AA and Ego - SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information

DNVR · 10-08-2012, 11:35 PM

I recently began going to AA and have been feeling great about it. The only problem is that on numerous occasions I've overheard individuals saying how much "newcomers" bug them. In small talk after meetings, several members have also drilled me with questions on why I am at AA.

I haven't been court ordered to attend AA and am going on my own free wiil. I'm tired of how alcohol has made my life unmanageable and simply need help. If part of AA is about losing your ego, why do I feel the need to prove myself to "regulars" or members with years of sobriety?

Their actions can only turn people away and push the stereotype of AA as a members only cult further than it already has.

Since it's been helping, should I just keep going and avoid being sponsored and discussions within the group. I've felt more comfortable when I've just gone and listened.

Anyone else have this issue?

Thanks!

**Dee74** · 10-08-2012, 11:43 PM

Welcome DNVR

I have no experience with that newcomers thing, at AA or anywhere else...

Newcomers are definitely the most important people for me, and I've never heard it otherwise from any of the AA members I admire

I guess people are people...some are great, some are less so.
Maybe you need to try some other meetings?

You'll find a lot of support here anyway

D

Lyoness · 10-08-2012, 11:45 PM

Hi, I don't have this issue but have some similar questions. I don't want to hijack your thread so hope it's okay to add my questions to yours.

I'm wondering if those with NA//AA experience might have insight into these scenarios. Both DNVR's and these two- One is that in all but one meeting I've been to I have been totally ignored. I am very shy and find it difficult/impossible to go up and introduce myself but did hope maybe someone would reach out. Instead I saw lots of people reaching out to eachother, hugging and ignoring those they didn't know.

Final question is, I tried going to local AA mtgs--I'm in a small town--and was told I could not speak and was not really allowed or welcome because I had the "wrong" addiction. It made no sense to me. I don't understand turning someone away who needs help just because their substance has a different chemical structure.

Can anyone help me understand, please? Thank you!

IndaMiricale · 10-09-2012, 12:01 AM

First so glad your there DNVR...

And you dont have anything to prove to anyone but you.. And those members that your hear talking that way , just are still sick. And not working a program of the 12 steps. And letting Ego run riot EGO= Easing God Out..After all we are still human. You can just be a better example than that.

Because I was taught and shown that the newcomer is the most important person in the room. And being new still only 15 months. I have seen it in action.

Also your in Denver, there are lots of meetings. The are different try them, each one has its own personality just like humans.. Then you might see and hear someone that has what you want , and then ask to sponsor you...

I was never court ordered either , I should of been . I have 3 dui's. But I tell you the truth I love that I came into the rooms all on my own accord.

Keep an open mind, and try many different meetings..

RobC420 · 10-09-2012, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DNVR

I recently began going to AA and have been feeling great about it. The only problem is that on numerous occasions I've overheard individuals saying how much "newcomers" bug them. In small talk after meetings, several members have also drilled me with questions on why I am at AA.

Good work on attending some meetings. A lot of people never get that far.

I've never heard anyone say newcomers bug them. I have only heard the opposite that the newcomers are the most important people in the rooms.

I've asked newcomers after the meetings about why they came to AA. I did so as an attempt to get to know the new people. I will take it in to account that they may not view it that way. I'm an alcoholic too. I'm not the best at making conversation with strangers. Asking them why they came to AA seemed to me like a fair conversation starter considering it is the only thing I know I have in common with the person.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DNVR

I haven't been court ordered to attend AA and am going on my own free wiil. I'm tired of how alcohol has made my life unmanageable and simply need help. If part of AA is about losing your ego, why do I feel the need to prove myself to "regulars" or members with years of sobriety?

I think the reason you feel you need to prove yourself to the regulars is because you have a bit of an ego. Being new is a very humbling experience. I felt the same way when I was new, but over time I think I've found that my program is my program and it doesn't matter what the 'regulars' think about it. It only matters what my HP and I think about it. You don't need to prove yourself to anybody.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DNVR

Their actions can only turn people away and push the stereotype of AA as a members only cult further than it already has.

When I was an 'on the fence' alcoholic (trying not to drink, but not wanting to take action) the words and actions of other AA's definitely impacted me and I left AA for 8 years because of it. I even spread some anti-AA stuff around to my using friends. When I really hit bottom and went back to AA there was nothing anyone could have said that would have kept me away from AA. If people write off AA because of the words of a few (like I did), maybe they're not ready yet (like I wasn't). It's funny how quickly the anti-AA stuff vanished when I really hit bottom.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DNVR

Since it's been helping, should I just keep going and avoid being sponsored and discussions within the group. I've felt more comfortable when I've just gone and listened.

Anyone else have this issue?

Thanks!

I would suggest doing whatever makes you feel most comfortable. Just go and listen for awhile. There is nothing wrong about that at all.

Natom · 10-09-2012, 01:17 AM

This all my opinion, but make of it what you will. The first AA meeting I attended I only attended because there wasn't an NA meeting that night. I shared as an addict/alcoholic. Directly after my share an old guy jumps in saying stuff along the lines of 'I'm not a top-shelf junkie like you, I only drank'. I was obviously quite annoyed about this. The only requirement for membership is the desire to stop drinking. I needed and wanted to stop drinking as well as taking other drugs.

After the meeting several people came up to me and pretty much apologised for his behaviour. But you do get these type of people. They are so ingrained in their own sickness that they still don't have compassion for others. I go to another AA meeting now that has its fair share of people who identify as addicts/alcoholics and it's a lovely meetings.

People still have egos, they hold on to war stories. Part of recovery is dealing with these people. It becomes a necessary part of life. A lot of people with time in the program seem to have lost the point of it. They don't practise Step 12 in their daily lives. Just keep going, once they see you're in their for the longhaul then maybe their opinions will change. Or maybe you could get to another meeting?

RobC420 · 10-09-2012, 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lyoness

Hi, I don't have this issue but have some similar questions. I don't want to hijack your thread so hope it's okay to add my questions to yours.

I'm wondering if those with NA//AA experience might have insight into these scenarios. Both DNVR's and these two- One is that in all but one meeting I've been to I have been totally ignored. I am very shy and find it difficult/impossible to go up and introduce myself but did hope maybe someone would reach out. Instead I saw lots of people reaching out to eachother, hugging and ignoring those they didn't know.

Ideally people want to reach out for sho. But remember, man. They're all alcoholics too. Some/most of them are very shy and find it difficult/impossible to go up and introduce themselves too. I just kept coming back and people heard my shares and slowly got to know me from that. Then I wasn't such a stranger. After a while I started hanging out at the smokers bench before and after the meetings too and thats when I really started making friends. It took some time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lyoness

Final question is, I tried going to local AA mtgs--I'm in a small town--and was told I could not speak and was not really allowed or welcome because I had the "wrong" addiction. It made no sense to me. I don't understand turning someone away who needs help just because their substance has a different chemical structure.

Can anyone help me understand, please? Thank you!

Open AA meetings can be attended by all people no matter what their situation is. Closed meetings are only for people who meet the one AA membership requirement: a desire to stop drinking. If you have a desire to stop drinking then you are welcome at any AA meeting. That being said, AA is a program for Alcoholics in recovery. There are other programs for whatever ails you: gambling, emotions, narcotics, overeating, etc, etc., etc.

I am an alcoholic, but my drug of choice is marijuana. I went to AA for help with marijuana addiction. Due to the limited amount of MA meetings available to me, my recovery program centers around AA. Though I am seeking help with marijuana addiction, I respect the singleness of purpose by introducing myself as an alcoholic and speaking about my drinking or "addictions". I don't talk about the time I got a vaporizer and got high as ****, or about my favorite bong, or how I got paranoid that the cops were going to bust me. In fact, no one even knew marijuana was my problem until I started sitting on the smokers bench and really got to know people. I guess what I'm saying is no matter what you're particular problem is, if you want to go to AA, then go. Just be respectful about it and talk in general terms of "addiction" and stuff. No need to get specific about your particular DOC is. The people in the meetings are only going to know what you tell them.

Natom · 10-09-2012, 01:43 AM

Every single 'anonymous' program came from AA. A lot of the still use the AA big book, 12 n 12, and other AA literature as their own groups literature. I know this is the case in Cocaine Anonymous. I am firmly on the notion that a 12 step meeting is a 12 step meeting. If I am in desperate need for a meeting I will go to any 12 step one that is close and open that particular night.

Unfortunately I have found that the older people in AA tend to be slightly hostile towards addicts. I think it's because they grew up in a different period. However a lot of younger people who go to AA also used drugs and you can pretty much see a shift as the younger people start going and getting some clean time. In about 20 years I think that the membership of AA is going to have a lot of older members who although their main addiction was alcohol also had multiple cross-addictions to drugs.

I find a lot of people in AA also seem to use prescription drugs quite a lot, at least in their early recovery. Kinda like 'how can you mention the speck of wood in their eye before taking the plank out of yours' moment. Also this is my opinion of meetings where I am.

Lyoness · 10-09-2012, 02:00 AM

Thanks RobC and Natom! You've given me some good stuff to ponder as well as encouragement to not let these behaviors stop me. I always find it easy to get stuck in the mindset that others are "better" than me and then get disappointed when they turn out to be human, too.

I'm pretty sure the AA mtg. I went to was open and the guy who asked me not to speak was polite--but I just felt so shut out and unwelcomed because I used a different substance. I hear of other meetings--in bigger cities--and been to one where it was clearly not an issue and everyone was welcome and encouraged to speak, including addicts.

Maybe I need to take my friend up on her offer to go to some meetings an hour or more away. Those meetings take place in a more open, welcoming and tolerant community. It's just 2-3 hours roundtrip--that's a lot for me currently.

Anyway, thanks again.

Natom · 10-09-2012, 02:15 AM

Meetings change wherever you go Lyoness. They all have their own little quirks and differences. But we try to look for the similarities and not the differences.

Sapling · 10-09-2012, 03:34 AM

I only have one question for you...Do you have a sponsor?

hypochondriac · 10-09-2012, 06:54 AM

Welcome to SR DNVR

How long have you been sober? I only ask because early on I was really sensitive to what other people said, even after 3 months when I want to my first AA meeting. Now if someone says something I don't like I can ignore it much easier. I'm glad it hasn't put you off going, good for you

Maybe try a few different meetings too to see if you can find some more like minded people x

***Anna*** · 10-09-2012, 07:06 AM

I was open to advice in early recovery and depended on what I learned from some great books. But, I tried to be true to myself, always.

nobshere · 10-09-2012, 07:07 AM

DNVR, There is absolutely nothing wrong with simply listening at a meeting. I personally spent most of my time at aa in that mode. Also remember that there are many members who are not well and can put off new members with their opinions. You are in charge of your sobriety so do what is best for you. Take what you need and leave the rest. Best of luck to you!

miamifella · 10-09-2012, 07:07 AM

In most meetings I attended there was an understanding that many addicts were addicted to more than one thing, so it was understood that some alcohol addicts might mention drugs in AA and drug addicts might mention alcohol. I only encountered the sequestration of addictions online. But this may just be a south florida thing since there are lots of rehabs here and addicts of all stripes are used to sharing with each other.

The suspicion of newcomers does seem to be pretty common here too. You have to stick around and "prove" commitment before you get taken seriously. It makes sense with so many people passing through--attending a handful of meetings before giving up. If members were open to all newcomers I am sure they would eventually hit the wall of compassion fatigue.

Sapling · 10-09-2012, 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miamifella

The suspicion of newcomers does seem to be pretty common here too. You have to stick around and "prove" commitment before you get taken seriously. It makes sense with so many people passing through--attending a handful of meetings before giving up. If members were open to all newcomers I am sure they would eventually hit the wall of compassion fatigue.

I'm in South Florida....So I have to agree with you on this. I did show up everyday for 90 days....And people got to know my face....They saw that I had a sponsor and that I payed attention and asked questions. In 15 months in AA I have seen a lot of people come and go....Too many to count. I've also seen some that took the same path I did...And we are still sober. I don't know why that is...Could be a bunch of reasons....But I do know one thing that is rock solid truth....

Rarely have we seen a person fail who has thoroughly followed our path.

I haven't seen one fail yet.

miamifella · 10-09-2012, 07:38 AM

I have seen too many meeting leaders and people with long sobriety fail to say that EVERYONE who follows the AA path will succeed. But I will say that they have a pretty good shot.

There are no guarantees in anything, least of all recovery. So I think even if you have found "the" path...you still have to keep seeking. Finding the path is not the end of recovery and no guarantee of permanent recovery. Finding recovery is an ongoing lifelong process.

***PaperDolls*** · 10-09-2012, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miamifella

The suspicion of newcomers does seem to be pretty common here too. You have to stick around and "prove" commitment before you get taken seriously. It makes sense with so many people passing through--attending a handful of meetings before giving up. If members were open to all newcomers I am sure they would eventually hit the wall of compassion fatigue.

I agree with this to a point. People come and go. I was one of them.

What I don't agree with is not being welcoming and friendly to all newcomers. To everyone for that matter. I always try to remember how I felt when I first started attending. So many people forget to do that ..... remember who you are and where you came from. It's important for my recovery. And then of course, there's the responsibility statement. Compassion fatigue, for myself, is no excuse. I needed all the compassion I got and I'll continue to give it to anyone who is seeking help. That's who I want to be today and I believe it's who my HP wants me to be. It's part of the deal.

To the OP - if it's an option, I suggest finding a different meeting to attend. Shop around and find one where you feel the most comfortable. No matter what you do, please don't stop working on your recovery!

Sapling · 10-09-2012, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PaperDolls

What I don't agree with is not being welcoming and friendly to all newcomers. To everyone for that matter. I always try to remember how I felt when I first started attending. So many people forget to do that ..... remember who you are and where you came from. It's important for my recovery. And then of course, there's the responsibility statement. Compassion fatigue, for myself, is no excuse. I needed all the compassion I got and I'll continue to give it to anyone who is seeking help. That's who I want to be today and I believe it's who my HP wants me to be. It's part of the deal.

I never see newcomers being ignored....I don't forget my first meeting and the people that were there for me...On this site either....But look at the people here that come and go.....There's not 100,00 people checking in here every day....You know what I mean?...AA is a lot like SR in that respect.

Sapling · 10-09-2012, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miamifella

.
There are no guarantees in anything, least of all recovery. So I think even if you have found "the" path...you still have to keep seeking. Finding the path is not the end of recovery and no guarantee of permanent recovery. Finding recovery is an ongoing lifelong process.

There only is one path....Steps 10, 11 and 12....Are nothing but seeking....It doesn't end.

10-08-2012, 11:35 PM	#1 (permalink)
DNVR Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 12	AA and Ego I recently began going to AA and have been feeling great about it. The only problem is that on numerous occasions I've overheard individuals saying how much "newcomers" bug them. In small talk after meetings, several members have also drilled me with questions on why I am at AA. I haven't been court ordered to attend AA and am going on my own free wiil. I'm tired of how alcohol has made my life unmanageable and simply need help. If part of AA is about losing your ego, why do I feel the need to prove myself to "regulars" or members with years of sobriety? Their actions can only turn people away and push the stereotype of AA as a members only cult further than it already has. Since it's been helping, should I just keep going and avoid being sponsored and discussions within the group. I've felt more comfortable when I've just gone and listened. Anyone else have this issue? Thanks!

10-08-2012, 11:43 PM	#2 (permalink)
Dee74 SR Moderator Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: South Seas Posts: 65,367	Welcome DNVR I have no experience with that newcomers thing, at AA or anywhere else... Newcomers are definitely the most important people for me, and I've never heard it otherwise from any of the AA members I admire I guess people are people...some are great, some are less so. Maybe you need to try some other meetings? You'll find a lot of support here anyway D __________________

10-09-2012, 12:01 AM	#4 (permalink)
IndaMiricale Powerless over Alcohol Join Date: May 2011 Location: Trudging the Road to Happy Destiny! Posts: 4,020	First so glad your there DNVR... And you dont have anything to prove to anyone but you.. And those members that your hear talking that way , just are still sick. And not working a program of the 12 steps. And letting Ego run riot EGO= Easing God Out..After all we are still human. You can just be a better example than that. Because I was taught and shown that the newcomer is the most important person in the room. And being new still only 15 months. I have seen it in action. Also your in Denver, there are lots of meetings. The are different try them, each one has its own personality just like humans.. Then you might see and hear someone that has what you want , and then ask to sponsor you... I was never court ordered either , I should of been . I have 3 dui's. But I tell you the truth I love that I came into the rooms all on my own accord. Keep an open mind, and try many different meetings.. __________________ "The only real thing in life are dreams, which nature cant touch with decay." Bob Dylan "Each day,somewhere in the world ,recovery begins when one alcoholic talks with another alcoholic , sharing experience,strength and hope."

10-09-2012, 01:17 AM	#6 (permalink)
Natom Not Alone Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: South East UK Posts: 1,240 Blog Entries: 2	This all my opinion, but make of it what you will. The first AA meeting I attended I only attended because there wasn't an NA meeting that night. I shared as an addict/alcoholic. Directly after my share an old guy jumps in saying stuff along the lines of 'I'm not a top-shelf junkie like you, I only drank'. I was obviously quite annoyed about this. The only requirement for membership is the desire to stop drinking. I needed and wanted to stop drinking as well as taking other drugs. After the meeting several people came up to me and pretty much apologised for his behaviour. But you do get these type of people. They are so ingrained in their own sickness that they still don't have compassion for others. I go to another AA meeting now that has its fair share of people who identify as addicts/alcoholics and it's a lovely meetings. People still have egos, they hold on to war stories. Part of recovery is dealing with these people. It becomes a necessary part of life. A lot of people with time in the program seem to have lost the point of it. They don't practise Step 12 in their daily lives. Just keep going, once they see you're in their for the longhaul then maybe their opinions will change. Or maybe you could get to another meeting? __________________ Tiny little boxes in a row. Ain't what you want it's what you know. Just happy in the shoes you're wearin.

10-09-2012, 01:43 AM	#8 (permalink)
Natom Not Alone Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: South East UK Posts: 1,240 Blog Entries: 2	Every single 'anonymous' program came from AA. A lot of the still use the AA big book, 12 n 12, and other AA literature as their own groups literature. I know this is the case in Cocaine Anonymous. I am firmly on the notion that a 12 step meeting is a 12 step meeting. If I am in desperate need for a meeting I will go to any 12 step one that is close and open that particular night. Unfortunately I have found that the older people in AA tend to be slightly hostile towards addicts. I think it's because they grew up in a different period. However a lot of younger people who go to AA also used drugs and you can pretty much see a shift as the younger people start going and getting some clean time. In about 20 years I think that the membership of AA is going to have a lot of older members who although their main addiction was alcohol also had multiple cross-addictions to drugs. I find a lot of people in AA also seem to use prescription drugs quite a lot, at least in their early recovery. Kinda like 'how can you mention the speck of wood in their eye before taking the plank out of yours' moment. Also this is my opinion of meetings where I am. __________________ Tiny little boxes in a row. Ain't what you want it's what you know. Just happy in the shoes you're wearin.

10-08-2012, 11:45 PM	#3 (permalink)
Lyoness Night owl Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Orion spur of the Milky Way galaxy Posts: 1,037	Hi, I don't have this issue but have some similar questions. I don't want to hijack your thread so hope it's okay to add my questions to yours. I'm wondering if those with NA//AA experience might have insight into these scenarios. Both DNVR's and these two- One is that in all but one meeting I've been to I have been totally ignored. I am very shy and find it difficult/impossible to go up and introduce myself but did hope maybe someone would reach out. Instead I saw lots of people reaching out to eachother, hugging and ignoring those they didn't know. Final question is, I tried going to local AA mtgs--I'm in a small town--and was told I could not speak and was not really allowed or welcome because I had the "wrong" addiction. It made no sense to me. I don't understand turning someone away who needs help just because their substance has a different chemical structure. Can anyone help me understand, please? Thank you!

10-09-2012, 02:00 AM	#9 (permalink)
Lyoness Night owl Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Orion spur of the Milky Way galaxy Posts: 1,037	Thanks RobC and Natom! You've given me some good stuff to ponder as well as encouragement to not let these behaviors stop me. I always find it easy to get stuck in the mindset that others are "better" than me and then get disappointed when they turn out to be human, too. I'm pretty sure the AA mtg. I went to was open and the guy who asked me not to speak was polite--but I just felt so shut out and unwelcomed because I used a different substance. I hear of other meetings--in bigger cities--and been to one where it was clearly not an issue and everyone was welcome and encouraged to speak, including addicts. Maybe I need to take my friend up on her offer to go to some meetings an hour or more away. Those meetings take place in a more open, welcoming and tolerant community. It's just 2-3 hours roundtrip--that's a lot for me currently. Anyway, thanks again.

10-09-2012, 02:15 AM	#10 (permalink)
Natom Not Alone Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: South East UK Posts: 1,240 Blog Entries: 2	Meetings change wherever you go Lyoness. They all have their own little quirks and differences. But we try to look for the similarities and not the differences. __________________ Tiny little boxes in a row. Ain't what you want it's what you know. Just happy in the shoes you're wearin.

10-09-2012, 03:34 AM	#11 (permalink)
Sapling AA Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Between Meetings Posts: 9,004	I only have one question for you...Do you have a sponsor?

10-09-2012, 06:54 AM	#12 (permalink)
hypochondriac Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: UK Posts: 4,262	Welcome to SR DNVR How long have you been sober? I only ask because early on I was really sensitive to what other people said, even after 3 months when I want to my first AA meeting. Now if someone says something I don't like I can ignore it much easier. I'm glad it hasn't put you off going, good for you Maybe try a few different meetings too to see if you can find some more like minded people x __________________ “The future you have tomorrow, won't be the same future you had yesterday.” ― Chuck Palahniuk, Rant

10-09-2012, 07:06 AM	#13 (permalink)
*Anna* Administrator Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Dancing in the Light Posts: 27,794	I was open to advice in early recovery and depended on what I learned from some great books. But, I tried to be true to myself, always. __________________ Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. Marianne Willianson

10-09-2012, 07:07 AM	#14 (permalink)
nobshere Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 137	DNVR, There is absolutely nothing wrong with simply listening at a meeting. I personally spent most of my time at aa in that mode. Also remember that there are many members who are not well and can put off new members with their opinions. You are in charge of your sobriety so do what is best for you. Take what you need and leave the rest. Best of luck to you!

10-09-2012, 07:07 AM	#15 (permalink)
miamifella Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 880	In most meetings I attended there was an understanding that many addicts were addicted to more than one thing, so it was understood that some alcohol addicts might mention drugs in AA and drug addicts might mention alcohol. I only encountered the sequestration of addictions online. But this may just be a south florida thing since there are lots of rehabs here and addicts of all stripes are used to sharing with each other. The suspicion of newcomers does seem to be pretty common here too. You have to stick around and "prove" commitment before you get taken seriously. It makes sense with so many people passing through--attending a handful of meetings before giving up. If members were open to all newcomers I am sure they would eventually hit the wall of compassion fatigue.

10-09-2012, 07:38 AM	#17 (permalink)
miamifella Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 880	I have seen too many meeting leaders and people with long sobriety fail to say that EVERYONE who follows the AA path will succeed. But I will say that they have a pretty good shot. There are no guarantees in anything, least of all recovery. So I think even if you have found "the" path...you still have to keep seeking. Finding the path is not the end of recovery and no guarantee of permanent recovery. Finding recovery is an ongoing lifelong process.

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