Relationships and sex

[MCake]

[post not limited to the GLBT crowd!]

Yesterday I met up with some friends - some gay, some straight. All of them freaking out over their intimate relationships, and/or lack thereof.

We were in a park, and I found myself offhandedly flirting with a few guys who caught my eye... mostly out of habit. My friends were all "OMG, Matt!! He's interested!" and "Go after that one!" etc. etc. True, I'm a big flirt... But what *really* caught my attention is that my friends (along with most everyone I know) seem to automatically assume that single people are constantly longing for a relationship or, at the very least, sex.

So now I feel like a weirdo because I've suddenly realised that I'm simply uninterested in either O.o

Yes, sex can be fun. I was a very early bloomer and have had my share of it. But I can easily take it or leave it - in fact, I just don't get this constant sex-craze.

Ditto relationships. After a string of feeble attempts, some of which were disastrous, I've come to realise that I genuinely seem to enjoy being a lone wolf.

I've been nursing a broken heart for a morbidly long period of time - but even that sounds like an excuse.

A few days ago, one of my enlightened SR friends told me the obvious: "Don't worry about it, someone will show up and you'll change your mind in an instant".

That makes sense... I haven't exactly gone out of my way to make it happen, though. I do believe in soulmates. My mother, of all people, told me recently "just call for him... he's out there, looking for you too!"

I like that idea, but it seems like I'm aphonic.

Anyway, maybe this is just a -freakishly long- phase... Maybe I haven't yet figured out what I'm looking for, as getting involved with someone isn't a priority in my recovery right now. Oh well, I'm just thinking too much as usual. I would definitely appreciate input from whomever feels like offering some, though.

I just can't help wondering if I've become an asexual narcissist, or if I'm just plain scared.

[justanothrdrunk]

I think too many people operate under the assumption that an otherwise healthy adult who is single is automatically looking for a partner of some sort.

And then when folks find out said single person is not looking, the implication is that there's something wrong because it's "normal" to be seeking a partner. Thus, abnormal not to be.

And maybe you're just feeling abnormal because you're not living up to your friend's expectations.

And in that case, is the problem with them, or you?

[freya]

Hi, Matt!

As I've said before, I think the whole idea of "normal" is a bunch of b*llsh*t and that it's a very dangerous and limiting thing for anyone to aspire to!

So, basically, if I were you, I wouldn't be worrying about whether what you want or don't want, feel or don't feel is "normal." But I definitely would be thinking about whether it's right and healthy for me at this time in my life -- and you seem pretty clear that it is.

As you probably know, I have 21 year-old gay son. If he were straight and approached women and sex the way he approaches men and sex, I would be seriously worried that he was sex-crazed predator. But pretty much everyone he knows and hangs out with is very much like him -- and so, it's all fine. From talking to him (and he talks to me sometimes way more openly and explicitly than even I am comfortable with!) and from my conversation with a lot of close gay male friends, I'd have to say that his behavior is the exception rather than the rule for a lot of gay men -- at least at certain points in their lives. And, as we all know, our culture is fundamentally sex-negative and definitely "opposed" to that kind of very free, open and casual attitude toward sex. So, it might just be that your friends are in that hyper-sexual place themselves and feel a little uncomfortable because you're not....and because your not being in that place, in some way and on some level, reminds them of the culture's "judgment" against them and where they are.

Really, I wouldn't worry it. Anyways, the further you go in your recovery, the better "catch" you'll be....and the kind of person you'll be interested in being "caught" by will be the kind of person who can appreciate that!

freya

P.S. Just let the recovery work deal with the asexual narcissism...because good recovery is a whole-life deal, right?

[FightingIrish]

I can identify with this thread. On one hand, my life is full and I am content doing my routine, showing up for life, helping others, and enjoying the simple pleasures of waking up clear-headed, able to get more than the laundry done, and not peeing on myself. On the other, I get pangs of loneliness sometimes and wonder if I "need" someone else in order to complete the package. I also know that being rejected in relationships has been the equivalent of a nuclear bomb, so there's definitely fear there as well.For me, I need to keep broadening my horizons, getting out and meeting people, not sitting home eating chocolates and reading harlequin novels, but I have to remain centered and grounded in my recovery while doing those things. It's definitely ODAAT with this stuff.

[MCake]

Thanks for your replies, they've been very helpful

Justanotherdrunk - thanks for helping me put this stuff into perspective, what other people think of me is none of my business, I can't control it (nor would I want to!).

FightingIrish - I can relate to the "nuclear bomb" of rejection; this happened to me at a very tender age, and the nuclear winter that ensued was... devastating The way I "handled" that rejection (ie by drinking my brains out for the better part of a decade) ultimately redirected my attention to the host of underlying issues that I'm now working on - codependency, low self esteem in certain areas, fear etc... and how I overcompensated these issues by sliding to the other extreme. Ugh. ("showing up for life" )

Freya -

I definitely would be thinking about whether it's right and healthy for me at this time in my life -- and you seem pretty clear that it is.

This sums it up perfectly. You analysis of being sex-crazed vs. our dowdy, quasi-Victorian culture is spot on. I do wonder why you think your son would be a "predator" if he were into women, but gets a free pass cos he's gay? ;-) Maybe I'm misunderstanding that part.

I've been second-guessing myself a lot lately... many things that appeared to be certain in the past are now up for grabs. Bottom line is, I'm not actively looking for a partner at the moment. As I'm giving off an "unavailable" vibe, I doubt the right person will show up; if he does, well... then I'm in trouble :p

[freya]

Originally Posted by mattcake79

I do wonder why you think your son would be a "predator" if he were into women, but gets a free pass cos he's gay? ;-) Maybe I'm misunderstanding that part.

Actually, I don't think he would be any different -- but the behavior would be perceived differently in the vast majority of situations in which women are present (other than, maybe, like if one were in a strip club or some other venue in which it was clearly understood and/or expected that the women were present solely for sexual purposes) and/or if the exact same behavior were to be directed at women. I mean, certainly, that is not the case with all women all the time......but, as a general rule, I do think it holds true.

Clearer?????

freya

..........Well, actually I take that back -- he would be different......because, if he were interested in women and thought that that kind of behavior was likely to get him very far, very often, that would probably be indicative of serious lack of social skills an emotional intelligence on his part. And his social skills are actually pretty amazing.

[MCake]

Originally Posted by freya

Clearer?????

Yes, ma'am!

[nandm]

Originally Posted by mattcake79

[post not limited to the GLBT crowd!]


A few days ago, one of my enlightened SR friends told me the obvious: "Don't worry about it, someone will show up and you'll change your mind in an instant".

That makes sense... I haven't exactly gone out of my way to make it happen, though. I do believe in soulmates. My mother, of all people, told me recently "just call for him... he's out there, looking for you too!"

.

Your friend seems very wise. I was not seeking a relationship when I ran across my partner and neither was she. In fact, she was opposed to a relationship with anyone at the time. We started the relationship on purely a friendship level, although I do have to say I found her very attractive but thought she was way out of my league so never dreamed I would wind up in a relationship with her. Our friendship though did develop into a relationship in its own time. We have been together nearly 10 years and I can easily see myself in 20 or 30 years still with her. So hang in there relationship or no relationship as long as you are working on you then you are doing right. Someday you might look up and realize that person you always viewed as a friend really means much more to you. If that is the case then I hope they feel the same way.

[louis]

Hi Matt....

I am pretty much a loner... even in my relationships i never really felt fully able to commit... it doesnt mean i didnt love the erson i was with... but somewhere inside i always had to protect myself and if i am totally honest i like being just me... dont get me wrong... i am not saying i am always my best company but i dont feel the need to always have someone else in my life either romantically or sexually... I can quite happily be by myself...

I have my issues with depression and other stuff... but i have them whether by myself or part of a couple...

Friends and family do think i should be in a relationship though... or at least looking... they ask me "dont you want to meet someone... or... arent you lonely"
Well... the answer is no...
Sure i get days i wish i had someone to talk to.... but i think thats why the internet was invented

As i have said i have been in relationships... and at the time i thought they were the one... and i loved them deeply but i found the pressure of always being in someone elses company or always answerable to someone got too much...

Maybe i am a free spirit.... or just born to be by myself... who knows...

What i do know is that IF i were meant to get into another relationship... then it will happen... without me searching and without the pressure of other people telling me what i must do...

Not sure this is making sense... but my take on it anyhow.

Take care and be happy

[MCake]

Nandm, your experience sounds wonderful And fortunate! Thanks so much for sharing. I'm thinking that that is my preferred scenario. Meeting someone, becoming friends and, eventually, seeing where it goes... A few nights ago I was considering going to a gay bar (I know, I know, the barber shop ) just to look around - but I have the nagging feeling that, at this point, an official "date" with me would be more like an interview lol. And I still feel the same way regarding a no-strings-attached romp: NO.

IMAGE

Louis, surprise! I'm changing my mind quite quickly (ugh, i drive myself crazy) Now that I've pushed away my friends/society/other people's expectations and pressure, I'm starting to discover that I might just *want* to be with someone after all. It's a bit scary but... I've proven to myself that I can do just fine on my own... The idea of being in a relationship doesn't seem as daunting. I mean, not.right.THIS.very.minute, but maybe soon.

The good part is, I know what I'm looking for in a partner - stuff that I'm willing to offer, and expect in return:

1. Honesty and truthfulness - eventually leading to commitment, yet:
2. Lots of space and time!

Anything else is negotiable... despite the way I tend to come across "on paper", I'm actually very easygoing and open... I'm also aware that my demands seem high, and that some people are unable or unwilling to deliver... but, at this point, these (and especially the first one) are none-negotiable.

So the intention is there, I'll put this whole thing in the back burner for now.

Originally Posted by louis

What i do know is that IF i were meant to get into another relationship... then it will happen... without me searching and without the pressure of other people telling me what i must do...

Exactly!

[yeahgr8]

I think these are great things to be able to consider and think about from time to time, at the very least a future relationship sober will stand half a chance and won't be ****** from day 1:-)

I truly believe it will come for all of us if we keep working on ourselves...yeah the soul mate thing would be cool and i really liked nandm's post...

Maybe the next girl will keep her pants on for the first date...that would be nice too...lol...yeah i know it takes two to tango...

[bjork]

Originally Posted by mattcake79

[post not limited to the GLBT crowd!]

my friends (along with most everyone I know) seem to automatically assume that single people are constantly longing for a relationship or, at the very least, sex.

I've suddenly realised that I'm simply uninterested in either O.o

I've come to realise that I genuinely seem to enjoy being a lone wolf.

"Don't worry about it, someone will show up and you'll change your mind in an instant".

I would definitely appreciate input from whomever feels like offering some, though.

I just can't help wondering if I've become an asexual narcissist, or if I'm just plain scared.

Get out of my head!!!!! I too am content right now being single. However, when I move or do something that requires heavy lifting I pine for a girlfriend.

I do get annoyed by anybody that thinks that my life is incomplete because I do not have a significant other. I just consider anybody eluding to that as having poor communication skills for actually verbalizing such thoughts, or having a very sheltered life for thinking that being a lone is so scary.

I used to think I was going to meet "Ms Right". I thought I had met her a few times before. Alas, I gave up a long time ago. Now I just live my life and if it is meant to be, it will happen. I just don't look anymore. I'm not going to force it to happen either.

In my world, your situation sounds perfectly healthy. LOL But, am I?

[Outvoid]

Originally Posted by mattcake79

[post not limited to the GLBT crowd!]

Yesterday I met up with some friends - some gay, some straight. All of them freaking out over their intimate relationships, and/or lack thereof.

Matt, what you're experiencing is very common.

People can become addicted to relationships and compulsive sexuality just as they can to drugs, alcohol, food, etc.

I'm one of those people. In addition to being a alcoholic, I am also a recovering sex addict and a member of SAA.

In SAA (Sex Addicts Anonymous), I have learned at not only is compulsive sexuality a problem for me, but also codependency with partners.

One of the greatest lessons I've learned about relationships is applying the same principles of the 12 steps. For example:

Stay on my own side of the street

I can't control my partner or their feelings or reactions - and I don't need to.
The only person I can control is myself, with the help of my Higher Power.

Here's an example of subtle means of controling my partner that has been extremely problematic:

I had a shi_tty day at work. So does my partner. We both get home and ask each other how our day was. Not wanting to put my negative feelings on my partner, I say, "I had a great day. How about you?" My partner does the same. But underneath the facade, we're both miserable. So we pretend that we're happy until some little incident happens: I spill something on the stove and suddenly my partner over-reacts and yells at me. Then I say, "What the hell is wrong with you?!"

This is an example of displaced anger. The spill meant nothing, but my partner used it as an excuse to let out the frustration of the bad day.

However, there are two bigger dangers here:

1) By repressing my feelings, I am more likely to isolate and be tempted to act out in my addiction.

2) By trying to control the feelings of my partner, I am not allowing them react in their own way. If they feel sad, upset, hurt, or frustrated, they have the right to do so - just as I do.

My partner and I now are very open about our feelings, even negative ones. Paradoxically, it has brought us closer togather because we have true emotional intimancy as opposed to the false intimacy that we had when we were codependently trying to shelter each other.

- - - - - - - - -

In a SAA meeting, someone once said, "Relationships aren't difficult; dealing with our own sh_it is difficult."

Indeed. =)

--Outvoid--

[Charmie]

hey matty,just thought i would share with you what somebody said at a meeting the other night,,,,that for a long time he was searching for someone because he was half a person,he thought by having someone in his life it would make him whole,,,when he started work on himself he came to realise that he needed to be whole in order to have another person in his life.you are doing a grand job matty and i think you are just where you should be at the moment.charmie.xx.

[Eroica]

Well.. I want a relationship because I'm tired of meaningless flings. I'm also really lonely so it would be great to wake up next to someone every morning. I'm aware that relationships bring their own set of problems but I feel like I would a good partner. I wouldnt jump into anything of course either.. just take it nice and slow.

[Darrin11]

Originally Posted by mattcake79

[post not limited to the GLBT crowd!]





That makes sense... I haven't exactly gone out of my way to make it happen, though. I do believe in soulmates. My mother, of all people, told me recently "just call for him... he's out there, looking for you too!"

I like that idea, but it seems like I'm aphonic.

I was the same way for a while. I didn't care much about sex or finding a relationship. Then one day (a few weeks ago) I felt ready all of the sudden. Now, I had heard about going with the flow of life and to not fight the current. Also, "ask and you shall receive." Soooo....I was in my bedroom one night and I said out loud to thin air (the Universe if you will) I'm ready, please send me someone. I **** you not, I met someone inside a week without even trying and I swear he's unbelievable perfect for me! I'm still pinching myself. Sometimes life really freaks me out! LOL I wish you all the best and hope you find whatever makes you happy.

[utopia]

hey mattcake79...i remember when i was in early alanon recovery, single and struggling with strong feelings of loneliness I often asked friends "So how's your love life? Seeing anyone?" and so on...I dont know about your friends but for me it was a sort of voyeuristic way of soaking up other peoples lives, had a problem of minding other peoples business!

now i dont intentionally bring that up, i ask how they are doing, how they're feeling, what they've been up to, how are their dreams, goals, journey, healing and aspirations going and i listen more.

as for myself i think life is valleys and mountains with most things, sometimes you're happy being alone, other times your not, this is just where you're at, just for today...for me, i reached a definite point from not being sure to being definite about what i wanted, pretty much within a few hours i met a guy online who turned out to be my current partner, instead of guys with mixed messages (not jerks as I thought then but just a reflection of my own inner confusion!)

I dont know if it works this way but I turn to my Higher Power and what he would want for me, and if I feel a lack of love I ask for it, I feel my HP loves me through my partner but also many other people and things of earth, spirit and my heart. If I remember to reach to Him and surrender I have always found, somehow my needs for love are met.