss day! Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Under immense pressure Posts: 938	hugs Steamvessel, you are not the first around here to relapse. Just keep working on it. I've relapsed about 6 times and always feel like the next one is just around the corner if I'm not careful. It gets better though. Interesting that the first time I watched LotR when I started trying to sober up, I saw the addiction aspects of the ring, too. "What business is it of yours what I do with my own things?" "It's my precious." "Gollum hates and loves the ring as he hates and loves himself." And then the fact that every time Frodo wears the ring his attachment to it becomes stronger, it's harder to resist, and he wants to put it on again. Sounds like dope to me. You are right that your alcohol use is your problem, not your brother's. But if he's pressuring you to drink he is part of your problem. I take it you live with him. The fact that he's pressuring you to drink kind of implies he is not comfortable with the amount of alcohol he consumes, so maybe both of you have a problem. Why feel pressured by your brother though? Peer pressure works because we are afraid that the group will kick us out; he won't stop being your brother. And with someone who won't support you in healthy changes to your life I wonder how much you need him anyway. You have to live your life, be responsible for your actions. You should talk to him sooner rather than later. Perhaps he just doesn't understand that you MUST stop. Maybe he's trying to cover up his own issues by having you as a drinking buddy. I don't know, just tossing out ideas. Whatever it is, if it doesn't change after you talk to him you may have to just man up and not kick it with him anymore. I don't even talk to my sister if I can avoid it because she just makes me want to drink. And guess what? I don't miss her. It took not being around her to realize how much of a black hole she was for my energy. You have to make the right choice for yourself, bottom line. Good luck, dude. Keep posting! __________________ Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds. --Bob Marley, Redemption Song

08-18-2009, 05:52 PM	#3 (permalink)
windysan Big Idiot Man Child Join Date: May 2004 Location: La Posts: 4,934	hang in there, man. don't drink...don't do dope. __________________ ZigZaggin through Weirdland

08-18-2009, 06:06 PM	#4 (permalink)
Bamboozle Watch out...it'll fool ya! Duck Hunt 2 Champion! Alien Rescue Champion! Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Underwater Posts: 3,475 Blog Entries: 12	Hey, steam. I'm supposed to be practicing mindfullness as well...I got a lot of homework to do the last session. I haven't tried it yet. I think I'll start it tomorrow...I have nowhere to be or any other obligations so I can take my time, try it, and think about how I'm going to do it while I'm at work and whatnot. Hang in there. __________________ A strange game. The only winning move is not to play.

08-18-2009, 07:45 PM	#5 (permalink)
desertdonna Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Glitzville Posts: 335	Hey Steam, I don't post very often anymore, and only check in once in awhile. I'm so sorry you're struggling so much. I've stared into the abyss myself and only had it reflected back to me. It's not fun at all. I ran across this site not very long ago; it is a free online course in CBT. Some of it is very simplistic, but I found it really helpful and it can be an adjunct to therapy. There are many worksheets that can be downloaded and printed. Perhaps it will give you some relief. livinglifetothefull . com It's amazing that I've struggled so much this past year myself with one kind of hell after another. At least I'm still sober...12 months and counting. Anxiety and depression are thieves, too. They just don't come in a bottle or capsule. You can get to the other side. We all can. Hang in there. Keep posting, and keep reaching out. Isolation is our worst enemy. Good thoughts and many hugs, Donna __________________ Peace doesn't require two people; it requires only one. It has to be you. The problem begins and ends there. Byron Katie

08-18-2009, 10:10 PM	#6 (permalink)
steamvessel Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 977	Thanks, I really like this board, this section particularly. Posting here daily and being honest is a big deal for me, it's what worked for me the first time. So that's what I am going to do, be as honest as possible and start again. I am feeling motivated, it's funny when you kind of know when your time is, and when you know you should just do it. When I found SR, I found it because I wanted sobriety bad but couldn't attain it. Lately I have been feeling like I need sobriety, but it isn't something that I want. I know it can't be all rosey like that, but I think by feeling as low as I did recently that it brought me back to that truth, that I not only need to quit drinking, I want to quit drinking, and I'd be a damn fool not to quit. I want to start out fresh, not complicate things, that is what works for me. I really feel this is a crucial time for me to sort things out. If I fall again, I will be back, but I really don't intend to do that or want to do that. Thanks again __________________ "We all know grabbing a drink to calm our nerves doesn't really work for us anymore. It always backfires. It can never again work it's old magic. That's not to say this isn't damned hard work." ~ Hevyn

08-19-2009, 05:50 PM	#7 (permalink)
least recovering Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: eastern USA Posts: 9,942 Blog Entries: 14	I'm sorry you're having such a rough time SV. I've been living in my own hell lately and there seems to be no relief in sight. I WAS posting on a thread in Daily Support but due to being ignored I'll not post there again. I'm not part of their "god" beliefs, no matter how hard I try to believe in God. I'll just stick to this forum where I know I'll be welcomed and not ignored. I'm struggling too with wanting to drink. My life is full of sh!t and it's hard to deal with it sober. I'm sick of feeling my feelings and only want to be numb to it all. Facing all that sh!t means having to acknowledge my shortcomings and I'm not ready to face all that. in the meantime I'm just crawling thru each horrible day waiting for bedtime and the sweet release of a few hours of sleep. It's taking all my willpower not to drink over this but I'm making it so far... but it's only a matter of time before I cave in to being numb. I don't want to feel anything anymore. I know this isn't possible, but I crave it all the same. I just want to be numb and unaware. __________________ I'd rather live in my van with my dogs than live in a mansion without them. Dogs may not be our whole lives, but they make our lives whole. Plus que je connais les hommes, plus j'aime mon chien. (The more I know mankind, the more I love my dog)

08-19-2009, 06:14 PM	#8 (permalink)
Dee74 Forum Leader Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: South Seas Posts: 14,660	I'm sorry it's such a struggle least. It;s hard to face life sober - we do feel everything that much the greater - and we are presented time and time again with our shortcomings - but that's also the opportunity to work on ourselves. Don't deny yourself that. No-one is a finished product. Don't give up either - remember how far you've come....wanting to be numb and run away and hide are red flags to look for, so be on your guard. D __________________ May you trust God that you are exactly where you are meant to be. May you not forget the infinite possibilities that are born of faith. May you use those gifts that you have received and pass on the love that has been given to you.

08-19-2009, 11:46 PM	#9 (permalink)
steamvessel Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 977	I also believe when we get better at things, we have a tendency to look at the downside, to criticize and self-analyze, since we have come so far we feel like there should be an award, or we should be something by now. Unfortunately sobriety isn't this, it is an opportunity to achieve things, but it's not always about achievement for me. I know what my problem is, it's that at my core I feel like something is wrong with me. It's a childhood thing, I don't know if I can correct it at this stage in the game, but I have noticed improvements. The other thing I notice as I get older is that all these other perfect people are really not so perfect either, life is a struggle for most it seems to me. I guess what I am saying is that even though it is hard, I prefer to not be numb. I can live with my shortcomings most times, but I can't live with myself when I am drinking. __________________ "We all know grabbing a drink to calm our nerves doesn't really work for us anymore. It always backfires. It can never again work it's old magic. That's not to say this isn't damned hard work." ~ Hevyn

08-20-2009, 02:48 AM	#11 (permalink)
stone Member Moon Lander Champion! Shuffle The Penguin Champion! Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: UK Posts: 18,236	Hi steam, mindfulness has been the best thing I ever found, it is the main thing in Buddhism, Eckhart Tolle talks about it (though he calls it "being in the now") and Jon Kabat-Zinn is it's main secular advocate (he does it in a medical setting). I would really recommend Tolle for the more spiritual approach and Kabat-Zinn for the more secular approach. I have been trying to meditate each day too, it is like mindfulness in a quiet setting which is good practice for doing it in all settings. __________________ . As from a fire aflame thousands of sparks come forth, even so from the Creator an infinity of beings have life and to him return again. -- Maitri Upanishads

08-20-2009, 11:44 AM	#12 (permalink)
steamvessel Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 977	Yeah, as my therapist said this is a more humane approach, self-help CBT feels like censorship for me, it worked in the beginning because it was new and I thought it would have a long term impact. But it gets old telling yourself that your daily interpretation of events are irrational, every day, for several years. Mindfullness seems like a way of taking it all in the way I want to, but really focusing on my reactions to the events. I haven't started yet, I am still waiting for my CD in the mail __________________ "We all know grabbing a drink to calm our nerves doesn't really work for us anymore. It always backfires. It can never again work it's old magic. That's not to say this isn't damned hard work." ~ Hevyn

08-21-2009, 05:35 PM	#13 (permalink)
sfgirl Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 678	this is a really good book about mindfulness and recovery: Mindful Recovery: A Spiritual Path ... - Google Books urge surfing is probably a particularly good thing to practice since you are struggling with intermittent relapses: Mindfulness and I have a question which might seem strange but do you actively try really hard to get rid of whatever you feel is so wrong with you at your core or do actively try to figure it out? Or have you just accepted that feeling? I ask this because I think I used to have a similar feeling, mine wasn't necessarily that something was wrong with me as that I had a void. However, I was always trying really hard to fix this void. One day, I gave up and stopped trying (surrendered to what, whom, or how, no idea— actually I think I just gave up trying to control reality). The irony was that when I gave up that is when something filled the void.

08-23-2009, 01:02 PM	#14 (permalink)
steamvessel Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 977	I think I know what you are getting at, I think I have always kind of traveled in the dark hoping I could fix this void. But recently, I am noticing that using a broken brain to think through my problems is kind of a bad idea. I am blind in a sense, so I need to use others as my guidance feedback mechanism, which is hard to do because real rejection is inevitable. It is with experience and getting myself out there and used to real rejection that is pushing me ahead right now. I've kind of softened my sensitivity to certain things by conditioning myself to do just that. I know this is confusing. What I am trying to say is that I practice a lot of blind faith when it comes to my shortcomings, I'm not willing to just let what is in my head keep me from moving forward. It is the moving forward that actually gives me the information that I need, and yes it starts to fill the void. Or I should say exposes the void as irrational thinking. __________________ "We all know grabbing a drink to calm our nerves doesn't really work for us anymore. It always backfires. It can never again work it's old magic. That's not to say this isn't damned hard work." ~ Hevyn

08-31-2009, 06:48 PM	#17 (permalink)
tropicalwife Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 1	i feel where your at- me too and i am not sure how to deal with this what i do know is my problem only has 2 endings-jail or death because i will push it that far because i love it so much- it feels so good and hurts so bad- i have 2 kids- i have a very good husband- all agree i am a nice, respectable person and good mother. DO THEY EVEN SEE ME?? DO THEY HAVE A CLUE HOW MUCH I HAVE SHAMED MYSELF? NO NO NO- I am here, somebody please hear my truth. I

08-31-2009, 10:16 PM	#19 (permalink)
steamvessel Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 977	Thanks all. I got the mindfulness CD, wow that's a different approach. I am finding it refreshing, but it is taking some used to. I have been so accustomed to fighting my whole life, for good or bad. Fighting for good grades, fighting for good jobs, fighting for my self-esteem. Winning some and losing some. I am so used to this battle in my head, or proving myself. Even cognitive therapy is kind of a battle, between your rational mind and your self critic. The critic is winning recently, and I haden't been able to put up a fight, so I stopped. This is a totally different approach, it is just being and being aware of what you are doing. I am not used to tailoring back, or to be "non-striving", but I have to tell you after doing some of these meditations, it really kind of makes sense. I don't think at this point it can cool me down and I have a hard time taking it seriously when I am going through real stuff, but this is possibly because it is so new to me. I really like that I can be myself, even my martyr self! Because you know what, that is actually who I am. But being aware of the thoughts and not necessarily having to react is a big thing. I am thinking about ordering some anti-depressants online as another measure. I have hit a roadblock trying to get any sort of appointment for them, and I have tried several sources. __________________ "We all know grabbing a drink to calm our nerves doesn't really work for us anymore. It always backfires. It can never again work it's old magic. That's not to say this isn't damned hard work." ~ Hevyn

09-02-2009, 05:29 PM	#21 (permalink)
steamvessel Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 977	It's funny, one of the so called guidelines of the CD I got was to not talk about meditation for the first 5 to 10 years, because you get so caught up in the PR of it that you actually aren't focused on meditation. Well, I hope I am not blowing that by posting here. But this might be the therapy I have really been looking for. The non-striving is really the essence of it for me, and the acceptance of the way I am right now. I have never accepted myself, that is my problem. The self-improvement is a way for me to desperately hang on to a different image, a person that I will become or an accumulation of past successes that will paint a picture, an image of myself that is acceptable. This is denial, I really am what I am. My actions are defined by what I believe, and even my interpretations of my actions are defined by my own beliefs about them. I could go on about past mistakes, past successes, times when I have been too selfish, too selfless, I've covered the gamut in terms of my behaviors and personality. I can't wrap it all up in a pretty bow and say I've learned, now I am this so called good person. My mind isn't buying it and hasn't been for a long time. It's all just stuff that I think about. For the most part I try to do good and better for this world, but don't we all? I guess what I am saying is that mindfullness is teaching me to accept that I am a living, breathing, human being. I don't have to keep putting pressure on myself to become something more than what I am, I don't have to dig to the past for answers. I can simply be what I am, it is quite a relief and as you said SFGirl, really is what self-acceptance and self-love is really about. __________________ "We all know grabbing a drink to calm our nerves doesn't really work for us anymore. It always backfires. It can never again work it's old magic. That's not to say this isn't damned hard work." ~ Hevyn

09-02-2009, 08:04 PM	#22 (permalink)
*Zencat* SR's Secular Greeter Cat. Blitz World War Champion! Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Ventura Co. California USA Posts: 2,522 Blog Entries: 7	I use mindfulness as an experience of my awareness. It helps me be aware of what I'm doing now without examining my past or planning my future, just recognizing whats happen in the now. I bring my full attention to the present and know that this is just how it is, not how I wish it was or wish it wasn't, it just is as it is and that's all right for it to be that way "no matter what". In my Buddhist practice I can accept my faults or the things that may cause me suffering. I am encouraged to accept my suffering as something that has a deeper meaning. Usually that meaning is caused by craving things to be different that they are. I can honor my struggles by accepting that they are the stuff that has made me who I am. I can also follow the Eight Fold Path as a guide to reducing continued causes for suffering. __________________ “Vision without action is a daydream. Action without vision is a nightmare.” -Japanese Proverb

09-02-2009, 08:45 PM	#23 (permalink)
scott1959 Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 1	Hello, I have the same basic problems. Fear for my survival brings me closer to relapsing, SteamVessal. I saw once , "Maslows hierarchy of needs", and think that the basic survival needs have to be met to increase the likelihood of staying sober. Even with this knowledge though, i relapse every six months to a year on average, (with no support). I avoid people who drink and use now, as i tend to fall into agreement with their excuses if i don't. As much as i hate to admit it, we need face to face support with people who share this problem, get our basic needs met, avoid the drinkers (without abandoning drinking friends and family if possible), get mental help that works, and start a practical, common sense daily practice that we develope through time... speaking only for myself... Have to go now, am on a library comp., and am running out of time. ....Scott1959....

09-03-2009, 10:00 AM	#24 (permalink)
*Zencat* SR's Secular Greeter Cat. Blitz World War Champion! Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Ventura Co. California USA Posts: 2,522 Blog Entries: 7	Welcome scott1959 to SoberRecovery and Secular Connections. __________________ “Vision without action is a daydream. Action without vision is a nightmare.” -Japanese Proverb

09-03-2009, 11:28 AM	#25 (permalink)
recycle Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Cascadia Posts: 55	Darn it Steam, now that you have talked, we are going to have kick you out of the club The first rule of mindfulness is that you don’t talk about mindfulness. The second rule of mindfulness is that you don’t talk about mindfulness. It is possible to try to move too fast with brain work. Late last winter I was studying and meditating, learning autogenics, self hypnosis, all at the same time. We are talking hours a day, and the addictions fell off me like fall leaves. The epiphanies were coming a mile a minute; I was going to be riffing with Lao Tzu by the end of the year - Real Byron Katie stuff. Of course, the crash was spectacular; in August, I drank just enough to float a canoe. I am back now (I think) and looking for the next step in the adventure. One other thing, you talk about having a void like it is a bad thing. Voids give things around them shape and texture. Without voids, everything would just be stuff. Often the richness of the stuff around a void, make the void seem larger and darker than they would otherwise be. Hang in there.

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