Religophrenia, schizophrenics would focus on religon and the bible.

[wonderboy75]

If you know someone with schizophrenia or dimentia of some sort, a distorted or ununderstandable reality I would like to talk to you.
I would really like to talk to anyone who beleives they may have schizophrenia in a mild form or strong whatever...but is focused on either the positive or negative of religon or the bible.

Religophrenia, i'll call it.

We can help each other understand if we talk about the secrets of our minds.

I have found peace in my schizophrenia, have you?

Love to talk to ya

PEACE<LOVE>UNITY<RESPECT p LOVE< IMPORTANTLY MOST AND HOPE FAITH, and>

[pedagogue]

That is an interesting idea. I am not too familiar with the two meeting, outside of religious-themed psychosis, which can present in people who have psychotic episodes. I would be interested in hearing more about how you see the two converging. I am not very well versed in the bible, nor do I have schizophrenia, but the topic intrigues me.

-pedagogue

[wonderboy75]

Okay then I'll discuss it abit.

I find myself to be a rare schizophrenic. I exhibit no signs at this time except something that is common among schizo's, I'm very religous, actually spiritual is more accurate. But when I was in the pysch ward, all three times there was a number of patients who turned to the bible as I had.
I remember having the most vivid conversations about the bible and feeling that the people I was talking to were on a different level of understanding. They too were considered ill. It was interesting.
While I was in an American Hospital I requested to talk to a priest, I guess they liked me because one actually came. His name was Micheal. He prayed with us, some sang he brought us on a spiritual journey. Many others turned to their faith and I remember the guy who left before me was so sure of his faith.

I've talked to other people outside of the hospitals who think they may be slightly ill but feel comfortable with it...
These people have told me about how they can feel the presence of angels or see auras.
They too have a stong passionate spiritual faith.
It seems to be more common when people talk about but no one talks about it.

Schizophrenia is the name.
I've been saved through Jesus but beyond the understanding of another individual...
Except maybe a priest, who has the gift.

I have found there to be two types of people.
The first derive their spirituality from the people around them, they go to church because they are reassured about their faith by others.
The second, (this is me) derives their spirituality from within. Since I've been saved I know that there is nothing that will happen throughout my existence that will change my faith, my love for God. Nothing. Especially not Death.

People clash when they talk about religion most of the time. But they share the basics. One thing for sure, when group 1 mixes with group 2 there will be disagreements. Obviously, this is how a holy war happens. But by talking about it we can find others who have similar passion. (Not the same but similar)
Those beliefs when shared honestly in expression of passion for faith are true. We can learn more about what miracles the spirit of Jesus who lives in us all. AND what he's been doing for our loved ones.
If someone reads this who has spent time in a church by themselves, (and you probably derive your spirituality from within but I could be wrong). When you enter an empty church(i find empty to be more awe inspiring) do you not feel...that undescribable feeling that is God's presence?

My schizophrenia which is characterized by hallocinations (both visual and auditory), I had auditory which was a voice in my head. My illness lead me thousands of miles away from home, quitting a good job, telling noone where I'd gone, walking naked through a busy city why...because deep down I new that my destiny counted on listening to this voice. It tested me..I beleive I have passed so far and hope I am ready when the time comes again. No matter what the good voice told me to do everything worked out.

This is why I my favorite passage makes sense.
"In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God"
John 1:1

Explanation: Before the universe existed God was still here. A light in the dark.(In the beginning was the word) next, we were created in Gods image so "the Word was with God" also makes sense...meaning even when there was nothing there was a voice. Maybe an auditory hallucination..lol. Finally and the Word was God. That voice in our heads is God. I hear it. So do others.

If you ever hear it, follow it with all your heart. When our body falls away(when we die physically) I believe every one of us will hear it, some for the first time.

Knowledge is power, that is why I openly tell people I'm schizophrenic. I need to gain more spiritual knowledge from the people around me. So far so good.
Think outside the box.

Last thing I have to say, suppose you don't think you believe in God.
Listen to yourself talk on a day to day basis or better yet ask someone to correct you when you do the following:
If you say Jesus Christ, or Oh my God, or Holy Jesus, or what in heavens name or anything like these...any references to God..
ask yourself why you used his name, did you even think about it or deep down inside did the Spirit of Jesus suddenly escape you for a second.
Interesting eh?

If it isn't I apologize for being dull.

I'd love to hear some opinions and stories, please respond.

[best]

There is a bible verse that tells of letting those who eat only vegtables be left in contentment of their small portions. (paraphrased)

I grew up in a church the spoke of the Holy Spirit but the depth of things was never brought forward. Once I started reading the bible and seeking the answers on my own...aside from what men would say they believed.... (looking outside of religion and going direct to God) I found a whole depth of things beyond anything I had ever been told of in my youth.
You say Schizophrenia and a depth of understanding.
I don't have Schizophrenia but I find a depth of understanding.
Where others dine on vegtables, I find I have a 7 course meal.
The baptisim of the Spirit. The reaching a point of Sanctification.
I have seen Miracles and felt a presence that many a time I felt that if I shared and told others about them, others may think I need see a Dr. Things beyond understanding where even though I have seen or felt them, even I questioned them at a point in time.
Where you say you have Schizophrenia and may also be feeling the indwelling of the Holy Spirit… maybe that is having you think the two are connected.
There is a guy at my church who has Schizophrenia but as of yet has he said to feel that indwelling.
Jesus said He would send the Counselor, the Intercessor, The Holy Spirit of God.
With His sending and filling my mind, heart, and soul, I have found life more abundant as Jesus told us.
For I have come to give you life and life more abundant.
Try looking at things from a singular standpoint. Look at your growth in things of the Spirit as being separate from other parts of your life. See what you find.

[splendra]

Wow....years ago my brothers came up with a coke deal scheam and they wanted my mom to sell some of her property to finance it (of course they told her it was some business deal) I found out that it was all about coke and tried to convince my mom not to do it. My brothers knew they needed me out of the way so they slipped me some LSD enough to get the inhabitants of a smal town high. I ended up in a psyc ward. Prior to me going though I started reading the Bible. The words in it were so sweet and I just wanted to take them in and live them. I did not know I was high on LSD.I thought I was hung-over because I drank at that time in my life. I was having a beautiful experience but, my brothers were watching me waiting for the right moment to have me committed.

Some of the things I thought still stick with me today such as the complete majesty of the Lord and His mercy. While I was high I felt like the wind and very much at one with God it really was an incredible experience for me prior to going to the psyc ward and being filled with thorazeen. I wish that I could have just been watched until I came down because the drugs they gave me messed me up more than the LSD. I was told by the shrinks that my experience seemed to have symptoms very much like that of Schizophenia. I know I heard Gods voice speaking to me how ever I did choose to not get into it with the shrinks because I wanted out of the hospital...

Of course my mom did sell the property(and of course she got screwed) while I was in the hospital and my brothers could never quite look me in the eye the same way after that....

[pedagogue]

Hmm....I'm not sure where I fall in all of this. On the one hand, I know the importance of spirituality, and I would never think to question someone's spirituality because it is such an individual thing. On the other hand, I have faith (no pun intended) in the methods of psychology: what constitutes psychosis, Conscious vs. Unconscious vs. Sub-Conscious, etc.

Wonderboy75 talked about his experiences of how spirituality and his schizophrenia came together, and I can see where he is coming from. Splendra mentioned her run-in with LSD, and the fact it was similar to some symptoms of schizophrenia (it was actually a drug-induced psychosis involving hallucinations and delusions). High levels of LSD is unpredictable and can definately cause serious enough problems where a short-term inpatient stay seems like the best course of action. (Not knowing it was a short term drug induced psychosis)

I would be skeptical of anyone who thinks god speaks to them in such a forward way...but I can't question the fact that god acts in ways that we may not understand, and the fact that there can be a connection.

Religion (and in a related way....culture) and psychology is a fine line to walk. I am still trying to figure out how to negotiate that....but it seems to be a constant process.

-pedagogue

[Chy]

Very interesting wonderboy. As an academic I try to remain logical, as one with a spiritual foundation I have to wonder. Thanks for your thoughts.

[Captain Morgan]

I have never been diagnosed schizophrenic, or with any other mental disorder, but I do believe everything in the brain (physical) has a spiritual root. I believe everything in our physical world relates to something in the spiritual world, and I don't think the brain is any different. However I don't claim to begin to understand all of this.

I don't see or hear anything like angels or auras, but yet where do my thoughts come from? Can chemicals in my body and my brain bring about thougts and beliefs? Perhaps they can, but I still don't believe they constitute their origin. If we are just random beings, then what are we more than animals, living by our perceptions and sensations? If this is true, I can't believe it. A power has placed me here, and He compels me to believe I am guided by Him. We choose in our life, and yet we don't. We choose to believe, and yet we don't. No, we are compelled to believe, or perhaps compelled to not believe. Something outside of ourselves drives us and motivates our will. How often do we choose with the ability to fully determine the outcome? How do we know if we'll have our next breath? Show me someone who can defy death, and prevent its will, and that person may be able to fully determine the outcome of their decisions(s).

Schizophrenia is the name.
I've been saved through Jesus but beyond the understanding of another individual...
Except maybe a priest, who has the gift.

I understand what you're saying here, and I don't see why that is the exclusive ability of a priest. I believe God makes men what they are, and I also believe He will reward each of us according to the stewardship of our lives He's given us. Priests are lifted up by the praise of men, and are not above the condemnation of God, neither are they without His praise if they are found just by Him. I can be a priest by my own will, but I can't be found just without the grace and mercy of God.

There seems to be a homogenization of religion and spirituality, and the scientific world with the spiritual one. In my opinion, these do not mix, and yet they can exist within the same world; just another paradox of life. Spirituality, and for example Christianity, can be tainted by relgion. Religion is a type of worship, and it many times is manipulated to be as vain as what it "hypocritically" preaches against. Likewise, the spiritual world may be tainted by its physical observers (scientists or philosophers, relying on empirical data or evidence). I don't see why science should have to be supported by the Bible, or the Bible by science. Let scientists and philosophers, and those that believe in them, put their faith in the physical world we live in. Let Christians, and those that believe in Him, believe God is the creator of all, and has the power to create and rule the world according to his prerogative. It seems like a good way to seperate conflicting, and many times contrary, perspectives.

[Gooch]

I used to feel certain that people who had ( for lack of a better term) "extrasensory" experiences were either around the bend or were tricksters using their abilities to prey on others,

When i heard people relating their spiritual experiences and assuring me that they actually felt the presence of God, or were lifted out of harms way by angels, I percieved that as enthusiasticn recount.

I thought well they are just so happy to have a new life that they tend to be overly dramatic.

Shortly after I got clean for the right reasons and having made the choice to turn my will and my life over tp the care of the God of my understanding, I had trouble sleeping one night and a wave of fear came over me like none I've ever felt.

I was so tired I couldn't keep my eyes open but every time I drifted into that convergence between wakefulness and sleep, I literally had black/grey woodcut visions of what I percieved to be tortured souls writhing in agony, Some were skewred on stakes, others staggering under an ivisible weight, but the one thing in common was the magnitude of the suffering they endured. Each time I would begin to glimpse that, my heart woulkd pound and I'd start awake trembling. I finally called a friend and explained what was going on, that I was very sure I was either enduring some sort of spiritual battle and needed some prayers, or was going to nee a ride to the psychiatric center.

After I hung up the phone, i verbally commanded "my demons" to leave, that I was aligned with the true bringer of light and love now..

Withiin a half hour a sense of relaxation came over me and I was able to sleep peacefully.

This wasn't a nihght mare or bad dream... I am convinced that up til that point my spirit was still up for grabs and that when (whatever we may call it addiction, the devil, the evil inside) saw me getting close to the contract with the pen, there was a last ditch concentrated effort to swing me around.


10 years later when I lay in the road after a motorcycle accident, I remember some of the chatter ion my head as I tried to find something to hang onto to keep me from panicking or going into complete shock.

And a feeling as a warmth, but somehow with words filled me up with the knowledge that everything was going to be fine and I would "know what to do".

They were going to transport me to a hospital 4 miles away but asked me if I had a choice and mentioned the hospital 8 miles away. I chose that one, possibly because I was more familiar with it.

What I don't remember considering was that thdere was a detox unit there, but later on after I had told the doctors and nurses over an over that I was an addict and didn't want any pain meds other than non narcotic, I was left alone for a while.

A nurse came in and asked me if I wanted anything ....

what I really wanted at that second was dope, but the words that came out were "Could you call upstairs and check and see if so and so is working today ?( my friend that worked at the detox.)

He wasn't there but that little chain of events reminded me that I had signed that contract and the noteholder was still there looking out for me.

I've heard some interesting things said at meetings and oe of them was "none of us is exactly a big ol bowl of mental health"

I'm sure that the electrochemical balance of my thought processing engine has had the equivalent to sugar in the gas tank, and I've dropped the case on the floor a few times pretty hard too. I really have a difficult time holding a ruler up and measuiring anyones mental health .. by anybodies yardstick. I have an ex wife that exhibits mutiple personalities .. Very polite, intellectual, and pleasant to converse with....

until things don't go the way she would have them.


This is an amazing universe .. 20 years ago I had to stick my finger in a hole and yank a dial around to make a telephone call. The other day my new phone that I ordered over the internet showed up. It has a camera and responds to my voice to call my friends.

The only thing that I am certain of is that there are rules that govern matter, and I didn't make them up. Something way bigger than us evolved order out of chaos.

Fear of not being good enough for whatever/whoever laid down those rules made me crazy for a looong time.

[mackat]

i tend to see the brain as an evolved organ. evolution is the process of developing survival/procreating strategies to enhance the odds of genetic sucess.

However, in no way can that genetic 'determinism' explain WHY we have become self aware beings.

Or even to explain self awareness

When i come to those questions, i enter the realm of spirituality.
And, for me, when i enter that realm, i enter it often as ARTIST.

That is the area where i can 'safetly' allow me n god to fuse.

the rest of the time its too easy for me to get me n god confused. And me believing/acting that i am god has created waaay too many problems in my life.

But music and poetry and photos and painting and writing....i don't have to care one tiny bit that you don't 'get it'.....

[Gooch]

Originally Posted by mackat

That is the area where i can 'safetly' allow me n god to fuse.

the rest of the time its too easy for me to get me n god confused.

me and God fused as compared to me and god confused ... ?


the more i reread that the more i like it..

[toforever]

To wonderbuy75 and all who may read this:

My life is not understood by anyone and not even myself, but they (my family, friends, doctors, and spirtual leaders suchn as priests and the church) will often try to put you into categories and areas that they can understand. This is mainly for there peace of mind try to understand. They mean no harm, so try not to start argument or to much controversy with them. The Church itself I have had difficulties with, but its not about right or wrong and opposition.

Yet the people around me have often imposed their beliefs and feelings on me that I know (for certain many times are not related to the issue). Its hard to deal with. They also never fully listen to me when I try to talk to them about whats going on. Much I understand, because I can't express these things in an understandable way to them.

I can relate to you a bit wonderboy although my view on it and my own experiences are surely not ther same. Thats Ok, and normal because its different for everyone just like llife. Its

interesting though, cause I came to your name because you posted on a thread about psychotic episodes and amphetimenes/drug use. The thread was about me!!! it was my best friend and really girlfriend at the time who posted it.

I came here first to check on her, but now I am using it as a way to give, grow, learn, connect, and express things. I find things seem to come to me in a strange unxplainable way and feel that God gives me what I need in its proper time.

Everyone absolutely refused to understand that my experiences were real and related to the spiritual diminsion and were determined I had a drug problem and or was insane and delusional. I have ended up in the hospital several times just because things I go through frequently not seen became exposed to the outside world and normal life.

Naturally they think you are completely crazy and they begin to express anger towards your behavior and it just escalates and aggrevates the situation, as it seems. This has been the case for me. Now mostly I am alone because of it not mixing well in normal activity I knew before and its become less dramatic to everyone.

Eventually I stopped even trying to relate it because nobody wanted to hear it, then it seemed to start affecting the people I loved so I really withdrew. It was so disgusting to me when that happened, and I didn't want to bring anyone else into this confusing and suffering I was going through.

I was and still do suffer enduring for God and for everyone else and that really has become my purpose and reasoning behind it. Amidst the suffering you don't really notice much because you become so focused on doing what God wills. I have committed to the will of God and that I have expressed clearly to all.

Yet my own slowness and lax to adhere to my commitment has hindered me. I find I am continually God conscious now as I put it, but when I sin it becomes willful now really, so it is more of a turning from God for the time. I can't do both together(its hard to do wrong with God on your mind) and tis turning of sort causing much distress afterwards coming back.

In this journey I have lost so much dear to me but gained so much too. Losing attachment to the things of the world is painful but you learn alot and the freedom when these things are lost from our neediness is wonderful, yet so hard to take and fully accept. I miss the way I was before and that part of the sacrifice as I see it.

I would never substitute God for all the world now, but I was very different before. Its been very confusiong and have made many mistakes, but this too is hard to even know except that you have made them.

I would like to help or give advice to anyone that might be encountering things of this nature and mayybe prevent certain things that are not needed or could lead you into trouble.

Its so difficult because nobody can understand and for the most part your spiritual intuition tells you to keep most to yourself. Without clear understanding, I don't want to talk about these obscure things in detail. So much is confusing to our human mind and logic cant seem to make sense of it, so speaking of it is what is said as "ineffible". Its really not possible to comminicate in words.

I am weary to give too much info like I said, but will be more willing to share when I know what you or anyone might be going through,

I will tell you or anyone especially therapists/doctors to look into this because its so misunderstood. There is an article or two if you do a search on the net about the differences between psychotic episodes and spiritual "mystical experieces"

The term "mystic" has developed a bad connotation, its just a word though, don't attach it to yourself to set yourself appart from the rest of humanity. I did this at first in a way, because I was rather foolish about it all and stilll very much habitually sinning and unknowledgable.

I think and it really seems like I made drastic mistake then but they are and I try to just accept what is. I was so excited at first that I ran so fast into it because it was very wonderful then and made me happy thinking I was doing servicee for the Lord. This has been my path but I feel like I should try to help anyone from falling into the same "not needed" mistakes. Some and all I think can be good and ways to learn though, so in this position I don't won't to interfere except to guide. I have no mentor but almost everone says that you should.

However the term "mystic" is just a way to describe people who are spiritually awakening really. There's alot of info out there.
Many have and do experience these phenomenon but you don't hear about them much because by our nature and its nature we are very silent about it.

We know our journey is very personal in a way and we must adhere to our situation directly with only carefully following others advice or experiences along the way. I have made mistakes here alot but something snaps me back when I realize something is not right.

Please think for yourself though because there are opposing forces I have found that prey on your trust too. Be careful, but if your going through it, I think its best to become knowledgable about it.

Remember how powerful the Devil is, he is much smarter than we are and can do things that are miraculous too, and at first our inclination is always amazement, and I myself atleast didn't question much at first whether it was God. I just fell into everything like it was always God, until some things started to manifest to me that seem to be inherently evil.

Stay close in prayer to God and proclamation of your beliefs. It seems the evil side is part of our growth in a testing kind of a way. It can pick at your weeknesses and sometimes its best not to try when you are confused to rconcile contradictions that will be opened up and you can feel completely lost and abandoned by things and concepts beyond imposed on you

So be all so careful,,, There is another realm beyond this world that comes like a different frequency. We start to pick it up for whatever reason as humans, but the signal is not clear and usually doesn't seem to have interest in helping you understand until you pull back a bit and make your position known well to this other realm of sort. Its hard to sort out things you can't understand and contradict what we know. We need an assemblence of truth to keep grounded.

A book I might suggest reading is by Saint John of the Cross "Dark night of the soul" Its an intimidating book, but it should be. its a dangerous subject matter, and we are very defensless being limited as we are. I myself still have not finished this book because after the first read which I don't remember, I really found my intuition and heart would tell me when I had gone a bit too far our past what I had known or advanced to.

So I would and have often stopped, I reread things, or put it down or things away for periods of time, and I come back to whatever I do. This goes with everything, when you start to be guided by God as we would wish and we start to lean and trust on our intuition in a constant state of prayer in a way

You can also start to feel your heart and learn more about what the different feelings might mean. Pay attention, and listen more than you speak inside as much as you can.

Like I said, I went into this very fast stumbling after. I have chosen to trust whats happening more now, rather doing as I please. Its so difficult and self control is difficult for me. The life I live also gives me moments of exctacy and it feels like you are literally in heaven.

Other times it can be like agony, its a life of surrendering the best we can. I go into trances often now and like someone said earlier a wakeful sleep or a sleeping wakefulness. Both are hard to interpret or even comunicate to yourself.

The important thing is to stay humble and you must keep bringing yourself back to truth in yourself, to what and who you are and what you know and can understand. You can get so lost in delving into the tempting world that is beyond. So take it slow and don't get drunk off it, but I would advice making the choice to keep going because resisting it is just avoiding the inevitable as I know about it all.

You learn you are really no more or less than anyone else and we all are on this journey, some just seem to start it before death as I see it, I think depending on our own nature and ability to live with it all and the degree of how much you can bear, God holds and guides us.

Its difficult because you feel so different, (good or bad) at the times, so your ego begins to inflate because you feel singled out in a way. Your personal ego neds to come to balance with truth and this I think is largely what causes the really difficult times. It seems its the way the Devil will play around with you I feel.

Know that this is real, I am not crazy but definately different now, and I could show tangible evidence of certain things, but my instinct here is to mostly keep it to myself, and not make to much of it. Be careful not to become to over-zealous about yourself and your progress. Its only God that is in control and will touch you and move you at his will for whatever reason.

Know its not by your own greatness, and your power in away shouldn't be abused. Is not to become involved with psychic experiences that will tempt you most likely. Remember its all from and by the Lord our refuge and ultimate goal in union. The veil will fall the more relaxed you get, and it will eventually be closer to you and your whole life. It can feel like be smothered a bit. As I said, this has been my experience.

I try to just be passive to the movements of the spirit and not pay too much attention to what its doing with me. When you start to look too much into it, it seems to just brings confusion and can incite fear which will grow into a real psychotic like episode. I don't think this is what God wills, but we try to always learn from everything and our hearts grow more in love.

Now my life has become a devotion to God even though I fail often. God is my only real security and Inow I need God for everything. these instances and this life in my own humanity, would be unbearable with God who I need to focus on more closely . My normal life as I knew will never be the same it seems and I have accepted that may be the case.

Respond please anyone who might be experiencing such things and try not to get into trouble in the world or beyond. These things hinder any good progress that we come to believe is work and service for the Lord.

Our suffering through it builds us and gives us some merit to ourselves that we are not having problems like everyone starts to think. we become more comfortable in experiencing and living this way that we just can't explain. We learn its best not to go into trying to communicate it all for the most part to others. Although we learn that we are together in this as human lives and should help were we can but not impose our own experiences too much on others.

You grow in awarenes, understanding, and wisdom but remember these are gifts from God and nothing to boast about. Its hard to balance.

May the Lord help you and protect you. Please ask me for any help, and I will do my best to relate only to you as I might be able to.

With love and concern,
I would like to help anyone having difficulty here or questions anyone might have....

Bradley
redshift7@msn.com

[toforever]

These asre statements that sruck me and can understand:

Originally Posted by wonderboy75

Okay then I'll discuss it abit.

"Those beliefs when shared honestly in expression of passion for faith are true. We can learn more about what miracles the spirit of Jesus who lives in us all. AND what he's been doing for our loved ones."

"Knowledge is power, that is why I openly tell people I'm schizophrenic. I need to gain more spiritual knowledge from the people around me. So far so good.
Think outside the box."

I'd love to hear some opinions and stories, please respond.

[toforever]

Ii'm trying to get these on one page, but cant figure it out

Originally Posted by mackat

Or even to explain self awareness

When i come to those questions, i enter the realm of spirituality.
And, for me, when i enter that realm, i enter it often as ARTIST.

That is the area where i can 'safetly' allow me n god to fuse.

the rest of the time its too easy for me to get me n god confused. And me believing/acting that i am god has created waaay too many problems in my life.

But music and poetry and photos and painting and writing....i don't have to care one tiny bit that you don't 'get it'.....

[toforever]

Originally Posted by splendra

Some of the things I thought still stick with me today such as the complete majesty of the Lord and His mercy.

This I feel very much and need

[toforever]

Originally Posted by best

"The baptisim of the Spirit. The reaching a point of Sanctification.
I have seen Miracles and felt a presence that many a time I felt that if I shared and told others about them, others may think I need see a Dr. Things beyond understanding where even though I have seen or felt them, even I questioned them at a point in time."

"Jesus said He would send the Counselor, the Intercessor, The Holy Spirit of God.
With His sending and filling my mind, heart, and soul, I have found life more abundant as Jesus told us.
For I have come to give you life and life more abundant.
Try looking at things from a singular standpoint. Look at your growth in things of the Spirit"

I feel the baptism by fire Jesus spoke of is the purification that begins when someone turns to live the truth that tries us until we are made whole

[toforever]

These are all things that I can relate to and are very difficult for us to go through alone. Mystical or unexplainable spiritual phenomenon sometimes seem to almost make us feel unwelcome in the church. The church is like a roock of stability and has been there for Christians through many generations bringing us the word and helping us understand

I am not attending now because the truth and Holy Spirit seem to have made me very receptive and sensitive so it has become difficult to participate in the Mass. I feel like I can't breath and my chest feels like its going to explode. Yet if I wasn't baptised and brought up in the church i'm not sure I would have any foundation to build on.

Anyone else going through these things?

Bradley
redshift7@msn.com