Struggling to understand.

[tay-lyn]

Dee, you've made great points in this thread. I've re-read your replies a few times. I know it sounds like we're going around in circles. That's how I've been feeling to be honest. I want so bad to be rid of this 'want'. And yes, there are things I want more than the drink. You're absolutely right. And I AM happy. I just want this one itch to stop pestering me! I am quite the perfectionist. I don't let anything 'just be'. Everything in my life has to be perfect for me to relax. Nothing can be out of place. That is part of the problem to. In order to be content, relaxed, I have to have all the pieces in place. This is a piece that I cannot put into place. It doesn't fit. And I have to find a way to just let it be. Leave it alone and move on. Stop dwelling on it. Stop wanting for it to be different. Maybe I HAVEN'T accepted. Maybe that is the problem. So I'll work on that. Find out FOR ME what it means to really accept. Maybe then I can move on and stop struggling. Or just maybe I'll always struggle. I dunno. What I do know is that no matter what, I don't want to drink. I would like to say I WON'T ever drink again, but I know better than to say that. I can only work on today. What I do know is that I won't put my children through what I went through. My daughter hasn't seen me with a drink (of coarse she is only nine months old), and I never want her to. I don't have the right to do that to her.
So anyways, sorry to y'all if I went round and round in circles, I'm trying to move on but it's taking more work than I thought. Everyone's input has been awesome. Really good points for me to think about.
Tay.

[Dee74]

I didn't mean the going in circles as a criticism.
This is a big thing to get for a lot of us.

There's a lot of 'circle work' involved LOL

D

[tay-lyn]

Thanks Dee, I didn't take your comment to be critical. Your circle comment actually really struck me. Funny how such simple things can hit you so hard. I AM going round in circles again. I always do. And guess what. I always end up drinking again. I have enjoyed your comments here and you've given me much to think about. Especially when you said 'you just do'....about giving up wanting something. There are things that I am going to have to let go of. I said before I am a grudge holder. I never forget. I hold onto everything. I can never just let something be. I believe that has kept me sick for a long, long time and will continue to keep me sick if I don't find a way to get over my harboured resentments. I go round and round.
Anyways, like I said, thanks for all your input, I've enjoyed it. I've learned a lot today. Learned a lot of things I need to work on that I haven't been working on.
Man, my brain is on overload! Ok, going to go paint my bathroom. Baby's in bed, hubby is at a Santana concert. Got time to unwind.
I'll check back in later.
Tay.

[warrens]

Tay

You are making huge strides by reaching deep within. Your personality (and mine) is classic. Wanting, needing to control everything. Sh*t, who is better than that than we Americans. We're trying to herd cats all over the bloody world and can't figure out why it isn't working and everyone hates us.

Think on the word "serenity." Why that word? Why not "peace?" Why not "knowledge?" Grant me .....the serenity. It is such a simple concept. Like Dee said "just give up, just let go." What do we really control. What do we give up by trying to control things we cannot?

Analogies and metaphors are great for understanding, I think. How about childbirth Tay? Does that strike a chord? In this excruciating series of events, is there not a point when you just surrender? Just let go? Give up to the processes of your body? A point where there is no turning, no looking back? Giving up control from your mind to the natural processes of nature? Perhaps if men gave birth we'd be a hell of a lot more serene.

Surrender and forgiveness take letting go of our problem solving, control freak minds. Recognizing that while our minds are good at what they do, they have limitations, and when our mind reaches its limits, the crunching of gears results in toxic feelings. That energy has to go somewhere. Thus anger, resentment, hostility, bitterness, struggle. It is ambient energy that has nowhere to go. We drink to neutralize that energy. In the beginning it works!

I believe that letting go is as natural as childbirth. It can be as difficult. But, when done, it is just as rewarding. We have created something very worthwhile-serenity. Our bodies are free from that energy. We can relax and recover.

The prayer is emphatic-control what we can! It doesn't suggest we surrender to EVERYTHING. Quite the opposite. It simply suggests that we focus our energy on the things that matter, the things we CAN change and control. And neutralize the power that the uncontrollable has on us, by simply letting it go.

I once had a field fire get away from me. I nearly killed myself trying to control it. Running here, there trying to head it off, cursing the wind. I was in tears as the flames hit the treeline, rising 60 feet in the air. I reached the point where I simply surrendered and looked in awe at the energy being released. I was one powerless human and I had to accept it. When the fuel was consumed the inferno dissipated and all was calm. In weeks the burnt area was greener than it had ever been. It had been cleansed of all the dead brush and weeds and ugly stuff. In its place was reborn growth. Healthy growth. Serene and green. It is what we need to do once in a while.

warren

[warrens]

Hey Tay

Hope you are still thinking and open to discovery. I thought about you last night. Thinking about others who are struggling is my most powerful therapy.

Been thinking about the childbirth analogy. I think it is a good one for looking at "control." When it comes to pregnancy, the only thing you control is conception. After that, it is all about process. Your little one needs you, but you control none of it. You have surrendered to the fact that you are the best you can do is do nothing. The only control you have is in interfering. You surrender by guarding and insuring that you remain healthy and uninjured.

So too with alcoholism. We alcoholics only control by taking that first drink. Natural processes in the alcoholic, whatever they are, take over from there. We simply nurture and protect them. We somehow ensure our birth as an addict. An unwell situation.

What is obfuscated in all this, by the alcohol, is our body and mind that is striving toward wellness. It wants to be born as well, and for a time, it does well. We heal. The hangovers, vomitting, blackouts, etc are actually the body's attempt to heal. But we interrupt the process, by thinking we can control it by drinking. Hell, when I was a kid doctors would try to "control" infant colic and and distress by prescribing small doses of alcohol!

So, do we surrender to alcohol or surrender to wellness? You've made me think. I guess I've surrendered to the natural process of wellness. You women do it all the time (to our astonishment!) when you accept the absolute craziness of pregnancy and childbirth. You surrender to stuff that would kill a man, because of the wonderful consequence. Well, sobriety is a wonderful consequence. Can we simply surrender while wellness gestates? Can we take care of ourselves to insure its healthy delivery and lifelong positive outcome?

As a man, I'll gladly accept the discomfort of recovery over pregnancy and childbirth. I know I can't control it as it (recovery and sobriety) grows inside me. It's just a natural process. I can certainly abort it. Just have a drink and bingo. But I WANT this child more than anything. Wellness will give me something to live for and care for until the day I die. When I am well I will feed it, nurture it, give it everything it needs to grow to maturity. It will be a pain in the as* sometimes. We know that at the outset but keep on having children. We want our children to have better lives than we had. So to the child that is a well person. I want my sobriety to someday go to college and graduate with honors. Perhaps my sobriety will give birth to other children who are people I can assist to sobriety. So that I may die the parent of me, a sober man (the child is father to the man) with many grandchildren. All I have to do is surrender to the processes that are already there because I have conceived them. I can only get in the way by trying to control that which I can never control. That's humbling.

warren

[Tazman53]

I wish I had more time to reply and to read all of the replies to this, there have been a lot of good ones Tay, let me just share this and wish you all a great weekend.

Surrender for me today.

When I was near the end of my drinking, I wanted to stop but could not, I was in a battle and I was on the losing side.

When in a battle one has 2 choices, keep fighting until death, or surrender to the winning side and become a winner!

Well I did not want to die so I surrendered to the winning side, I admitted that I was powerless over alcohol and as long as I kept putting it in me I was going to wind up on the losing side of the battle every time.

Well when I surrendered, I turned my drinking over to a Power greater then myself, I was able to find a Power Greater then me thanks to AA. I went over to the winning side. I listened to the suggestions of those sober AA's who had found sobriety, I followed thier path thouroughly.

[ananda]

Sorry to interupt, but what does obfuscated mean.

[mle-sober]

Warrens says : "Can we simply surrender while wellness gestates?"

That is very wonderful. I love it. AND it helps me take another step. Thank you. The entire analogy iswonderful. I have been wondering how to take this next step - feeling stuck and a little scared. But I've had 4 babies with natural childbirth and I get it now.

Thank you!

[warrens]

Ananda

Sorry!

transitive verb
1 a: darken b: to make obscure
2: confuse
intransitive verb
: to be evasive, unclear, or confusing

Alcohol obfuscates by obscuring what is obvious and clear to the sober. Like looking at life through a window smeared with Vaseline.


warren

[ananda]

Thanks Warren - I'm learning to just ask

Hijack over - back to topic!

[warrens]

Ananda

So am I!

warren

[nogard]

Taylyn its just one day at a time, I don't hang on to what my mind tells me, these days I just say thanks but no thanks to all the madness.

no matter what others say you do not need to do any more research. Instead work your program and keep it in the day and more will be revealed.

Kevin

[tay-lyn]

Such good advice Kevin! Staying in 'today' has kept me sober so far. I worry so much about the future, always have, not just about drinking...I'm just a natural worrier. So I've been focusing on just today. So far so good.
I was just telling a friend.....I woke up this morning quite early, BEAUTIFUL morning, showered, did hair/makeup/dressed, opened the windows, got the baby up and started making breakfast over a cup of tea and was SO ENJOYING MYSELF...when I thought....'If I had even 'just a few' drinks last night, I wouldn't feel this way this morning'. What a waste that would have been. So I feel SUPER grateful this morning for not drinking. All I have to do is go to bed sober tonight and I'll get to wake up sober again tomorrow.
So yes Kevin, ONE DAY AT A TIME.
It was nice to hear from ya!
Tay.

[Toomutch]

Tay,

It is wonderful to here that you are having a peaceful morning.

This may sound silly - but try thinking of drinking as a relationship. A bad abusive relationship that has ended. In your heart you know that it would be very dangerous for you to go back to this abusive person, but you miss him so much.

He has hurt you and your kids have been witnesses, he has taken precious time from you
by controlling your every move. He has made your life miserable. But he is all you know and part of you wants him back.

Alcoholism is no different Tay. It is an abusive relationship that we grieve for when it is gone. With time you will move on, it will no longer be in your thoughts as often, and you will know that you do not want to go back.

Did I make ANY sense?

Love,
Suzette

[stone]

Thanks to Tay and everyone else for this thread!

I feel very much like you, Tay, now that is. I didn't before I slipped, but after a few little slips where nothing really bad happened I have that feeling of wanting to drink without consequences... that gives the addiction something to work on. The little voice can start suggesting things like 'just do it once every two weeks' and crap like that.
After a few more little slips the consequences have started making themselves felt more and more. If I dont stop/surrender soon I could be back in a binge cycle properly again.

I have no words of wisdom but this thread has helped me, so thankyou.

[tay-lyn]

Suzette;
That's a great way to look at it. As a bad, abusive relationship.
Because of my drinking ways, I always gravitated towards men who drank heavily as well. There is one relationship in my life that completey changed my life and me. That man had such a powerful hold over me. I was young and he was quite a bit older and I was head-over-heals. It was a terrible relationship and I eventually got out. BUT it took me three years to get over him. THREE years! I was a real party girl and was never without a date. I had lots of 'good guys' come in my life...lots of losers too....but lots of opportunities for relationships with really nice guys. But I'd have none of that. I was so completely traumatized by the end of this abusive relationship that for three years it didn't matter who came into my life, I couldn't think of any other man but the one I'd broken up with. I was obssessed with him. I could think of nothing but him. No other man compared in any way to this man. I honestly felt that I would never ever find another man who made me feel like that man did. I had completely resigned myself to the fact that the rest of my life would lack because I'd never again find anyone like this man.
Guess what. I got over him. It took a long time. But I did. And now, I HONESTLY look back and think 'what the hell!' HOW ON EARTH could I have even given that ass a second look let alone be so hung up on him. I actually feel embarrassed now about having been with him. BUT......at the time, I felt like I was suffocating without him. Every minute was a struggle to not go back to him. But my life is so much better now for being rid of him. He was a terrible person. I can't express enough how lucky I was to get away from him. I ended up finding a man who I felt ten times more about than I did that other man. And am so happy now.

So this is a great comparison. It was so hard to not go back, but years later, I can't believe I ever THOUGHT about going back. Hopefully the same will happen with my love/hate relationship with booze.

Suzette: You're a genius!