Rehab - Double Messages - When is Enough Enough?
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: west coast
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Rehab - Double Messages - When is Enough Enough?
I just partially financially supported one relative in rehab last month, and am totally supporting another one this month.
Lots of time in the "Family" group . . . it is ALL about the alcoholic/addict and how to support them in their recovery. I "get" that's important, but family members also need support and a place to process and VENT . . . as well as brainstorm for the future - and there is no space for that.
Family members are automatically thrust into the camp of "co-dependent" - and we also "have a disease." But as far as rehab is concerned, our jobs are to support the alcoholic/addict (and don't ask any questions).
It doesn't matter how many trips to rehab it might take, we are expected to manage (and pay) for that - as we would for a sick relative who had cancer . . .
I am having a problem with the pathologizing of all relatives as "sick" and the double messages to "detach and don't rescue, but always be there when they need rehab, no matter how many times it might take." Some families travel from other states to come to rehab and that's okay! They must attend the family meetings and support their loved one (and again, I don't have an argument with this if it works, but at what point does the alcoholic/addict take responsibility for their recovery?) and when are family members allowed to "recover" from all of the drama and chaos?
Oh, never, that's right.
I know it is difficult for families because you LOVE your family members and don't want to lose them . . . but what about you? Must it be only one person who is allowed to "survive" and be supported?
Thank you for letting me VENT. I LOVE my family members AND I am very, very tired.
I do not want to live in anxiety and be "a rag doll on a roller coaster," as the instructor aptly put it.
I understand it is in the recovery center's vested interest to insist that multiple stays are the way to go - but what if it creates a financial hardship? Not everyone has insurance! I thought I was told to basically sell my body if necessary (this might be a slight exaggeration, and at my age, that would not be a lucrative option anyway) . . .
This is REALLY, REALLY DIFFICULT . . .
I will keep going because my spiritual belief is that everything shows up in your life for a reason and "don't run away, work with it," but I WANT to run away!
Venting . . . please understand, I just had to get this out . . . I wish there was a safe place for family members to share how they feel (Alanon is not the place for that - you are not supposed to "just process," and that's what I want/need to do for my health and well-being). I just need to get it all out without being expected to do anything else about it (like work steps or whatever). I have done enough work and just want to relax!
Thanks for listening!
Lots of time in the "Family" group . . . it is ALL about the alcoholic/addict and how to support them in their recovery. I "get" that's important, but family members also need support and a place to process and VENT . . . as well as brainstorm for the future - and there is no space for that.
Family members are automatically thrust into the camp of "co-dependent" - and we also "have a disease." But as far as rehab is concerned, our jobs are to support the alcoholic/addict (and don't ask any questions).
It doesn't matter how many trips to rehab it might take, we are expected to manage (and pay) for that - as we would for a sick relative who had cancer . . .
I am having a problem with the pathologizing of all relatives as "sick" and the double messages to "detach and don't rescue, but always be there when they need rehab, no matter how many times it might take." Some families travel from other states to come to rehab and that's okay! They must attend the family meetings and support their loved one (and again, I don't have an argument with this if it works, but at what point does the alcoholic/addict take responsibility for their recovery?) and when are family members allowed to "recover" from all of the drama and chaos?
Oh, never, that's right.
I know it is difficult for families because you LOVE your family members and don't want to lose them . . . but what about you? Must it be only one person who is allowed to "survive" and be supported?
Thank you for letting me VENT. I LOVE my family members AND I am very, very tired.
I do not want to live in anxiety and be "a rag doll on a roller coaster," as the instructor aptly put it.
I understand it is in the recovery center's vested interest to insist that multiple stays are the way to go - but what if it creates a financial hardship? Not everyone has insurance! I thought I was told to basically sell my body if necessary (this might be a slight exaggeration, and at my age, that would not be a lucrative option anyway) . . .
This is REALLY, REALLY DIFFICULT . . .
I will keep going because my spiritual belief is that everything shows up in your life for a reason and "don't run away, work with it," but I WANT to run away!
Venting . . . please understand, I just had to get this out . . . I wish there was a safe place for family members to share how they feel (Alanon is not the place for that - you are not supposed to "just process," and that's what I want/need to do for my health and well-being). I just need to get it all out without being expected to do anything else about it (like work steps or whatever). I have done enough work and just want to relax!
Thanks for listening!
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Melbourne Australia.
Posts: 3,745
Both AA and Alanon are not, in my view as patently clear as some would believe.
As for the 'disease concept' this too can be overplayed.
Alcohol dependency can be very bad but many other bad factors exist too.
Take care of yourself, we can't help others if they impose too much on our own real needs!
As for the 'disease concept' this too can be overplayed.
Alcohol dependency can be very bad but many other bad factors exist too.
Take care of yourself, we can't help others if they impose too much on our own real needs!
Member
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Mmmmmm
Posts: 3,178
It must be frustrating to be involved so deeply with two relatives so close together going through rehab.
I have a lot of doubts about how addiction is currently modeled. Not even the experts agree. Rehab is a huge expense and time commitment for it not to be better at arresting the process. I agree with you that families with return fliers should get specialized intervention. It's not all codependency with return fliers if you've done your own work.
Peace!
Is Addiction A Habit Or A Disease? - The Daily Beast
I have a lot of doubts about how addiction is currently modeled. Not even the experts agree. Rehab is a huge expense and time commitment for it not to be better at arresting the process. I agree with you that families with return fliers should get specialized intervention. It's not all codependency with return fliers if you've done your own work.
Peace!
Is Addiction A Habit Or A Disease? - The Daily Beast
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Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 379
Originally Posted by CodeJob 
It must be frustrating to be involved so deeply with two relatives so close together going through rehab.
I have a lot of doubts about how addiction is currently modeled. Not even the experts agree. Rehab is a huge expense and time commitment for it not to be better at arresting the process. I agree with you that families with return fliers should get specialized intervention. It's not all codependency with return fliers if you've done your own work.
Peace!
Is Addiction A Habit Or A Disease? - The Daily Beast
I have a lot of doubts about how addiction is currently modeled. Not even the experts agree. Rehab is a huge expense and time commitment for it not to be better at arresting the process. I agree with you that families with return fliers should get specialized intervention. It's not all codependency with return fliers if you've done your own work.
Peace!
Is Addiction A Habit Or A Disease? - The Daily Beast
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Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 2,393
Originally Posted by seek
It doesn't matter how many trips to rehab it might take, we are expected to manage (and pay) for that - as we would for a sick relative who had cancer . . .
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Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 2,393
Originally Posted by seek
I wish there was a safe place for family members to share how they feel (Alanon is not the place for that - you are not supposed to "just process," and that's what I want/need to do for my health and well-being).
Member
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Mmmmmm
Posts: 3,178
I think the idea of focusing on the ability of the brain to form new pathways is how the 12 steps help someone learn a new way of living. I think neuro plasticity is an important concept to addiction recovery. Brain damage is a likely reality, but an organ can work its way around to some extent given a chance.
Hopefully your loved ones will arrest their addiction. Mine did need rehab. He is sober at 2+ years. A bit squirrely, but one cannot make them dig deep into the whys. 28 days is just scraping the paint that is peeling. You still need to sand and smooth the surface for adhesion of a new coat of paint.
Hopefully your loved ones will arrest their addiction. Mine did need rehab. He is sober at 2+ years. A bit squirrely, but one cannot make them dig deep into the whys. 28 days is just scraping the paint that is peeling. You still need to sand and smooth the surface for adhesion of a new coat of paint.
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Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 6
Seek,
Thank you for your "venting"! You so expressed the feelings I have been having, and our Family Program made me feel terrible. I walked away, well, feeling like you described in your post. I still don't know what to do. We aren't wealthy people and our 20 yr. old son is staying in a nicer "resort" treatment center than my husband and I have ever gotten to go to on a vacation (and probably never will). I'm resentful, angry and worried where this will end. The worst part is that it is starting to cause problems between my husband and me and we have had a very loving and successful 31 year marriage. I just don't know what to do. Sorry, got on my problem - just wanted to thank you for communicating something I definitely related to.
Thank you for your "venting"! You so expressed the feelings I have been having, and our Family Program made me feel terrible. I walked away, well, feeling like you described in your post. I still don't know what to do. We aren't wealthy people and our 20 yr. old son is staying in a nicer "resort" treatment center than my husband and I have ever gotten to go to on a vacation (and probably never will). I'm resentful, angry and worried where this will end. The worst part is that it is starting to cause problems between my husband and me and we have had a very loving and successful 31 year marriage. I just don't know what to do. Sorry, got on my problem - just wanted to thank you for communicating something I definitely related to.
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Manitoba, Canada
Posts: 168
My main 3 concerns in regards to your post:
1) The rehab center sounds in it for the money. Although they are there to help your LO, remember, they're there for the addict/alcoholic primarily. Your "recovery" is your responsibility.
2) "as many times as they may need to go" - it doesn't matter how many times they go, if they don't 100% want recovery, nothing will work. They have to be so desperate that they're willing to do ANYTHING to stay away from their DOC. This is why you need to put in boundaries, and take care of you. You can love them, but do so with detachment. Any "helping" that is mistakenly enabling and they will milk that for all it's worth.
3) I don't like the "term" disease either, but addiction/alcoholism is an illness. If it's not taken care of (through recovery) it gets worse. Unfortunately, family/friends who are close to the addict/alcoholic, also take on symptoms of this illness. I've learned this in a whole new dimension by being so close to my sister as she fell down the rabbit hole. She's currently on the wait list for rehab.
I was lucky that I was able to get clean through NA (Narcotics Anonymous). I think rehab could've been beneficial to me, but at the time I found the rooms, I wasn't done fighting so I still have doubts it would've completely gotten me off of everything.
1) The rehab center sounds in it for the money. Although they are there to help your LO, remember, they're there for the addict/alcoholic primarily. Your "recovery" is your responsibility.
2) "as many times as they may need to go" - it doesn't matter how many times they go, if they don't 100% want recovery, nothing will work. They have to be so desperate that they're willing to do ANYTHING to stay away from their DOC. This is why you need to put in boundaries, and take care of you. You can love them, but do so with detachment. Any "helping" that is mistakenly enabling and they will milk that for all it's worth.
3) I don't like the "term" disease either, but addiction/alcoholism is an illness. If it's not taken care of (through recovery) it gets worse. Unfortunately, family/friends who are close to the addict/alcoholic, also take on symptoms of this illness. I've learned this in a whole new dimension by being so close to my sister as she fell down the rabbit hole. She's currently on the wait list for rehab.
I was lucky that I was able to get clean through NA (Narcotics Anonymous). I think rehab could've been beneficial to me, but at the time I found the rooms, I wasn't done fighting so I still have doubts it would've completely gotten me off of everything.
🚫Proverbial Pink Elephant
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Florida
Posts: 31
I had a terrible relapse after 12 years clean and sober. It was beyond incomprehensible demoralization. In addition to alcohol, I was also addicted to opiates and benzos and abusing cocaine. I made the decision that I wanted to live a clean and sober life in recovery. I voluntarily signed in to a state rehab detox with no money. I checked out a week later and a brutal detox from benzos continued. On the 10th day I started hallucinating and almost died. I was bouncing in and out of hospitals and was baker acted back to the original detox rehab facility. I am clean and sober today simply because I new that I wanted it more than anything else. I was told by AA friends that I needed a long term treatment program. I did not have the finances or the option. I surrendered to AA and it works. A person has to want it, no amount of rehab is going to give a person the gift of desperation.
Enough is enough. We can't let the alcoholic addict destroy us also. "The alcoholic addict doesn't get to be the most important person in the family."
Enough is enough. We can't let the alcoholic addict destroy us also. "The alcoholic addict doesn't get to be the most important person in the family."
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Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 146
Congratulations on seeking sobriety, Catherine. I believe you hit the proverbial nail on the head. You wanted sobriety, you sought it out and surrendered to the recovery process. Rehab cannot give anyone that. Nor can sacrificing our own lives (and possibly our children's lives) on the altar of addiction. We cannot love enough, spend enough, threaten enough. It must come from within.
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Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 393
Plasticinsanity has it right:
"2) "as many times as they may need to go" - it doesn't matter how many times they go, if they don't 100% want recovery, nothing will work. They have to be so desperate that they're willing to do ANYTHING to stay away from their DOC. This is why you need to put in boundaries, and take care of you. You can love them, but do so with detachment. Any "helping" that is mistakenly enabling and they will milk that for all it's worth."
And Catherine has the same voice from the other side:
"I am clean and sober today simply because I new that I wanted it more than anything else. I was told by AA friends that I needed a long term treatment program. I did not have the finances or the option. I surrendered to AA and it works. A person has to want it, no amount of rehab is going to give a person the gift of desperation."
Jim
"2) "as many times as they may need to go" - it doesn't matter how many times they go, if they don't 100% want recovery, nothing will work. They have to be so desperate that they're willing to do ANYTHING to stay away from their DOC. This is why you need to put in boundaries, and take care of you. You can love them, but do so with detachment. Any "helping" that is mistakenly enabling and they will milk that for all it's worth."
And Catherine has the same voice from the other side:
"I am clean and sober today simply because I new that I wanted it more than anything else. I was told by AA friends that I needed a long term treatment program. I did not have the finances or the option. I surrendered to AA and it works. A person has to want it, no amount of rehab is going to give a person the gift of desperation."
Jim
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: west coast
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Yes. They have to want it.
The point of the post is the double messages that rehab facilities give families - they want you to participate in the program to "support the addict" and they often have Alanon meetings to "help you" - but in the end, they are a business with repeat customers - some of them even teach that relapse is part of recovery (a kind of twisted self-fulfilling prophecy).
It is wrong to solicit money from relatives for what they know will most likely be a failed attempt at recovery - most alcoholics and addicts relapse . . . that "fact" is hidden . . . I was overtly told that any good family member should support the alcoholic/addicts rehab needs as many times as might be necessary - that we should go to any lengths - mortgage the house, whatever . . . that is just evil greed.
The point of the post is the double messages that rehab facilities give families - they want you to participate in the program to "support the addict" and they often have Alanon meetings to "help you" - but in the end, they are a business with repeat customers - some of them even teach that relapse is part of recovery (a kind of twisted self-fulfilling prophecy).
It is wrong to solicit money from relatives for what they know will most likely be a failed attempt at recovery - most alcoholics and addicts relapse . . . that "fact" is hidden . . . I was overtly told that any good family member should support the alcoholic/addicts rehab needs as many times as might be necessary - that we should go to any lengths - mortgage the house, whatever . . . that is just evil greed.
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Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: California
Posts: 11
My wife is inthe 3rd week of her 1st rehab program. She is an alcoholic and I couldn't stay married to her as an alcoholic anymore. I told her that I would divorce if she didn't go to rehab.
I have been to few alanon meetings and read codependent no more. It helped me see that I can only control myself, not anyone else. It has felt good to be able to vent my anger at a meeting or with a friend or thankfully now that I found SR.
I love my wife but there is a line as to how far I would go to in regards to paying for rehab. I am not sure where that line is and I hope I never find it but that little saying helps me:
God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
Courage to change the things I can and
Wisdom to know the difference.
I too felt anger when my wife first went to rehab. She had 24/7 support and care. I had nothing. I had to keep working, keep the house and the kids going and couldn't complain or share my anger for fear of hurting her recovery. I am slowly coming to peace with it all. I just have to think about me first. It happens that the best thing for me now is for her to be in recovery. I am not sure that multiple trips to rehab with the hefty price would be what is best for me.
I have been to few alanon meetings and read codependent no more. It helped me see that I can only control myself, not anyone else. It has felt good to be able to vent my anger at a meeting or with a friend or thankfully now that I found SR.
I love my wife but there is a line as to how far I would go to in regards to paying for rehab. I am not sure where that line is and I hope I never find it but that little saying helps me:
God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
Courage to change the things I can and
Wisdom to know the difference.
I too felt anger when my wife first went to rehab. She had 24/7 support and care. I had nothing. I had to keep working, keep the house and the kids going and couldn't complain or share my anger for fear of hurting her recovery. I am slowly coming to peace with it all. I just have to think about me first. It happens that the best thing for me now is for her to be in recovery. I am not sure that multiple trips to rehab with the hefty price would be what is best for me.
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Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Long Beach, California
Posts: 69
I'm having the same issues and concerns with my husband's rehab. He's in a very strict rehab facility that doesn't allow him to have ANY contact AT ALL with ANYONE he's ever known in his life, for a year. Spouse, children, parents...doesn't matter. They offer NO HELP to the families at all. We're basically told to "work on ourselves"...how can a wife "work on herself" and her marriage and help her children understand if there is NO family connection for over a year. It just doesn't make sense to me. I actually feel like I'm getting worse...I'm seeking therapy and al-anon, but that isn't enough. I'm grieving him like he died...that's almost what it feels like sometimes.
I'm actually thinking I really want to start a support group for spouses in positions like I am. There's not many of us.
I'm actually thinking I really want to start a support group for spouses in positions like I am. There's not many of us.
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Join Date: Jun 2015
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Originally Posted by nutmeg19
I'm having the same issues and concerns with my husband's rehab. He's in a very strict rehab facility that doesn't allow him to have ANY contact AT ALL with ANYONE he's ever known in his life, for a year. Spouse, children, parents...doesn't matter. They offer NO HELP to the families at all. We're basically told to "work on ourselves"...how can a wife "work on herself" and her marriage and help her children understand if there is NO family connection for over a year. It just doesn't make sense to me. I actually feel like I'm getting worse...I'm seeking therapy and al-anon, but that isn't enough. I'm grieving him like he died...that's almost what it feels like sometimes.
I'm actually thinking I really want to start a support group for spouses in positions like I am. There's not many of us.
I'm actually thinking I really want to start a support group for spouses in positions like I am. There's not many of us.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 28
I understand what you are going through. so many conflicting ideas....one minute its support them and one minute its say goodbye......most say that the sometimes the best way to support IS to say goodbye. i do not fully understand myself. hoping we can figure this out together.
the best advice i can give is to take some time out for yourself. what are your goals? your passions? things you want to do with your money? we spend so much time living for the addict that we forget the way we used to live for ourself. take care
the best advice i can give is to take some time out for yourself. what are your goals? your passions? things you want to do with your money? we spend so much time living for the addict that we forget the way we used to live for ourself. take care
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Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 2
I'm so annoyed at rehab right now myself. I gave my husband the ultimatum if he wants to ever see his kids again and me not file for divorce to go. Yeah he went but of course they talked down about his co dependent wife and he needs to focus on himself only. Thousands of things I offered him over the years to do he decides in rehab he is now going to do and comes back home wanting me to think about his poor disease. Well I'm sorry I too was sick almost dying while raising our twins all alone and he wants me to be there for him in his new found clean life of 29 days. Sorry but for the 6 yrs my kids and I needed him he failed to think of me and help me while I was in and out of ER rooms, doctors offices, and never watched the kids while I needed time to take care of me. The whole thing of financially destroying us and alienating from me and kids just doesn't make me feel I need to be holding my anger in to be so caring of him right now. Especially because rehab told him to think of us last and him first. Sounds just like drug addiction he's had for past 9 yrs anyway. I'm so angry that my co dependent disease is not something the addict can't be learning how to be patient with too? I want a divorce but have left that decision to God but I promise just because he has a disease I'm not going to easily get over my anger and resentment anytime soon. It's tough I hate how I was raised by an alcoholic and it predisposed me to this after I got clean myself and I don't remember anyone being loving to me from what I did while I was messed up on their watch.
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