Sexual predators in the fellowship

[kj3880]

There is a man in our area who is in his 50's and he has a thing for NA's younger women (teens-early 20's). Especially newcomers. If they come in new and crying, he makes a point to share after them in a "caring" type way, then runs up to them after the meeting to "comfort" them and offer rides to meetings, or even a "place to stay until you get on your feet, just as friends.." The last such woman shared with me that he kicked her out at 2am when he came into her room again and she put her foot down and told him "I'm not ever going to sleep with you so stop trying me." He told her "nothing in life is free, so get the he!! out of my house, now." She had to move with her two-year-old immediately!

Anyway, he was on the prowl again tonight, after a new 20-year-old who'd picked up her white key tag not five minutes before his approach. He ran up to her so fast none of the women could get in there.

I heard him asking her if she needed a ride and then he asked for her number. I went up and walked between and told her "Welcome-let me give you my number. I can give you a ride home if you need one." I then turned to him and said quietly "New women need to stick with women." He called me a "hater." Then, in the parking lot, he walked past me and muttered "I didn't know you turned into one of the brigade of NA old-timer, c@ck-block b!tches. I thought you had to have at least ten years clean to get that bitter."

Wow. I'm not bitter. Just concerned. I told him that and he said "There are no victims, only volunteers." I don't quite see it that way. To me, we are so confused and needy when we come in that we need some help, maybe some protection from a predator.

Has anyone else had this experience? Do you all think I overstepped my boundaries? I hate to see people use NA as a place to prey on the weak and naive, men or women.

Love,
KJ

[REZ]

This sort of thing is reprehensible but it happens. No, you did the right thing. It is important to protect vulnerable newcomers from 13th steppers.

[Lenina]

Good for you, kj. He's obviously a sick one. Are there other women in the group who can keep an eye on him? Any old timer guys who might have a word with him? This is so wrong on so many levels.

Thanks for taking care of the new comers.

Love,

Lenina

[Gmoney]

I don't think it...I know you did the right thing.

[EuroDrunk]

All you can do is what you believe to be the right thing at any given moment. And check your motives before taking action. If you are working your program, chances are it will be the right thing!

Keep up the good work!

[huntsober]

I only wish that this person would stop at this point but history says he will not. Follow up with informing the other males with time to be on the watch out. Follow up with other female with time as well. Its sad that fellowship (s) eat our young but we must all pull together and not apart. I have seen manytimes that these sick people get a sponsor and get informed and work the steps thus become a blocker themselves.

I too struggle in my area with men doing this...In fact one has 20 years and teaches it to all his sponsees. We continue to block and inform others. Keep up the fight! Molesting handicapped people is not right!

[kj3880]

Thank you all for your support and kind words. The man I described above, JR, isn't the only one, just the worst of the newcomer-hunters. There is a trio of men about 50-55 years old in my area who date newcomers all the time. One of them is expecting a baby with one newcomer and already left her for another one. And the expectant Mom has relapsed! The poor baby will be born heroin-addicted, I suppose.

It seems to me like when any of this sick trio picks up a newcomer, the newcomer always relapses when the new sexual relationship fails.

These three sick men are all friends, never miss a dance, and I always hear them repeating that oft-heard slogan "There are no victims, only volunteers!" They keep each other sick by reassuring each other that what they are doing is fine. I heard one of them, S, say that at a dance, and I told him, "I'm so glad I didn't go out with you when you asked me when I was new. If you have done so much step work, as you always sharing, why are you only interested in women that are spiritually immature? Why don't you seek out a woman more your age and experience level? Too much of a challenge for you?" He responded that "there is nothing in the literature that says that dating newcomers is wrong. I have 16 years clean, so I must be doing something right. I enjoy younger women's bodies. Everyone has a choice."

Anybody got any good literature quotes that apply to serial newcomer-daters?

Love,
KJ

[andyaddict]

First I must say, you cracked me up on that one... some dude calling you a c()ckblocker... ROFLMAO... I loved it!

Most of you may already know that I am not “anti-predator" but rather “pro-responsibility." The following is my position.

Originally Posted by kj3880

The last such woman shared with me that he kicked her out at 2am when he came into her room again and she put her foot down and told him "I'm not ever going to sleep with you so stop trying me." He told her "nothing in life is free, so get the he!! out of my house, now." She had to move with her two-year-old immediately!

Here, in this instance, I would encourage said woman to share this experience with the group. I'd be there for support and to back them up if need be. In this way, whether she shared his name or not, most would figure it out or come up and ask. In that way he seals his own fate by means of public exposure. I need not police.

Originally Posted by kj3880

Anyway, he was on the prowl again tonight, after a new 20-year-old who'd picked up her white key tag not five minutes before his approach. He ran up to her so fast none of the women could get in there.

"None of the women could get there"? Well, maybe his will is stronger to get there first. Many times just passing by DURING the meeting and whispering a desire to talk after the meeting will keep her (his) focus on ME after the meeting rather than the alleged predator. Personally though, I would rather try to make my message of hope more attractive such that they seek ME out rather than me having to seek them out. Here I prefer to rest upon attraction rather than promotion.

Originally Posted by kj3880

I heard him asking her if she needed a ride and then he asked for her number. I went up and walked between and told her "Welcome-let me give you my number. I can give you a ride home if you need one." I then turned to him and said quietly "New women need to stick with women." He called me a "hater." Then, in the parking lot, he walked past me and muttered "I didn't know you turned into one of the brigade of NA old-timer, c@ck-block b!tches. I thought you had to have at least ten years clean to get that bitter."

In my opinion this was a good move. This was representative of responsibility. I think it sad when there is a hot, young chick sharing her ignorance, fear, and purity that the women in the meeting not notice or worse yet, care. Sometimes (just to be a dick) I'll interject if they ask for a sponsor or someone to console them by either raising my hand with an evil grin and/or spouting off "Twenty Bucks!" The reaction from the group is usually pricesless.

That sarcasm usually get's the bi#ches off their a$$ to step up. What this does is make a point in the meeting that if the women don't step up that there will be horny dudes who will.

Again, I loved it that you pissed him off. However I believe exposure would do a better job. Start to find ways to make this behavior a topic in meetings, but share from the wellness not the illness on the issue. People will easily tell if your and angry, bitter bi#ch or a spiritual, mature, and responsible member. In this way, either he will change his behavior or will go find some other trolling grounds.

Originally Posted by kj3880

Wow. I'm not bitter. Just concerned. I told him that and he said "There are no victims, only volunteers." I don't quite see it that way. To me, we are so confused and needy when we come in that we need some help, maybe some protection from a predator.

HA HA HA... sounds like he read my book. However, consequently, this phrase can also apply to him. As he behaves this way in public, he subsequently sets himself up, or volunteers, for public scrutiny does he not? His comments to you about being a "c@ck-blocker" and them not a "victim but volunteer" has now become YOUR experience. You are now welcome to share that experience in the next big meeting both you and he attend.

Looks as if he volunteered for that huh? lol

Originally Posted by kj3880

Do you all think I overstepped my boundaries? I hate to see people use NA as a place to prey on the weak and naive, men or women.

Love,
KJ

Overstepped, no. However as you mature in regards to this topic might I suggest you inventory your motives and try to wash your motives with spiritual principles and express it that fashion. Even if you were to say you "hate that people use NA..." you do, in essence, impose the label "hater" upon yourself.

Find other words to express your feelings - positive, spiritual ones, and as you practice this you too will grow spiritually and become a more attractive member of NA as well as a more effective vehicle for carrying our message to the still suffering addict – for that is all we have to offer.

in loving service and fellowship
andyaddict
Los Angeles

[WA_NA_Survivor]

Good on you KJ for making it known, everyone will stay in their dysfunction while it is ignored. There should be zero tolerance for this because NA meetings are supposed to be a place of refuge and solace for all - they're not there for dating purposes let alone the demented fantasies of creeps who prey on vulnerable women.

He should be confronted about it in a conscience meeting with several guys present and if he continues in this way, at the very least some words of warning about predatory members should be included in the Secretary's opening comments before the preamble is read. I recall one meeting where a guy was actually served a trespass order enforced by police for his predatory behavior.

[Threshold]

Thanks for this. I think I unwittingly became the "volunteer" to such in the past year..We didn't make contact through meetings but he is NA and we met at work and he knew I am new to recovery and was impressed by his clean time, spirituality etc.

I kick myself because when I committed to recovery, I pledged no new relationships for two years, but then told myself since technically I knew him prior and we had sort of started a relationship (and ended it, then picked up again later) that it didn't count. I mean I couldn't be expected to swear off of relationships I was already in now, could I?

But I see now how stupid and willing I was (I own my own behavior and choices) but yeah...he snowed me too.

Now I know, no matter how scary and how I may be tempted, I have to recommit to my two year pledge. Sigh, big huge sigh. MAYBE by that time I'll have enough sense to make a half way decent choice when it comes to a new sexual relationship, maybe I'll have to sign on for another period of abstinence.

Kicking myself for not honoring my original pledge, but it's just another area that I have relapsed (oh how I hate that word) in. I don't have much clean time (if any) behind me. Multiple addictions and some of them (eating disorders, etc) are hard to gague clean time in.

Also, just had major surgery (abdominal) so I have had to use pain killers and my eating schedule and diet were compromised by forces beyond my control (hospitalization, drs orders, etc)

So really I think I will have to start over when it comes to clean time when my physical recovery is well under way (probably 8-10 weeks)

I am not currently 12 stepping, though I've been thinking more and more about going that route. I am working a dedicated recovery program, but I see the value and need of having peers as well. SR has been a godsend.

Thanks for this thread, the word NEEDS to get out, be repeated and repeated and repeated. Because I have multiple addictions, it was easy for me to identify that sexual issues are one of them, I KNEW I needed to abstain from relatinships...and simply chose to ignore my own good sense. Learned the hard way. At least I learned (of course ask me again in two years if I REALLY learned)

At this rate...wonder if I'll ever be clean, I've got so many areas I have to police all at the same time, but I take them on one by one, and police myself so that I don't let a slip in one area turn into a relapse in all.

Of course I fail there over and over and have to pick myself up, dust myself off and start all over again. But I do. daily. and more often than daily, and work recovery whether I am clean or not, because I do believe that day will truly come and I want to be ready with some solid life skills and a great support system when it does.