Borderline Personality Disorder

[deerwalk]

Anyone have experience with this? I believe I recently crossed paths with someone who has this condition. It was taxing, and actually became frightening. I've heard it's very difficult to treat.

[Eleison]

It's difficult to live with for the person who has it, too. It is also different for different people. So many combinations of dfferent symptoms. At heart, it can be seen as problems with attachment and relationship, usually due to early abuse and/or trauma. It also has difficulties in managing intense feelings, which can be frightening, indeed terrifying, for the person who is diagnosed with it. Which is why they frantically reach for all kinds of unhealthy defence mechanisms.

[deerwalk]

Unhealthy indeed. Inside of three weeks I was lied to, manipulated into spending time with the person as he would feel "a fit of depression" coming on if I wanted to go home and have some time to myself... He even criticized me for being a recovering alcoholic, while defending his past heroin addiction (among other things). I never threw his addiction in his face. It was awful, I actually became physically ill after a week around him. He abused his prescriptions and then pulled a knife out in front of me and threatened to hurt himself. It was INDEED terrifying. I was under 30 days into my own recovery. Then he started calling my friends behind my back to try and paint a different picture. Luckily, they weren't buying it. He still calls one of them every day, sometimes twice a day. Of course, he won't go to therapy. He thinks he's just extremely sensitive. Well, I'm a sensitive person and what that means to me is taking other people into consideration, not just my own needs! And I had a pretty screwed up upbringing, my mother used to scare me with knives just like this guy did, lots of abuse, etc. Then he kept trying to turn everything around on me- telling me I was aggressive and mean after I'd cleaned his whole apartment for him! He was angry because I questioned his lies. I'm just sick of attracting people like this. I don't deserve to be treated that way and it's his responsibility to get help. He told me he was diagnosed withthis condition and brushed it off by saying the therapist didn't know what she was talking about. All he did was lie and change stories around constantly. It's his responsibility to get help, not mine to let him abuse me because he has a condition. If I wanted abuse, I'd go back to my parents. I have some pretty "intense feelings" of terror myself after dealing with this guy.

[Isaiah]

Yes, I have it and I dated a girl for five years who has it. I have experience with borderline from both ends.

I suppose the self-esteem thing to do would be to contradict the idea that we're all crazy and hyper-reactive, but honestly I can't, completely.

Anyone who goes untreated with their BPD is likely going to have the same problems your friend has. I personally have a lower anger threshold, and usually let things bottle up, and then just take out on myself later. Actually, on an alcohol abuse note, I made a pattern out of drinking myself into oblivion and blaming the person I was with for "making me have to do it." A lot of my alcohol use was a way to manipulate people. I'd yell if people I was with wanted to go out without me and then yell at them for dragging me around, that was another big thing for me.

We react in such drastic and contradicting ways because one of the main problems we have to deal with is a huge difficulty in telling people what we want. That is pretty much the cornerstone symptom in BPD. The worst part for your friend is the real likelihood that he does in fact know that he made mistakes in scaring and hurting you, but the unfortunate paradox of the whole thing is that knowledge of such actions usually makes us feel worse and then we react in more drastic ways.

I hope your friend gets help. I have therapists and good medication that works quite well (normally, despite one very recent hospitalization.) And my ex is now married, happily so from what I've heard. I've had lots of good, healthy relationships (my last ex is still a best friend to me.)

So I would just remind everyone who might be reading this not to jump to too quick of a conclusion about what borderlines are like. And I don't mean to suggest at all that you, deerwalk, have done so in anyway. It all depends on the individuals level of functioning.

[Eleison]

I guess I have a different bundle of symptomology to what your friend has.
And I'm not formally diagnosed with it medically. Though it's something my therapist and I have discussed at various times.
Sorry.

But remember that the way he behaves isn't typical of everyone who has a diagnosis of borderline personality.

[WLDKATZ]

I have it.........still reading the post but all i can say is I dont think he is getting help for it I have been in counceling and taking meds for it and some times I have uncontroled moments, especially now that I am pg and unable to take some meds, but I have other ways of controlling those moments...........he has to be willing to understand as do you............you need to talk with my Edward........he can tell you!!!!

[WLDKATZ]

no your not bundling him wrong.............get anything you can to read about bpd............you'd besuprised just how many ppl do have it!!!

there is a movie out that my Edward asked me to watch, it is called Girl Interuppted. no way in hell I cried my eyes out and was like e that is me omg that is me.....I have too pulled knives ( MUCH TO MY HORROR later) sliced my wrists in frount of him did all sorts of things that were unforgivable, my last epasoide I broke his ear drum he still can't hear out of it and his nose.........why? I dont even know now

the reason why he blew off what she was saying is probally the same reason why I did when I was 17..........the person who told me said I had the Queen problem......i needed it to all be about me......

BPD takes many different outlooks from agression to sexual disfunction.....some are called sadist for a reason!!!!

good luck and stay away you have your own issues you don't need his problems as well................good luck!

[deerwalk]

It sounds like you all are seeing someone and taking some responsibility. That's great, I realize it's one of the toughest conditions to treat. This guy needs to get him self into treatment- he just won't. I even heard him lying to one of the doctors on the phone when he was requesting another prescription. Every time I brought up therapy he would say he went once a month. He had money for weed, but not for counseling. It left my head spinning. He texted me yesterday. I won't respond. Thanks for your input, I really appreciate it. I was told Borderlines could not be medicated.

[deerwalk]

And thank you so much for your honesty. These things are so difficult to discuss, they're very personal and I really, really appreciate your thoughts

[Vintersemestre]

My doctor thinks I have some kind of personality disorder too... I don't act like that though.

[deerwalk]

We are probably all a little quirky. I think it's whether or not you start using it to manipualte and hurt people.

[Alera]

I have experience with it. My mother suffers from BPD. Like most Borderlines, she refuses to seek treatment for it. Every time a therapist comes close to any of the BPD issues, she leaves never to return. She is, like many with BPD, an extreme manipulator.

Therapy can help those with Borderline if they are willing to actually work with their therapists. Its not easy and kudos to all of you.

[deerwalk]

Hmmm. He texted me a couple of days ago and then invited me as a friend on some forum at an e-mail address I never gave him. Disconcerting. I blocked him from my other e-mail, I may have given him the other one and forgotten...? I would think he'd get the idea I have no interest. I am convinced my mother is borderline or an outright sociopath- torturing the pets, stabbing my bedroom door as a child etc. It was like living with Karen Black after "Trilogy of Terror"...

[SistersHelp]

My sister has it. It's a nightmare for her, it's a nightmare for her family. (Different reasons, of course.) I don't think she has ever been happy in her whole life... and she hasn't appeared to want happiness for anyone else either. It's a disorder that is extremely difficult to treat... or in the words of my psychology professor... "Many psychologists refuse to work with BPDs because one day you are God; the next day you have their knife between your ribs." My heart breaks for my sister. But it also breaks for those who love her.

(I'm really sorry if this offends anyone here... I fully understand that all cases are different. I'm just talking about my own experience with my family member... Please don't think I am insulting or belittling.)

[deerwalk]

That's sounds rouhg Sistershelp. Thanks for your input. Thid guy lost another job and is e-mailing and calingme again- after the awful things he said... I don't get it but I guess that's part of the disorder. I hope he seeks help.

[SistersHelp]

What you've described sounds similar to some of the experiences I've had. My sister has never been able to keep a job beyond the probation period because she always has conflicts with people. And as for suddenly contacting you after saying awful things - this is typical of my sister too. She's even stood up in Supreme Court and lied to a judge about me and my husband, and then called a couple of days later to ask me to bring her some items she needed because she was low on cash. There is absolutely no end to her nerve! I try, most of the time, to remember that she has a mental illness and try not to blame her for her outrageous behaviour. But there's an important difference between placing blame and holding someone accountable. I do try to hold her accountable.

[deerwalk]

Wow Sistershelp,that's unbelievable. I hope someday there is effective treatment for these people, it's no fun for either party. I have seen two sides of this person, very attentative and thoughtful and then horribly insensitive, malignant and cruel.

[deerwalk]

I just want to thank you for all your input. What you've said sounds exactly like this troubled person I stepped away from. The outright lies, then trying to make it look like I imagined what I heard- The lack of being able to hold down a job, drug and alcohol abuse (not that that is specific to borderlines alone). I also have a pretty good feeling that he's lurking here on the site, as I made the mistake of revealing it to him as a resource back before I saw his true colors. He wouldn't be above it at all. He has no sense of other people's boundaries. Up until recently, he was caling another friend of mine daily and sometimes numerous times a day. Saying horrible things to me and then seeking contact with me is another telltale sign of his sickness. He called and left a message apologizing a couple of days ago, after he lost his job (he was only briefly employed). Even in the message though, he still tried to justify some of his shady behavior. I am so glad I have a few sacred and true friends who stand behind me, refuse to talk about me behind my back and want to see me safe. He is lacking in friends, which he expressed to me many times. He frightens me because in my opinion, someone who will emotionally manipulate a person and lies is capable of anything. I am afraid he may try to harm me since I refuse to respond to him. I hope he gets the help he so desperately needs and eventually finds some people who he can maintain a friendship with. And for those of you seeking help, I have great respect for your courage and willingness to do so- I know that this condition and others are not something that one would choose for themselves and it takes a very big person to address such a challenging matter.

[deerwalk]

"The worst part for your friend is the real likelihood that he does in fact know that he made mistakes in scaring and hurting you, but the unfortunate paradox of the whole thing is that knowledge of such actions usually makes us feel worse and then we react in more drastic ways."

God, this makes so much sense. I want to believe so badly that he knows deep inside that he did lie and scare me, and that it was wrong. He even lied about how many people he slept with- it terrifies me to think what else he was covering up

[Sugah]

Hi, deerwalk. I just wanted to jump in here to add to the personal experience already shared.

When I was nineteen, I was diagnosed with BPD. There were several other diagnoses, but BPD was the primary one. I was classic--risky behavior just to feel "alive," suicidal, obsessive in relationships to the point of stalking, constant fear of abandonment, violent bursts of anger, etc. Things got a little better when I was pregnant and after my son was born (I was almost 22), surprise, surprise--that was one of my brief periods of sobriety. I semi-remember one particularly bad night when I was throwing fists with my ex when I decided to end the fight by getting a knife and demonstrating to him how to use it on me--by stabbing the furniture and the carpets. I got a two-week vacation for that stunt, later was arrested for beating him bloody, impulsively left him one day while he was at work, moved on to another man and tried to blow up his prized sports car because I thought he was fooling around on me.... on and on it goes. Back before my diagnosis (while I was still in high school), I was in my first truly insane relationship where I'd pull stunts like jump out of the car where we were parking, run and lay down in the grass trying to get my boyfriend to run me down in the car ("I'll show him--he'll feel so bad!") and another time, running him off then diving at the hood of the moving car, tearing off the windshield wipers.

Did I get treatment? Sure. I spent about ten years in and out of therapy, took I don't know how many psychotropic medications to "calm me down" or "perk me up," but nothing really worked. I acted like a child with severe behavioral problems. Know why I think nothing ever worked? I never sobered up for long. I lied to my therapists about how much I was drinking and how many chemicals I was putting into my body. When I'd string a week or two clean together, I'd get a little better, but that was out the window the next time I picked up.

Then I made a commitment to sobriety when I was thirty-four years old. The feelings of being apart from everything persisted, but I took the suggestions of other addicts that they were false feelings that would dissipate as I worked steps. I still on occasion get impulses that I recognize as having been part of that person bound for destruction, and I look at them as lingering remembrances. After all, I have been sober only six years. I lived on the edge for much, much longer than that. When I feel them, I pray--and the sober me snaps back.

I'm not posting this so much for you as I am for anyone else who struggles with BPD. You, my dear, have separated from this individual, and that's probably the best thing you could do. A BPD with substance abuse issues who's not willing to get clean is probably not going to see any lessening of symptoms and therefore isn't going to be your friend as much as he'll be your captor. That doesn't mean he's a bad person. It just means he's not willing yet to seek help.

Peace & Love,
Sugah

[deerwalk]

"You, my dear, have separated from this individual, and that's probably the best thing you could do."

AMEN!

I know it does'nt necessarily mean he's a bad peson, but he does do bad things. He abuses his precriptions and uses illegal drugs. I know this affects his thinking. I do pray for him, but that's all I can do. I can't engage with this individual again.

[LaDita]

Could you guys list the main symptoms of this disorder as you know them? I have just recently become aware of it and it def. sounds very similar, but I've never heard the manipulation aspect of it.

[historyteach]

Symptoms of Borderline Personality Disorder
By John M. Grohol, Psy.D.
June 22, 2007
The main feature of borderline personality disorder (BPD) is a pervasive pattern of instability in interpersonal relationships, self-image and emotions. People with borderline personality disorder are also usually very impulsive.

This disorder occurs in most by early adulthood. The instable pattern of interacting with others has persisted for years and is usually closely related to the person’s self-image and early social interactions. The pattern is present in a variety of settings (e.g., not just at work or home) and often is accompanied by a similar lability (fluctuating back and forth, sometimes in a quick manner) in a person’s emotions and feelings. Relationships and the person’s emotion may often be characterized as being shallow.

A person with this disorder will also often exhibit impulsive behaviors and have a majority of the following symptoms:

Frantic efforts to avoid real or imagined abandonment
A pattern of unstable and intense interpersonal relationships characterized by alternating between extremes of idealization and devaluation
Identity disturbance: markedly and persistently unstable self-image or sense of self
Impulsivity in at least two areas that are potentially self-damaging (e.g., spending, sex, substance abuse, reckless driving, binge eating)
Recurrent suicidal behavior, gestures, or threats, or self-mutilating behavior
Affective instability due to a marked reactivity of mood (e.g., intense episodic dysphoria, irritability, or anxiety usually lasting a few hours and only rarely more than a few days)
Chronic feelings of emptiness
Inappropriate, intense anger or difficulty controlling anger (e.g., frequent displays of temper, constant anger, recurrent physical fights)
Transient, stress-related paranoid ideation or severe dissociative symptoms

Details about Borderline Personality Disorder Symptoms

Frantic efforts to avoid real or imagined abandonment.
The perception of impending separation or rejection, or the loss of external structure, can lead to profound changes in self-image, emotion, thinking and behavior. Someone with borderline personality disorder will be very sensitive to things happening around them in their environment. They experience intense abandonment fears and inappropriate anger, even when faced with a realistic separation or when there are unavoidable changes in plans. For instance, becoming very angry with someone for being a few minutes late or having to cancel a lunch date. People with borderline personality disorder may believ that this abandonment implies that they are “bad.” These abandonment fears are related to an intolerance of being alone and a need to have other people with them. Their frantic efforts to avoid abandonment may include impulsive actions such as self-mutilating or suicidal behaviors.

Unstable and intense relationships.
People with borderline personality disorder may idealize potential caregivers or lovers at the first or second meeting, demand to spend a lot of time together, and share the most intimate details early in a relationship. However, they may switch quickly from idealizing other people to devaluing them, feeling that the other person does not care enough, does not give enough, is not “there” enough. These individuals can empathize with and nurture other people, but only with the expectation that the other person will “be there” in return to meet their own needs on demand. These individuals are prone to sudden and dramatic shifts in their view of others, who may alternately be seen as beneficient supports or as cruelly punitive. Such shifts other reflect disillusionment with a caregiver whose nurturing qualities had been idealized or whose rejection or abandonment is expected.

Identity disturbance.
There are sudden and dramatic shifts in self-image, characterized by shifting goals, values and vocational aspirations. There may be suddent changes in opinions and plans about career, sexual identity, values and types of friends. These individuals may suddenly change from the role of a needy supplicant for help to a righteous avenger of past mistreatment. Although they usually have a self-image that is based on being bad or evil, individuals with borderline personality disorder may at times have feelings that they do not exist at all. Such experiences usually occur in situations in which the individual feels a lack of a meaningful relationship, nurturing and support. These individuals may show worse performance in unstructured work or school situations.

To read more, see:
Symptoms of Borderline Personality Disorder - Psych Central

I hope this helps!

Shalom!

[brokenrainbow89]

I have BPD alongside manic depression, and now that I know what it is I'm finding it easier to live with.
Sorry to everyone who has had a negative experience of BPD from other people, I think my main problem is that I am impulsive to the point of stupidity! I know as I am stood on the top of a bridge that if I fall it really is going to hurt, but then impulsiveness take over and I jump... "just to see what happened" is my usual response when people ask why.
BPD / bipolar / alcoholism.... really bad mix.

[allport]

History teach, I had a look at the link you provided and for a laugh did some of the quizzes.

Bad news I am bipolar, anxious, depressed, autistic and have an eating disorder and ocd.

Good news Im not schizophrenice and Im not a geek.

Think I'll take them with a pinch of salt. lol