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View Poll Results: How do you feel about special interst meetings?
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Special Interest meetings?

Old 07-31-2006, 01:02 PM
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I just thought I'd pass this on, it was from a friend who belonged to this ad-hoc committee

WORLD SERVICE BOARD OF TRUSTEES BULLETIN #18

Special interest meetings

The following is a synopsis of a report that was delivered to the World Service Conference at its annual meeting in April 1989 by the WSC Ad Hoc Committee on Special Interest Meetings. Formed the previous year, the committee was chaired by the vice chairperson of the World Service Board of Trustees. This bulletin was revised during the 1995-96 conference year.

The WSC Ad Hoc Committee on Special Interest Meetings was formed by vote of the 1988 World Service Conference. The intent of this motion, as stated in the WSC minutes, was to help us as a fellowship come to grips with and perhaps find a solution to the issue of special interest meetings. In addition, this committee could provide some forum for the input of ideas about the issue.

Purpose of the Committee

The committee spent a great deal of its initial meeting discussing what the conference wanted it to accomplish. As a result of the discussion, the committee set the following goals:

To provide a definition of special interest meetings;

To investigate precisely what role special interest meetings play in the Narcotics Anonymous Fellowship;

To allow the fellowship an opportunity to comment on this issue by means of conducting open forums; requesting input directly from groups and members via the Newsline, the Fellowship Report, and The NA Way Magazine; and by direct mailings to regions; and,

To provide a report which could be used by NA members as a basis for the discussion of the issue of special interest meetings.

Definition of Special Interest Groups

At the beginning of its deliberations, the committee attempted to define what, precisely, a special interest meeting is and how that definition fits into existing NA guidelines on the subject. We were informed in this part of our task by both the Temporary Working Guide to Our Service Structure and the Basic Text.

The Temporary Working Guide told us that "an NA group is any meeting which meets regularly at a specified place and time, providing that it follows the Twelve Steps and Twelve Traditions," and that the "primary purpose of an NA group is to carry the message of recovery to the addict who still suffers by providing a setting for identification and a healthy atmosphere for recovery." (Temporary Working Guide, 1988 Edition, pages 1 & 2.)

The Basic Text provided more clarity in its discussion of Tradition Four, stating that "There are two basic types of meetings; those open to the general public and those closed to the public (for addicts only). Meeting formats vary widely from group to group; some are participation meetings, some speakers, some are question and answer, and some focus on special problems discussion." (Basic Text, Fifth Edition, page 63.)

In some NA communities there are groups consisting of men, women, gays, professionals, etc. These members host NA meetings where the focus is on recovery from drug addiction in Narcotics Anonymous.

Types of Special Interest Meeting

The Ad Hoc Committee on Special Interest Groups wrote to each RSC chairperson and RSR requesting information concerning special interest meetings in their regions. Of the fifty-eight NA regions, twenty-four responded to this request. Here are the results of our survey:

Of the twenty-four regions responding, twenty indicated that special interest meetings were held in their regions.

The twenty regions have reported a total of 184 special interest meetings. Some regions, however, reported that not all areas responded to their request for information and that their data was therefore incomplete.
The regions reported a variety of types of special interest meetings. These types include: Men's, Women's, Gay and Lesbian, Young People/Youth meetings, Couples meetings, one Agnostic meeting, one Illness and Recovery meeting, and one "Pills" meeting. It was also reported to the committee from other sources that in some regions there are meetings for Vietnam Veterans, people with AIDS, people who are HIV positive, and various types of professionals.
Of the regions that reported how long special interest meetings had been in existence within their boundaries, a number indicated that meetings had been occurring for over five years, and one region reported a group soon to celebrate its tenth anniversary.
Although the committee was informed that some areas have a policy of excluding special interest meetings from their meeting schedules, no region reported written area or regional polices on this subject.
Final Observations

The Ad Hoc Committee on Special Interest Meetings understood almost from its beginning that resolving the issue of special interest meetings in Narcotics Anonymous might be impossible, that the varying opinions on the subject seemed to be irreconcilable, and that we might not be able to offer a perspective that would be so fresh and profound that the entire membership of NA would immediately accept our conclusions. We did, however, feel that if we were able to make some objective observations on the subject—devoid of passion and emotionalism—we might be able to perform a service. Here then are our conclusions:

Special Interest meetings have existed in Narcotics Anonymous for some time. There does not appear to be anything in the Twelve Traditions which cautions groups against holding special interest meetings, provided that the group has no requirement for membership other than the desire to stop using. Special interest meetings tend to survive and flourish in local NA communities where there is a need and desire for such meetings and do not exist in NA communities where there is no need nor desire.

In Narcotics Anonymous, the World Service Conference does not have the authority to dictate policy to groups, and regional and area service committees do not have policy-making authority over the decisions of their groups. The only authority present in the groups is a loving God expressed in a group's conscience.

The Ad Hoc Committee on Special Interest Meetings concluded that special interest meetings must be appropriate in some NA communities since they exist and flourish with little controversy in these communities. In NA communities where special interest meetings do not exist, and where the need for them is not apparent, there is no reason to create them.

The findings in the report remain true for Narcotics Anonymous today. In some areas, special interest meetings have expanded formats and topics while other areas continue to have no perceived need for these meetings. Groups, exercising their autonomy, are best suited to decide whether there is any necessity to have special interest meetings.


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Old 07-31-2006, 01:25 PM
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Also I have noticed that meetings (at least in my area) tend to develop there own personality on their own....some meetings are filled with a bunch of newcommers, some are predominantly women, some are predominantly young people, some are predominantly men, accross the lake in NOLA there are a few predominantly GLBT meetings.....I have been to all of these meetings and felt welcomed at them, but none of them are "special interest" meetings, they just naturally have a higher concentration of one group of people, there meeting names don't stress restrictions on attendance.

My home group for instance is mostly attended by young people in the area, our name is "Let It Bleed" sometimes a few older people show up....no problem whatsoever. However if we had named ourselves "Young and Restless" and denoted our selves as a "young person's meeting" the older people that attend our meeting on occasion would probably not come, and if they did would feel uncomfortable and the rest of the meeting would too. I have accidentally driven an hour and a half to go hit a meeting in a different town, and happened to show up at the club house's "womens only" meeting. Yes we were welcomed and they told us we could stay, but there was an uncomfortableness and some women there seemed a little ticked off 4 dude showed up.

All this controversy could be avoided by simply not segregating addicts in official NA meetings, that's all I'm saying.

Moontime-Correct me if I am wrong, I am kinda splotchy on my NA history but I'm learning, but weren't the board of trustee bullitins from the 80's like the one you posted never fellowhip approved? Were they ever brought up as regional motions at a WSC? I agree with some of them and if they are conference approved motions, then cool beans, but if they aren't then don't they just amount to the opinion of a small group of people rather than NA as a whole?
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Old 07-31-2006, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Moontime
Groups, exercising their autonomy, are best suited to decide whether there is any necessity to have special interest meetings.
See here is where the problem lies I believe that when people are involved in there trusted servant positions, sometimes it is taken like they are in control of how things are operated and they then go and do things because they feel they have the authority to do something. That is not what they are there for they are there to represent the Groups. So many times I have seen such a POWER Play that it makes me just sick. That is also why it says that we should be careful on who we allow to represent the groups. Anyway thought I would throw that in because the first post was more on the I than the WE.
namommy I'm trying to get a feel for an idea my homegroup has. (actually, I would like to see my homegroup follow through with)

Since we can't have special interest meetings because they feel someone would be turned away for gender, I thought since my homegroup has 2 rooms available to it, and a 3rd room where we keep the coffee pot, that we could have a women's meeting in one room, and a men's meeting in the other. That way, we can have a special interest meeting without the possibility of someone being turned away.
Just my 2 cents

Also when we have a business meeting here, and we are voting on things, I make sure that I don't vote on any of it that way it isn't said that I am in control it is the group that votes not me.
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Old 07-31-2006, 01:52 PM
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Actually the Bullitens are found on the www.na.org site, and they are very real. Some misinformation about those was the Fellowship did't approve them because most groups don't remember their Region bringing the Vote back because there were only 24 Regions that participated.

My question is still, Show me where it is a VIOLATION of any Tradition?

Different Rates of Illness, Different Rates of recovery. Ususally if I don't really understand something, I'll feed into the Na Sayers, today I will get the information before I judge.

Peace,
Todd J.
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Old 07-31-2006, 02:17 PM
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"Desire is our only requirement, and rightly so. Addiction does not discriminate. This Tradition is to insure that any addict regardless of drugs used, race, religious beliefs, sex, sexual preference or financial condition is free to practice the N.A. way of life. That only the desire to stop using is needed insures that no caste system will develop making one addict superior to another. All addicted persons are welcome and equal in obtaining the relief they are seeking from their addiction; every addict can recover in this program on an equal basis. This Tradition guarantees our freedom to recover."

I believe that special interest groups violate this tradition by stating that there is another requirement to be a member than the desire to stop using it puts empasis on age, gender, religion, sexual orientation or other factor besides the desire to stop using. The way I see it that is a violation of tradition 3. I am far from being alone on this matter.

What I'd like to know is this, WHAT PURPOSE DOES A SPECIAL INTEREST MEETING SERVE THAT COULDN'T (PROBABLY BETTER) BE SERVED THROUGH SPONSORSHIP AND FELLOWSHIPING?

About the bullitens, if only 24 regions voted on them, and all the other regions abstained, wouldn't those abstensions count as a NO vote? How many regions were around back then anyway? Did all 24 regions that voted, vote yes?
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Old 07-31-2006, 03:46 PM
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As anything else event today only 10% do the work. Getting involved is important if you dont want to ask questions later. Absaining is a Vote not counted, no participation. No mean NA, Yes means yes, Abstaining means no change. So majority rules, sometimes by Roberts Rules by 2/3 majotiy. The Fellowship is much larger today and much more diverse.

like has been sais, If it an HIV meeting, It doesn't say only HIV members are aloud to attend here, and with women, men, gay whatever, the personalities put that there. As the matter of fact, in Rochester there is a AIDS in recovery meeting and has many homegroup members that don't have AIDS. The message of recovery is always a reccurring theme. Meaning like I stated before, If someone with the AIDS problem feels they canot share in a regular open meeting, and there is an AIDS meeting that that individual can share and be with other member sharing the same difficulties, the message is carried, who am I to question that. So, how about Spanish speaking meetings, Should those be out too, They should learn to speak English, right.

Folks have dug deeper into this disease deeper than some can even adhere to, It takes some diffent ideas to get to the rate of recovery we expect them to be at.

Peace,
Todd J.
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Old 07-31-2006, 05:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Blake
Could a group form a specific religion meeting? what about a specific race meeting?
What about 'spanish speaking only' meetings? We have those in this area. I don't speak spanish so I can't relate.


No one in this area could feel left out unless they wanted to. We have 3 and 4 meetings every day of the weeks within a 10 mile radius of one another.

The meeting we are proposing is this.
My homegroup has access to 2 rooms and a 3rd room with the coffee pot.
We want to have a women's meeting in one room and a men's meeting in the other at the same time. No one would be turned away.
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Old 07-31-2006, 05:47 PM
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Wink

Originally Posted by namommy
The meeting we are proposing is this.
My homegroup has access to 2 rooms and a 3rd room with the coffee pot.
We want to have a women's meeting in one room and a men's meeting in the other at the same time. No one would be turned away.
I personally don't think that it is in violation of anything. We have the same set up in a meeting on Wednesday night here. This meeting has been around for a long time. We have three rooms and the men meet in one and the women meet in the other. Personally I don't contribute to the meeting because our literature says one addict helping another addict is without parallel.

I hear all the time men with men and women with women! No where in the first 103 pages of the Program of recovery does it say that. That stuff is treatment stuff, NOT NA. I don't oppose it, I don't participate in it that is my choice. I am not saying that it is wrong or right. I think that it just is. So if One female addict is helping another female addict that is too without parallel and it also says all you need to start a meeting is two addicts caring and sharing. Just my 4 cents this time

Love Vic
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Old 07-31-2006, 08:08 PM
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spanish speaking meetings are completely different than meetings that discriminate based on gender, age or sexual preferance. NA meetings are held in the language of the community they are involved in, french meetings in france german meetings in germany, spanish meeting ins communities with large spanish speaking populations. It is a neseccity b/c not everyone speaks english. they don't discriminate based on age, race, sexual identy, gender or religion. THe only requirement is a desire to stop using and the ability to understand spanish....wich in reality is the same as a normal engilsh speaking meeting, the desire to stop using and an ability to understand english.

Would a white person meeting fly? I personally think that it would be quite racist to start a white people in recovery meeting. I don't see a difference between that meeting and a men's or woman's or gay person's or christian's or buddhist's or young people's or old people's meeting. It's all putting reqirements on something other than the desire to stop using.

WHy can't the same goal be accomplished through sponsorship and fellowshiping?

I was at a birthday celebration tonight and I talked about this subject with a few people after the meeting, people who's recovery I respect tremendously, a few of them with 25+ years of recovery. THe are from the old school (which I respect tremendously) and their views were consistant that special interest groups violate traditions. I want what they have so I do what they do, I understand their point. I also understand the idea that some people feel they need a special meeting. I just personally believe they are against traditions.

I think we are just gonna have to agree to disagree on this yall.

It was a fun discussion.

Peace,
Blake

P.S. todd in our entire region, an abstension counts as a NO vote, I just assumed it was the same on the world level.
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Old 07-31-2006, 08:16 PM
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[quote=BlakeI
What I'd like to know is this, WHAT PURPOSE DOES A SPECIAL INTEREST MEETING SERVE THAT COULDN'T (PROBABLY BETTER) BE SERVED THROUGH SPONSORSHIP AND FELLOWSHIPING?

[/quote]

Blake has a point.

Many of us warm to the idea of feeling like we belong to a special group of people but if gay people or HIV positive people feel they have issues that nobody else can understand then maybe they need to form some other group and stop calling themselves an NA meeting.

I believe we overlook an important aspect of our recovery when we focus too much on our differences than our sameness.I personally enjoy the diversities I encounter at NA meetings and I believe meetings thrive on it.

Any (NA) meeting that bars entry from an addict with the "desire" is in violation of Tradition 3. There is no grey area there.

The World Service Board and it's devoted trustees may have sold us short with that outdated bulletin #18.
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Old 07-31-2006, 08:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Blake
... What I'd like to know is this, WHAT PURPOSE DOES A SPECIAL INTEREST MEETING SERVE THAT COULDN'T (PROBABLY BETTER) BE SERVED THROUGH SPONSORSHIP AND FELLOWSHIPING?
.. What has been found in my Area is that a SIG (SpecialInterestGroup) can help a newcomer feel comfortable and then can travel outwards to other groups to discover even greater recovery. A SIG probably wouldn't work in an Area without 2 or more meetings every single night. That allows choice.
.. SIGs have come and gone around here for many years. Women's, Men's, In Times of Illness, GLBT, etc. No individual SIG has survived the test of time. Except in a large meeting here that splits down into SIGs, and has done so for many years and survived! Why? Because it begins Together and ends Together.
.. What you said above, Blake, is probably correct. That is probably why SIGs do not survive long in my area. The SIG serves its purpose, and then the addicts move on. To other groups. To become sponsors. To help other recovering addicts. And maybe, just maybe...... because of a Special Interest Group.

Originally Posted by Blake
About the bullitens, if only 24 regions voted on them, and all the other regions abstained, wouldn't those abstensions count as a NO vote? How many regions were around back then anyway? Did all 24 regions that voted, vote yes?
.. It was just a survey, not a vote or group conscience issue, just a survey. 48 Regions were polled, 24 replied. That is what the bulletin was based on, just a question or 2. Read it, it's quite interesting.
.. hehe, I was so terribly young in my recovery when the question came out that I was ready to fly down to Van Nuys and tell them World Services folk who what where when AND why they should do things. Then I'd tell 'em how to do it.
.. ah well, this question was asked 17 years ago and I'd bet my last medallion (before I give it away) that it'll be asked again. Me? I just gotta learn to stop rummaging thru my old type-written Area minutes just to prove to someone that that question was already asked and answered, goshdarn it!!!
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Old 07-31-2006, 09:14 PM
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Special Interest meetings have existed in Narcotics Anonymous for some time. There does not appear to be anything in the Twelve Traditions which cautions groups against holding special interest meetings, provided that the group has no requirement for membership other than the desire to stop using. Special interest meetings tend to survive and flourish in local NA communities where there is a need and desire for such meetings and do not exist in NA communities where there is no need nor desire.
As long as everyone agrees that the only requirement for membership is a desire to stop using, then there should be no discussion. NO addict can be turned away from a meeting. It is cut and dry....
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Old 08-01-2006, 09:06 AM
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Ask someone for thoughts you get an opinion- Opinionsare like A$$holes, everybody has one.

Ask some on to show me with literature, you might get the answer.


Peace,
Todd J.
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Old 08-01-2006, 03:49 PM
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Oh boy,
I didn't mean to get such a heated debate started.
sorry.

We decided we are going to go ahead with the change and hold 2 meetings at the same time. Women's and men's.
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Old 08-01-2006, 06:33 PM
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Originally Posted by godsonmyside
Opinionsare like A$$holes

There everywhere! lol

Seems the NA tives are restless.

It's pretty hot here and theres no immediate relief in site.

Be nice if everybody sucked on an ice cube and pondered how it would be to hear what they were saying if somebody else said it to them.

just a suggestion not an opinion. lol
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Old 08-01-2006, 06:59 PM
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oh yeah .. special interests groups .. I liked the part about the autonomy of the group playnig into the decisions to have SIG's. I also liked Blake's question about special issues being best served by sponsorship, however taking into account that there are those members of NA who can't find an appropriate sponsor to deal with their special interests, or those who balk at sponsorship until they are absolutely ready to trust someone. i've been to meetings of special interests groups and was made to feel welcome as any meeting I've ever attended. I also found that I could relate to the feelings expressed even if I never had any experience with the particular area of focus.

My understanding of the intent is that as long as the groups primary purpose is upheld, the autonmomy of the group allows for a meeting format of it's choice. In as long as no addict is ever intentionally made to feel separate or unwelcome at any meeting, there is nothing in the traditions that indicates a special interest group is in violation.

It is the individual misinterpretation of how to apply spiritual traditions that causes all conflict ......... because spiritual principles are never in conflict.

Look on the bright side if we didn't have any spirit we wouldn't be able to get into these conflicts. We are way better off than back in the days when our lack of spirit was causing all the conflicts.
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Old 08-02-2006, 03:54 AM
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got a bucket of ice cubes here.
good idear there, but it got me to thinkin bout the other side of midnight, lol.


only meeting i was ever turned away from was an american indian meeting. guess my tan wont let me pass. no biggie.
since then i seen all kinds, i don't go to womans meetings either, but i was allowed to sit in one when i really needed it.i can see a need, whatever the "literature" says.
alot of people can't relate to scooter trash and what we did. it's nice to hit a meeting full of tramps, be able to share, and not have any one judge.
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Old 08-02-2006, 05:45 AM
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[quote=Gooch]My understanding of the intent is that as long as the groups primary purpose is upheld, the autonmomy of the group allows for a meeting format of it's choice. In as long as no addict is ever intentionally made to feel separate or unwelcome at any meeting, there is nothing in the traditions that indicates a special interest group is in violation. /quote]


Gooch, I agree that every group has the right to exercise their own autonomy and structure meeting formats to include discussions on particular issues but I cannot see how autonomy gives a group the right to turn people in need of help away from a meeting. Addict can die because of that kind of thing.
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Old 08-02-2006, 08:04 AM
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I still believe it is against the 3rd tradition to have a special interest meeting. I can accept that they very well may help out some people, but the traditions are not negotiable, do the ends justify the means?

I'm still holding on to this 3rd tradition violation b/c of this, What is the intent of a special interest meeting? For similar people in recovery to have a place to get together with each other without the influence of people outside that group. A men's meeting is started with the intent that it is for men's issues specifically and that women should not come to it. Of course if a woman were to show up at a Men's meeting, she would not (or should not) be turned away. It jsut seems to me that the primary purpose of a men's meeting would be to carry the message to the MALE addict that still suffers.

I fully believe that fellowshiping of men with men is a very valuable part of my recovery, that is why I hang out with men, I call men and talk to them, we set up camping trips with men only, I am really good friends with the men in my sponsorship family, during football season we have a bbq for the men in my family at my sponsor's house just about every saturday LSU is playing away. I have a large support system of men in recovery. I got this by them reaching out to me when I was new, by me reaching out to them when I needed them and by reaching out to the new men that come in like people did for me when I was new....I just believe that this is the better way to deal rather than having a exclusive men's meeting.

Todd, yes this is my opinion and I realize everyone has one. THe bulletin that you stated was fellowship approved, never was taken to a vote, it was simply a survey and half the regions didn't participate, so I'd say that the bulletins are simply opinions also. Show me in the literature where it says "special interest meetings are okay to have" so that I can put the issue to rest.

Laurie, I'm glad you brought up this discussion, I have learned somethings from it that I did not know before. Congrats on getting your changes passed, if you are gonna have a special interest meeting, your way is probably the best way to get it done so that everyone feels welcomed.

"in recovery we can disagree without being disagreable" -not sure who said this, but my sponsor really likes this quote.
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Old 08-02-2006, 09:34 AM
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Todd, yes this is my opinion and I realize everyone has one. THe bulletin that you stated was fellowship approved, never was taken to a vote, it was simply a survey and half the regions didn't participate, so I'd say that the bulletins are simply opinions also. Show me in the literature where it says "special interest meetings are okay to have" so that I can put the issue to rest.
So twist it up some turn it this way some. Show me were it says that special intrest meetings a violation. You can't grft a new idea on a closed-mind! If it helps just one addict, the need was for the GREATER Good.

The choice of membership rests with the individual. We feel the ideal state for our fellowship exists when addicts can come freely and openly to an N.A. meeting, whenever and wherever they choose, and leave just as freely if they want.
If a memeber does choose not to attend a "Special Intrest Group, fine, but, it is stll NOT a violation of Traditions. If you want to find out more show up, if you haven't been, what can you really say. Non-existing virtue.

THe bulletin that you stated was fellowship approved, never was taken to a vote, it was simply a survey and half the regions didn't participate, so I'd say that the bulletins are simply opinions also.
It is still a colective conscience, An Adhoc Committee apointed for the soul purpose to inform the Fellowship.

We have heard the phrase "principles before personalities" so often that it is like a cliche. While we may disagree as individuals, the spiritual principle of anonymity makes us all equal as members of the group. No member is greater or lesser than any other member. The drive for personal gain in the areas of sex, property and social position, which brought so much pain in the past, falls by the wayside if the principle of anonymity is adhered to.
The ones who are violating the Traditions are the ones running around sauying whats right and wrong passing along Misinformation, Not leaving their personal Agenda at home.

Peace,
Todd J.
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