I am an expert in things I know nothing about - SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information

MIRecovery · 12-11-2012, 06:40 AM

I am a big fan of AA and AVRT. I have spent a lot of time and effort becoming familiar with both and can speak intelligently about their respect merits (at least from my perspective.) I know very little about SMART and various other methods so I do not comment on them.

Time and time again especially with AA people say, "AA is not for them" but they have never been to a meeting, never read the big book, never had an in-depth discussion with an AA member, never worked the steps, never had a sponsor.

We are dealing with a fatal illness which to me is like saying, " I know nothing about heart disease but diet and exercise is not going to work for me because Aunt Gertrude ran five miles a day and died of a heart attack." Or "My legs hurt when I ran so I stopped running."

AA and AVRT are not the only ways but before you dismiss them or any others do your homework, do intensive research, give them an honest try your very life depends on it.

Logic would dictate that if what you are doing is not working then thoroughly investigate the alternatives and make an intelligent and informed decision.

***PaperDolls*** · 12-11-2012, 06:57 AM

I was one of those people who knew AA was not for me. The fact is, for many years it wasn't. I had to get desperate. I had run out of options and I had not choice to try it. I'm happy to say it's working for me.

I understand when people say it's not for them even when they don't know much about it because that was me. Trying to convince someone they need to look harder isn't the approach I generally take because I put myself in their shoes. My brain doesn't take kindly to other folks telling me what I ought to do. Especially when I was drinking. That's just the way my brain works.

I practice patience and tolerance as best as I can. I try to show through my actions and words that what I'm doing is working well. Attraction rather than promotion.

miko67 · 12-11-2012, 07:10 AM

Aa is a great thing. I think being honest with strangers just puts alot of people off. I think it has a cult mentality too and its conservative to a degree where U have to do as your told. For me, there should be more accesable places or groups that offer different ways. But aa is by an far the biggest organisation and works wonders for people.

cristiesc · 12-11-2012, 07:24 AM

I agree, I think AA is a wonderful thing and thank God everyday that I found the program. However I think people can think AA is the only way to recover. The Big Book, specifically in the Docotr's Opinion, tells us that this is not true, that many find other ways to recover. This program was how these people recovered, and I am thankful they shared their way because it worked for me as well. :-)

miko67 · 12-11-2012, 08:19 AM

Can U study the big book, without going to aa. And if U go to aa are you obliged to follow the step and do the hardwork? I've been to aa twice and there's a good one were I live. I think ill go before Christmas.

MIRecovery · 12-11-2012, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miko67

Can U study the big book, without going to aa. And if U go to aa are you obliged to follow the step and do the hardwork? I've been to aa twice and there's a good one were I live. I think ill go before Christmas.

Absolutely on all of your questions. AA does not require you to much of anything if you do not want to. "The only requirement for AA membership is a desire to stop drinking."

The big book is on line AA.org and is a great resource even if you never adopt AA

When and if you work the steps is entirely up to you

soberlicious · 12-11-2012, 08:37 AM

I have extensive knowledge of AA. Even so, because I am no longer part of the fellowship, my opinions are not well received. It's ok though, it's just the nature of recoveryism.

I have said it a million times before. I am beyond thrilled for anyone who finds their way out of the darkness...however they do it.

miko67 · 12-11-2012, 08:43 AM

Well I feel strong in my recovery, I know though that Christmas will be a little bit harder and will be my toughest challenge. I went three months last year I had reaped all the benefits of recovery but thought I could go back and drink. This is a lesson learned.
Thanks for the replys very helpful man. Think I will go to aa before Christmas.
Peace

MIRecovery · 12-11-2012, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by soberlicious

I have extensive knowledge of AA. Even so, because I am no longer part of the fellowship, my opinions are not well received. It's ok though, it's just the nature of recoveryism.

I have said it a million times before. I am beyond thrilled for anyone who finds their way out of the darkness...however they do it.

AA is not for everyone and there are other ways to recover. What I want to suggest is for people to do their homework on the recovery method of choice.

AA did not work for you but at least you give it a good shot and found it was not for you. I will be the first to admit there are some dark sides to AA. Knowing what does not work is some ways is as important as knowing what does.

I like you am thrilled for anyone who finds their way out of the darkness.

Fandy · 12-11-2012, 09:03 AM

or you don't have to use any "method"....you can take any form of support from anywhere even if it is not a *program*.

pretty much how i quit...both booze and many years before that cigarettes. connecting with others here and being grateful for improved health works best for me.

everyone should know and believe that they can live a better life when they are not dragging a bottle around like a ball and chain.

soberlicious · 12-11-2012, 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fandy

or you don't have to use any "method"....you can take any form of support from anywhere even if it is not a *program*.

So very true Fandy...

MIRecovery · 12-11-2012, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fandy

or you don't have to use any "method"....you can take any form of support from anywhere even if it is not a *program*.

pretty much how i quit...both booze and many years before that cigarettes. connecting with others here and being grateful for improved health works best for me.

everyone should know and believe that they can live a better life when they are not dragging a bottle around like a ball and chain.

I take my hat off to you for quiting on your own. There are some people who just quit once and for all which is very very cool.

In my case there was no possible way I could do it on my own. Maybe it was how long I had been drinking or maybe it was just me but I had to have some type of structured game plan that had worked for others. In short I needed a set of directions.

Fandy · 12-11-2012, 09:40 AM

i'll be honest, it took more than once to quit..... (same with cigarettes)....put it logically, i was tired of being the stupid one in the family. my mother was dying and my poor brother was doing the majority of the work...that was so wrong. I think we all have it within us to do the right thing, and if you can't handle drinking like a normal person, you need to stop.

i've had plenty of mistakes and a few weekend hangovers before i stopped entirely. but I never fell all the way back down. (19 months and counting sober.....regular drinking for 10 years and heavy drinking probably the last 12 years, extremely heavy drinking the last 3 years).

you do what you need to...i was suffering and depressed. I know i'm not a maschocist, the only one who could stop me was ME. and I don't make a career out of my addictions. they don't deserve that much space in my pointy little head.

soberlicious · 12-11-2012, 09:47 AM

I think there is a misconception that people who don't follow a structured program just put down the bottle and skip off merrily into the sunset...whistling with a bluebird on their shoulder.

Being addcited is horrible...dark, ugly, soul-sucking, sad...

Anyone who has come out of it alive has worked hard. Extremely hard.

choublak · 12-11-2012, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fandy

and I don't make a career out of my addictions. they don't deserve that much space in my pointy little head.

This is one thing some people can get "stuck" in, where it's like "all AA, all the time"...which I can understand if it's during the first year or so of recovery, but if people do this like 50 years later or something...going to AA meetings in lieu of anything social, even non-alcoholic activities like going to the movies, I don't know...I personally think that's a little weird, especially since the idea is to recover and move forward...

MIRecovery · 12-11-2012, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by choublak

This is one thing some people can get "stuck" in, where it's like "all AA, all the time"...which I can understand if it's during the first year or so of recovery, but if people do this like 50 years later or something...going to AA meetings in lieu of anything social, even non-alcoholic activities like going to the movies, I don't know...I personally think that's a little weird, especially since the idea is to recover and move forward...

I call them AA junkies. I enjoy AA but I have a full and rewarding life outside of AA. AA keeps me sober so i can enjoy all that life has to offer. It is all about balance which is something I think we all struggle with but being an AA junkie is much better than being an active alcoholic and most people seem to out grow it.

choublak · 12-11-2012, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MIRecovery

I call them AA junkies. I enjoy AA but I have a full and rewarding life outside of AA. AA keeps me sober so i can enjoy all that life has to offer. It is all about balance which is something I think we all struggle with but being an AA junkie is much better than being an active alcoholic and most people seem to out grow it.

Maybe people who insist that AA isn't for them are afraid of becoming an AA junkie...

Natom · 12-11-2012, 10:12 AM

I also find it interesting when people dismiss AA or NA without any knowledge of it. However I simply read through the traditions and remind myself that we should focus on attraction rather than promotion. Whenever anyone asks about a recovery method/program on this forum I simply mention that I attend NA but also advise looking at Smart/AVRT because in my opinion if I start throwing NA at them then all I am doing is promoting the fellowship which is something I wouldn't do as part of the traditions.

However if someone asks me about NA specifically I am happy to tell them about it in detail and answer any questions they have with the knowledge that I have of the fellowship and the way the program works.

Natom.

MIRecovery · 12-11-2012, 10:40 AM

Again going back to the orginal post. There are options out there. Research them before you condem them. AA/NA is just one of the options. Make an informed decision.

sugarbear1 · 12-11-2012, 10:44 AM

cult [kuhlt] noun

1. a particular system of religious worship, especially with reference to its rites and ceremonies.

2. denomination

12-11-2012, 06:40 AM	#1 (permalink)
MIRecovery A Day at a Time Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Grand Rapids MI Posts: 1,674	I am an expert in things I know nothing about I am a big fan of AA and AVRT. I have spent a lot of time and effort becoming familiar with both and can speak intelligently about their respect merits (at least from my perspective.) I know very little about SMART and various other methods so I do not comment on them. Time and time again especially with AA people say, "AA is not for them" but they have never been to a meeting, never read the big book, never had an in-depth discussion with an AA member, never worked the steps, never had a sponsor. We are dealing with a fatal illness which to me is like saying, " I know nothing about heart disease but diet and exercise is not going to work for me because Aunt Gertrude ran five miles a day and died of a heart attack." Or "My legs hurt when I ran so I stopped running." AA and AVRT are not the only ways but before you dismiss them or any others do your homework, do intensive research, give them an honest try your very life depends on it. Logic would dictate that if what you are doing is not working then thoroughly investigate the alternatives and make an intelligent and informed decision. __________________ I've dealt with my ghosts and faced all my demons Finally content with a past I regret I've found you find strength in your moments of weakness For once I'm at peace with myself

12-11-2012, 07:10 AM	#3 (permalink)
miko67 Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: far away Posts: 231 Blog Entries: 1	Aa is a great thing. I think being honest with strangers just puts alot of people off. I think it has a cult mentality too and its conservative to a degree where U have to do as your told. For me, there should be more accesable places or groups that offer different ways. But aa is by an far the biggest organisation and works wonders for people. __________________ he who does not seek,shall not find.

12-11-2012, 08:19 AM	#5 (permalink)
miko67 Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: far away Posts: 231 Blog Entries: 1	Can U study the big book, without going to aa. And if U go to aa are you obliged to follow the step and do the hardwork? I've been to aa twice and there's a good one were I live. I think ill go before Christmas. __________________ he who does not seek,shall not find.

12-11-2012, 08:43 AM	#8 (permalink)
miko67 Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: far away Posts: 231 Blog Entries: 1	Well I feel strong in my recovery, I know though that Christmas will be a little bit harder and will be my toughest challenge. I went three months last year I had reaped all the benefits of recovery but thought I could go back and drink. This is a lesson learned. Thanks for the replys very helpful man. Think I will go to aa before Christmas. Peace __________________ he who does not seek,shall not find.

12-11-2012, 09:03 AM	#10 (permalink)
Fandy Enlighten and Expurgate Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: NJ Posts: 14,437	or you don't have to use any "method"....you can take any form of support from anywhere even if it is not a program. pretty much how i quit...both booze and many years before that cigarettes. connecting with others here and being grateful for improved health works best for me. everyone should know and believe that they can live a better life when they are not dragging a bottle around like a ball and chain. __________________ I've seen too much to go back and pretend

12-11-2012, 06:57 AM	#2 (permalink)
*PaperDolls* Community Greeter Join Date: May 2004 Location: Midwest Posts: 7,827 Blog Entries: 10	I was one of those people who knew AA was not for me. The fact is, for many years it wasn't. I had to get desperate. I had run out of options and I had not choice to try it. I'm happy to say it's working for me. I understand when people say it's not for them even when they don't know much about it because that was me. Trying to convince someone they need to look harder isn't the approach I generally take because I put myself in their shoes. My brain doesn't take kindly to other folks telling me what I ought to do. Especially when I was drinking. That's just the way my brain works. I practice patience and tolerance as best as I can. I try to show through my actions and words that what I'm doing is working well. Attraction rather than promotion.

12-11-2012, 07:24 AM	#4 (permalink)
cristiesc Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Michigan Posts: 3	I agree, I think AA is a wonderful thing and thank God everyday that I found the program. However I think people can think AA is the only way to recover. The Big Book, specifically in the Docotr's Opinion, tells us that this is not true, that many find other ways to recover. This program was how these people recovered, and I am thankful they shared their way because it worked for me as well. :-)

12-11-2012, 08:37 AM	#7 (permalink)
soberlicious Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: "I'm not lost for I know where I am. But however, where I am may be lost ..." Posts: 3,197	I have extensive knowledge of AA. Even so, because I am no longer part of the fellowship, my opinions are not well received. It's ok though, it's just the nature of recoveryism. I have said it a million times before. I am beyond thrilled for anyone who finds their way out of the darkness...however they do it.

12-11-2012, 09:40 AM	#13 (permalink)
Fandy Enlighten and Expurgate Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: NJ Posts: 14,437	i'll be honest, it took more than once to quit..... (same with cigarettes)....put it logically, i was tired of being the stupid one in the family. my mother was dying and my poor brother was doing the majority of the work...that was so wrong. I think we all have it within us to do the right thing, and if you can't handle drinking like a normal person, you need to stop. i've had plenty of mistakes and a few weekend hangovers before i stopped entirely. but I never fell all the way back down. (19 months and counting sober.....regular drinking for 10 years and heavy drinking probably the last 12 years, extremely heavy drinking the last 3 years). you do what you need to...i was suffering and depressed. I know i'm not a maschocist, the only one who could stop me was ME. and I don't make a career out of my addictions. they don't deserve that much space in my pointy little head. __________________ I've seen too much to go back and pretend

12-11-2012, 09:47 AM	#14 (permalink)
soberlicious Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: "I'm not lost for I know where I am. But however, where I am may be lost ..." Posts: 3,197	I think there is a misconception that people who don't follow a structured program just put down the bottle and skip off merrily into the sunset...whistling with a bluebird on their shoulder. Being addcited is horrible...dark, ugly, soul-sucking, sad... Anyone who has come out of it alive has worked hard. Extremely hard.

12-11-2012, 10:12 AM	#18 (permalink)
Natom Not Alone Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: South East UK Posts: 1,267 Blog Entries: 2	I also find it interesting when people dismiss AA or NA without any knowledge of it. However I simply read through the traditions and remind myself that we should focus on attraction rather than promotion. Whenever anyone asks about a recovery method/program on this forum I simply mention that I attend NA but also advise looking at Smart/AVRT because in my opinion if I start throwing NA at them then all I am doing is promoting the fellowship which is something I wouldn't do as part of the traditions. However if someone asks me about NA specifically I am happy to tell them about it in detail and answer any questions they have with the knowledge that I have of the fellowship and the way the program works. Natom. __________________ Tiny little boxes in a row. Ain't what you want it's what you know. Just happy in the shoes you're wearin.

12-11-2012, 10:40 AM	#19 (permalink)
MIRecovery A Day at a Time Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Grand Rapids MI Posts: 1,674	Again going back to the orginal post. There are options out there. Research them before you condem them. AA/NA is just one of the options. Make an informed decision. __________________ I've dealt with my ghosts and faced all my demons Finally content with a past I regret I've found you find strength in your moments of weakness For once I'm at peace with myself

12-11-2012, 10:44 AM	#20 (permalink)
sugarbear1 ~sb Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: MD Posts: 9,865	cult [kuhlt] noun 1. a particular system of religious worship, especially with reference to its rites and ceremonies. 2. denomination __________________ Someday everything will all make sense. For now, laugh at confusion, smile through tears, & remind yourself that everything happens for a reason. All Big Book quotes are from the first edition. Linked with the permission of Alcoholics Anonymous World Services, Inc.

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