Sixty percent of people in recovery do so without using twelve-step groups - SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information

sekular · 02-26-2008, 08:01 AM

Do you know that sixty percent of people in recovery do so in a variety of ways other than twelve-step groups. Some do it cold turkey on their own, some do it through secular groups, some with counsellors and many other ways.

I went to AA for a few years only to feel guilted into believing that twelve-step groups were the only thing that was ever going to keep me sober. Until I actually Googled "alternatives to AA" did I realize there are many other ways and one of them that caught my eye is LifeRing.

Thankfully in Victoria when I approached local mental health and addiction workers as well as doctors, nurses and counsellors a few months ago they were all so happy to hear that an alternative choice like LifeRing was available for them to refer clients to.

Victoria has a large population of people who utilize addiction resources and having LifeRing meetings going here is a huge benefit for this who do not care for the twelve-step approach.

Jfanagle · 02-26-2008, 11:55 AM

I am always interested in such data. Would you mind supplying the source of this data? It is a perpetual question that arises and it would be of great help if the empirical data was able to be cited.

The statement "Do you know that sixty percent of people in recovery do so in a variety of ways other than twelve-step groups." doesn't illuminate what "in recovery" means? Is that any particular length of sober time, or simply those who have entered into a recovery process?

Please understand that I am not being argumentative, simply interested in the definition of "in recovery."

Thanks,

Jon

sekular · 02-26-2008, 02:54 PM

Hi Jon,

I could have been more clear and I apologize, and thanks for asking. Because I have not made at least 15 posts on this forum I am not allowed to post links on here however there is a way to locate this stat that was written in an AA Grapevine from 2001.

Google LifeRing, go to our website and click on the media link. Scroll down until you get to "The Best-kept Lifestyle Secret" and you will locate the stat and its reference.

I hope this helps and if you could be so kind as to post the link from our site for others to see I would be grateful.

Thanks.

PaperDolls · 02-26-2008, 02:57 PM

Here's a linkt to The Best-kept Lifestyle Secret

sekular · 02-26-2008, 03:18 PM

Thanks PaperDolls! How did you post a title as a link like you did? I can't PM and ask you as I have not made five posts yet but would really appreciate the techno answer.

Thanks.

PaperDolls · 02-26-2008, 03:36 PM

Not a problem at all.

To link to a word(s).
Type the word then highlight it.
Click the insert link button.
Type or paste the link in the pop-up box.
Click ok.

Jfanagle · 02-26-2008, 04:25 PM

LR,

I did read the site information as well as peruse the site overall. The sourcing and assumptions certainly seem to bear out the statement and while the sources are more editorial than clean statistical studies, they don't warrant any real argument that I can muster.

I am impressed with Lifering and what I perceive to be the organization's goals and structure. There doesn't seem to be the presence of "AA bashing" that other schools of approach find necessary to compare their dogma with AA's concepts.

I got sober 8+ years ago and stay sober with the use of AA and its tools. I like to think that I am somewhat lucid regarding the "real" world that exists outside the walls of an AA meeting and as such use AA to further my sober lifestyle, in conjuction with self will and self discipline. I don't and have never felt that the higher power concept need relieve me of my active part in my own life anymore than I think that a computer relieves me of the responsibility of sensible and thoughtful input in order to receive the same sort of output.

That being said I do applaud the idea of Lifering allowing participation by those of us who found "our answers" in AA. I would very much like to attend a meeting in Southern California when they are available. I only found a "coming soon" site in San Diego. If there are others I would be grateful for information. Sobriety like oxygen is vital to us alcoholics and I suggest it's ingestion by any means available.

Thanks for your thoughts and information and please IM me if you care to.

Thanks again,

Jon

zencat · 02-27-2008, 07:20 PM

The best educated guess at recovery percentage rates I have heard came from a professor that structured and taught the addiction disorder studies program at college was: one third get better, one third stay about the same and one third get worse.

toad · 02-28-2008, 07:31 PM

One of AA's non-alcoholic trustee's stated in the Grapevine a couple of years ago the same fact. That only 40% of alcoholics that get sober use AA.

One of many reasons I choose to stay in AA is because by working the 12 steps, I am clearing away the wreckage of my past....and gaining some serenity through the process.

I have seen many "dry alcoholics" that are still "restless, irritable, and discontented."

I choose the easier softer way...........AA

zencat · 02-29-2008, 03:59 PM

My understanding is, as the NA program states: “for the therapeutic value of one addict helping another is without parallel.“ To me this means the God stuff can be replaced with therapeutic tools and recovery happens. At least this is how it is happening for me. I have friends in the AA/NA program that understand where I’m coming from and work with me on my terms.

**best** · 02-29-2008, 06:01 PM

I would fall into that 60% group if the right questions were asked of me but I can not say I am where I am at without using the steps of recovery that are found in AA and NA.
Indirectly it was what AA teaches that brought me to a alcohol free way of life.
It took me reading and studying the bible to find the other parts of a sober life that were needed but after finding them and learning what the 12 steps are... I realized that I worked the 12 steps as I found them in the bible.
What I like about AA is they lay out what works in a nice neat order. Only by God's grace and guidance did I find what was needed for me. It took me about 3 years of bible study to find the answers I needed where as AA meetings could have speeded things up because of the nice neat package they have things set up in. A package of 12 steps.
It was an AA person that shared the hope of recovery with me when I first started to seek answers to my drinking problems.
In that manner..AA was the direct reason I am sober today.

I did not use the program? But I did. I just didn't do it in the manner most others do.

sekular · 03-01-2008, 02:19 PM

I recently signed up to this website and I should not have signed up with the username LifeRing as I do not speak on behalf of the organization nor do I want to.

I am simply a member of LifeRing and I really should have been more aware of what I write when in fact my name is not attached to it.

These thoughts are mine only and I am working with admin to change the username or re-register so that it is only me that is attached to the writings.

I am, of course, happy with what ever mode of recovery is working for anyone. There is no one program that will work for everyone.

Thanks.

toad · 03-01-2008, 03:35 PM

cool...........I thought you were trying to sell something.

PaperDolls · 03-01-2008, 03:46 PM

If you'd like to change your username, you can request it in the Forum Help & Troubleshooting forum. I know they'll be happy to change it for you.

sekular · 03-01-2008, 04:23 PM

I have been in touch with admin and they will be making the change soon.

Toad, sorry if that came across the wrong way.

PaperDolls · 03-01-2008, 04:25 PM

I can't speak for Toad, but i don't think you came off the wrong way.

Sometimes people come here and post links or talk about a recovery program or whatever ..... and it's a scam or they're just trying to make money. I think people were trying to figure you out.

There are quite a few folks here, I believe, who have used lifering to help them with their recovery.

Welcome to SR!

02-26-2008, 08:01 AM	#1 (permalink)
sekular Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 35	Sixty percent of people in recovery do so without using twelve-step groups Do you know that sixty percent of people in recovery do so in a variety of ways other than twelve-step groups. Some do it cold turkey on their own, some do it through secular groups, some with counsellors and many other ways. I went to AA for a few years only to feel guilted into believing that twelve-step groups were the only thing that was ever going to keep me sober. Until I actually Googled "alternatives to AA" did I realize there are many other ways and one of them that caught my eye is LifeRing. Thankfully in Victoria when I approached local mental health and addiction workers as well as doctors, nurses and counsellors a few months ago they were all so happy to hear that an alternative choice like LifeRing was available for them to refer clients to. Victoria has a large population of people who utilize addiction resources and having LifeRing meetings going here is a huge benefit for this who do not care for the twelve-step approach.
sekular Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 35

02-26-2008, 11:55 AM	#2 (permalink)
Jfanagle Another Day in Paradise Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Upland, CA Posts: 443	I am always interested in such data. Would you mind supplying the source of this data? It is a perpetual question that arises and it would be of great help if the empirical data was able to be cited. The statement "Do you know that sixty percent of people in recovery do so in a variety of ways other than twelve-step groups." doesn't illuminate what "in recovery" means? Is that any particular length of sober time, or simply those who have entered into a recovery process? Please understand that I am not being argumentative, simply interested in the definition of "in recovery." Thanks, Jon
	__________________ Indecision may or may not be my problem!

02-26-2008, 02:54 PM	#3 (permalink)
sekular Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 35	Reference to "sixty percent" Hi Jon, I could have been more clear and I apologize, and thanks for asking. Because I have not made at least 15 posts on this forum I am not allowed to post links on here however there is a way to locate this stat that was written in an AA Grapevine from 2001. Google LifeRing, go to our website and click on the media link. Scroll down until you get to "The Best-kept Lifestyle Secret" and you will locate the stat and its reference. I hope this helps and if you could be so kind as to post the link from our site for others to see I would be grateful. Thanks.
sekular Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 35

02-26-2008, 03:18 PM	#5 (permalink)
sekular Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 35	How do you post the title as a link? Thanks PaperDolls! How did you post a title as a link like you did? I can't PM and ask you as I have not made five posts yet but would really appreciate the techno answer. Thanks.
sekular Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 35

02-26-2008, 04:25 PM	#7 (permalink)
Jfanagle Another Day in Paradise Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Upland, CA Posts: 443	LR, I did read the site information as well as peruse the site overall. The sourcing and assumptions certainly seem to bear out the statement and while the sources are more editorial than clean statistical studies, they don't warrant any real argument that I can muster. I am impressed with Lifering and what I perceive to be the organization's goals and structure. There doesn't seem to be the presence of "AA bashing" that other schools of approach find necessary to compare their dogma with AA's concepts. I got sober 8+ years ago and stay sober with the use of AA and its tools. I like to think that I am somewhat lucid regarding the "real" world that exists outside the walls of an AA meeting and as such use AA to further my sober lifestyle, in conjuction with self will and self discipline. I don't and have never felt that the higher power concept need relieve me of my active part in my own life anymore than I think that a computer relieves me of the responsibility of sensible and thoughtful input in order to receive the same sort of output. That being said I do applaud the idea of Lifering allowing participation by those of us who found "our answers" in AA. I would very much like to attend a meeting in Southern California when they are available. I only found a "coming soon" site in San Diego. If there are others I would be grateful for information. Sobriety like oxygen is vital to us alcoholics and I suggest it's ingestion by any means available. Thanks for your thoughts and information and please IM me if you care to. Thanks again, Jon
	__________________ Indecision may or may not be my problem!

02-26-2008, 02:57 PM	#4 (permalink)
PaperDolls Miss Grumpy Pain in the Pants Join Date: May 2004 Location: Midwest Posts: 4,889	Here's a linkt to The Best-kept Lifestyle Secret

02-26-2008, 03:36 PM	#6 (permalink)
PaperDolls Miss Grumpy Pain in the Pants Join Date: May 2004 Location: Midwest Posts: 4,889	Not a problem at all. To link to a word(s). Type the word then highlight it. Click the insert link button. Type or paste the link in the pop-up box. Click ok.

02-27-2008, 07:20 PM	#8 (permalink)
zencat Double Trouble Addict Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Ventura Co. California USA Posts: 678	The best educated guess at recovery percentage rates I have heard came from a professor that structured and taught the addiction disorder studies program at college was: one third get better, one third stay about the same and one third get worse.

02-28-2008, 07:31 PM	#9 (permalink)
toad Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: mountain grove, missouri Posts: 927	One of AA's non-alcoholic trustee's stated in the Grapevine a couple of years ago the same fact. That only 40% of alcoholics that get sober use AA. One of many reasons I choose to stay in AA is because by working the 12 steps, I am clearing away the wreckage of my past....and gaining some serenity through the process. I have seen many "dry alcoholics" that are still "restless, irritable, and discontented." I choose the easier softer way...........AA
	__________________ Tet Vet PGR member 2007 Road King Classic 96 C.I. Six-speed Vivid black God......... Let You........... be enough for me.

02-29-2008, 03:59 PM	#10 (permalink)
zencat Double Trouble Addict Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Ventura Co. California USA Posts: 678	My understanding is, as the NA program states: “for the therapeutic value of one addict helping another is without parallel.“ To me this means the God stuff can be replaced with therapeutic tools and recovery happens. At least this is how it is happening for me. I have friends in the AA/NA program that understand where I’m coming from and work with me on my terms.

02-29-2008, 06:01 PM	#11 (permalink)
best Don't get undies in a bunch Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: South Shore MA Posts: 7,191	I would fall into that 60% group if the right questions were asked of me but I can not say I am where I am at without using the steps of recovery that are found in AA and NA. Indirectly it was what AA teaches that brought me to a alcohol free way of life. It took me reading and studying the bible to find the other parts of a sober life that were needed but after finding them and learning what the 12 steps are... I realized that I worked the 12 steps as I found them in the bible. What I like about AA is they lay out what works in a nice neat order. Only by God's grace and guidance did I find what was needed for me. It took me about 3 years of bible study to find the answers I needed where as AA meetings could have speeded things up because of the nice neat package they have things set up in. A package of 12 steps. It was an AA person that shared the hope of recovery with me when I first started to seek answers to my drinking problems. In that manner..AA was the direct reason I am sober today. I did not use the program? But I did. I just didn't do it in the manner most others do.
	__________________ * I asked God to spare me pain. God said "No", Suffering draws you apart from worldly cares and brings you closer to me. Recovery Related Acronym B. E. S. T. = Been Enjoying Sobriety Today?

03-01-2008, 02:19 PM	#12 (permalink)
sekular Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 35	Just to clarify..... I recently signed up to this website and I should not have signed up with the username LifeRing as I do not speak on behalf of the organization nor do I want to. I am simply a member of LifeRing and I really should have been more aware of what I write when in fact my name is not attached to it. These thoughts are mine only and I am working with admin to change the username or re-register so that it is only me that is attached to the writings. I am, of course, happy with what ever mode of recovery is working for anyone. There is no one program that will work for everyone. Thanks.
sekular Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 35

03-01-2008, 03:35 PM	#13 (permalink)
toad Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: mountain grove, missouri Posts: 927	cool...........I thought you were trying to sell something.
	__________________ Tet Vet PGR member 2007 Road King Classic 96 C.I. Six-speed Vivid black God......... Let You........... be enough for me.

03-01-2008, 03:46 PM	#14 (permalink)
PaperDolls Miss Grumpy Pain in the Pants Join Date: May 2004 Location: Midwest Posts: 4,889	If you'd like to change your username, you can request it in the Forum Help & Troubleshooting forum. I know they'll be happy to change it for you.

03-01-2008, 04:23 PM	#15 (permalink)
sekular Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 35	Already done. I have been in touch with admin and they will be making the change soon. Toad, sorry if that came across the wrong way.
sekular Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 35

03-01-2008, 04:25 PM	#16 (permalink)
PaperDolls Miss Grumpy Pain in the Pants Join Date: May 2004 Location: Midwest Posts: 4,889	I can't speak for Toad, but i don't think you came off the wrong way. Sometimes people come here and post links or talk about a recovery program or whatever ..... and it's a scam or they're just trying to make money. I think people were trying to figure you out. There are quite a few folks here, I believe, who have used lifering to help them with their recovery. Welcome to SR!