putting yourself out there

[FightingIrish]

OK, so since getting sober 21 months ago, I have had absolutely no romantic or sex life. I am a 37 y/o GWM. I am afraid (shell-shocked?) about the idea of putting myself out there.

I live in a place where it's not clear exactly where and how to meet gay people except at a bar. There are online personals, but I am horrible about actually making the connection to want to meet someone in person. I was recently chewed a new a-----e by a guy whom I honestly have just flaked out on several times. I didn't know what to say. I don't mention that I am sober right off the bat, and I also don't mention that I am frightened to death about meeting someone in person.

I have been through the steps, and am very active in person in A.A. I do lots of service, have a bunch of friends in the program, etc. But when it comes to gay stuff, I feel like I'm about 13 years old again. Too many years of using drugs and booze to feel like I could properly function as a gay man, socially and sexually. I have attended gay meetings, but it's honestly no better there than anywhere else.

Has anyone else felt like this after getting sober? It honestly feels like some sort of strange PTSD.

M

[Lonewolf515]

Hi Irish. I hear what you're saying. The scene isn't pretty for someone living in recovery. Unfortunately I don't have any real good suggestions for you at this time. Probably just going to take twice as much work and perseverance.

LW

[indigo]

When the time is right for you I am sure you will know it and let fear flow away jmo.

[SailorKaren]

Maybe you could try hanging out at some places where a face-to-face or just casual encounter doesn't have the emotional charge of being "a date". Some of my lesbian friends go to a little restaurant downtown for breakfast every Saturday. It's owned by a lesbian couple, and has lots of family types there in the morning. People around here are proud of calling this "The Redneck Riviera," and I'm here to tell you it's an accurate term! So there are not many openly friendly places around. Even so, I know some who attend PFLAG meetings and meet other gays and lesbians there. You might also try attending a local gay and lesbian church. Do a search for MCC (Metropolitan Community Church) churches.

A friend asked me recently if I would go to the local gay bar, and I agreed to go with her. I hadn't visited there but once many years ago, and it hadn't changed a bit. I didn't much care for the experience. All the smoke made me sick, the guy doing a striptease on the bar didn't interest me, and I had seen enough of the floor show after 20 min. I don't think my friend had ever been there before, so we left after a little while. I think it satisfied her curiosity. Whew. It was not a healthy place for me.

I'm feeling very comfortable meeting and conversing with other family types, and I think it helps that I'm still hurting and recovering from a traumatic breakup and betrayal with my ex. I am so not ready for another relationship -- maybe ever -- that just having a conversation is easy. You might try visiting somewhere out of town. It might help to have the thought that "Oh well, I'll never see that person again anyway."

[mattcake79]

I wholeheartedly agree with Indigo's advice. Things seem to happen in due time, as we open up to possibilities and become available and ready to receive them. This might sound New Agey but, at least through my experience, I'm quite convinced that it's true. The best situations in my life came when I was feeling at ease, peaceful and trusting.

My advice is to keep your side of the street clean, *do* work on whatever fears and issues you might be harbouring, and trust that you'll meet someone when the time is right.

^^ that's not to say you should just kick back on your couch and expect things to happen without some effort on your part what I'm trying to say is that it's a good idea to devote that effort inwards.. Good luck, keep us posted

[Eroica]

Well I put myself out there but I'm still rejected by almost every guy I like. Just the other day, I told a gorgeous acquaintence of mine that he was very cute and asked if he had a girlfriend (while giving him the look). He freaked out, said yeah he does and said he wasn't gay. It made us both very uncomfortable. I mean, straight people hit on other straight people so why I can't I? One of my friends said that I shouldn't hit on someone until I know for sure they're gay.. but straight people don't ask other straight people before hitting on them-excuse me, are you straight?

Anyway, it just doesn't seem that romantic to me to meet the love of your life at a gay bar or gay event. When you're at a bar, you know what guys are after. Its much more flattering to be hit on in a different setting.

[freya]

I'm not sure where you are in NY, but I am in Rochester. I have been very involved in the gay community here and, for about 2 years, I ran a GLBT matchmaking service.

Most cities in NY state -- even small ones like Syracuse and Uttica -- have some kind of gay community center and at least a few GLBT church groups. These types of groups tend to have at least several social events per month at which it would be possible to meet new people. If you are in or closer to THE City, then there are tons of non-bar venues in which to meet gay people and you might start by contacting the big community center on 13th St. to get information. And I think, last time I checked, the NYC Gay Yellow Pages was even available on-line. I know that Rochester, Buffalo and Syracuse also have similar guides/directories available.....and websites like gayrochester.com, too.

Bottom line is, though, no matter how much info you have or how much opportunity is available near where you live, you do have to be able to get out there in order to meet people.....If your fear of doing so is so great that you have not been able to work through it using your program tools, your sponsor, (you have been working on this, right??????) etc....then it might be time to look for some outside help.....and, again, most of the directories mentioned above will feature info about mental health professionals who work with and/or who are themselves GLBorT.

freya

[FightingIrish]

I guess where I'm at is that I have been out since I was 17, which means that my entire sexual and romantic life was fueled by alcohol:

Too afraid to tell someone I'm gay? Have a couple drinks...
Too nervous to talk to people in the bar? Have a couple drinks...
Too scared to make a move? Have a couple drinks...
Too self-conscious to take my shirt off in a club? Have a couple drinks (and a couple...)
Too prudish to have sex with three other guys at once? Have a couple...

So I feel a bit like someone stopped the music, and there's no chair left. :-/

[freya]

I do understand what you're saying, and it makes perfect sense -- but the question is: What are you doing about it? Just knowing what the problem is and wanting things to be different is clearly not enough.

I do believe that intense, thorough Step work can pretty much help us work through/deal with anything.....So, have you worked very specifically and in depth on these issues with your sponsor? If not, why not?

Obviously trying to work through this on your own and just trying to make yourself "buck up" and get out there is not working....and the longer you pursue this unsuccessful strategy, the worse you are going to feel about yourself and the less confidence you're going to have. So, you need to get help and support, either from within program or from a professional.

Good luck -- freya

[utopia]

seek and you shall find....I know for me that whenevr drinking played a part it was hiding a deep seated insecurity and self loathing, not feeling good enough,...nightclubs were all about beauty and/or light frivolity and not about spirit or substance or deep inner work that comes about in recovery, dancing and going out can be fun but i found that very lacking in the gay nightclub/bar scene and full of a lot of fear based stuff, not what i really wanted....i think what may help well, what worked for me was to first be clear on who i was through the steps and thus clearer on what it was i wanted and needed from someone, commitment? or a fling? i wanted a full committed loving and respectful relationship but came to learn thru recovery i didnt really feel deserving of it so attracted men who were confused and just plain not good for me really...............what im saying is, get a general sense of loving yourself, at least for the most part, turn to your higher power and visualise what it is that you want and then hand it over to the care of your HP, trusting that you will find someone because for me, it's His will that guides me not my fear...maybe you do have to start as a 17 year old in your older body but its what needs to be done then so be it because i gather that you like most in recovery want to be happy joyous and free in your love life and that takes clear honesty, openess and willingness to work with your HP and commit to recovery, to God (as you understand God) and to yourself....prayers for you

[FightingIrish]

You may be right. To answer your question, yes, we did address sex and relationships in my inventory and other work. (My sponsor is straight.) I can't say what the result is, exactly, since I have not met anybody that I felt inclined to pursue sexually or romantically. So it's a bit in the abstract.

Most of my friends in the program (and in general) are straight, although a few are gay. I feel very comfortable being with people in general. I go regularly to a gay meeting, but again, have not met anyone that has sparked any interest whatsoever.

I do believe that intense, thorough Step work can pretty much help us work through/deal with anything.....So, have you worked very specifically and in depth on these issues with your sponsor? If not, why not?

[FightingIrish]

This is what I meant to say:

I feel a bit like I don't have the sex and relationship "hardware" that other people seem to have. Alcohol and drugs allowed me to run the software in a minimal sense, sort of like running Windows on a Mac, but it's not a viable solution for the long term.

I obviously have more work to do.

[freya]

Well, these situations are a bit different, but I have "sponsored" a few AA women specifically as related to their "coming to terms with their lesbianism" and their "coming out." How it happened is that there is a (straight) woman I know in Al Anon who is a "double winner" (i.e she works both AA and Al Anon programs). She has been sober for a long time and sponsors a lot of AA women. A few years ago, she had a recently sober sponsee who was really struggling with issues around her sexuality, and she asked me if I could try to help her out, as she didn't feel like she had the necessary knowledge/experience to do so. So, I did....and it seems to have worked very well for her because she is now in a seemingly well-working lesbian relationship and doing fine. Since then, I've been asked to work with a couple of other women in this same context/situation....and it seems to be going well.

Now, obviously, I would not be willing to work in this context with someone to whom I might find myself attracted -- that would be just too friggin' awkward and probably constitute some kind of "conflict of interest" LOL! -- but since I'm only attracted to butch women, it really hasn't been an issue thus far.

I'm telling you this because perhaps it would be helpful to you to find someone who could "sponsor" you specifically as related to these issues? Perhaps your sponsor might know someone whom he could recommend, or, you might try to talk about it at your gay meeting and maybe find someone there or even just get a "referral." Of course, again, you would want it to be someone to whom it is unlikely you would find yourself physically attracted...just to avoid potential awkwardness.

I]freya[/I]

[sct]

I do think that a lot of these issues can be kind of broken down into pieces, and worked through with steps. After finishing my first round of stepwork specifically on drug addiction, I'm now working through some other just as addictive behaviors, and then probably sex, as my third round, depending where I'm at with it. It's also something I've worked through in therapy as well (I work a very multifaceted program), which was helpful, because my therapist is a gay male, and my sponsor is straight. Some things one understands more intuitively than the other.

[spiker]

Hi, I am new to the forum. This thread caught my eye because it is exactly how I feel. I also live in an area where all the gay community seems to revolve around the bar scene. I can't seem to meet guys who aren't into the bars, or they want to meet at the bar, etc.
I don't want to be a stick in the mud, but I don't want to go to the bars either.
I am looking online, and I have a personal ad to which I get responses. But, I do not know if I am emotionally healthy enough yet to go out with someone.
I don't mean to take away from your topic though. Anyways, I hope to talk and get to know people here.

[utopia]

hardware?? maybe there's something you haven't addressed? i think gettign some friends in more important, i dont know. i know for me, i needed step work wth a sponsor, therapy with a psychologist and rebirthing therapy before things changed, oh and major faith and surrender to a Power greater than myself plus some crazy dancing around the house when I had to surrender.

[FightingIrish]

I have had a few short experiences with therapy but have never found I got anything out of it. It's not something my family did so I was not socialized to have a therapist, and I've frankly always been baffled by the number of people I hear (in general and in the rooms of A.A.) who begin sentences with, "well, my therapist said..."

In fact, I'm a bit judgmental. (Gasp!) Therapy seems to become a way of life for some, an excuse to become self-indulgent, and that is not something I want.

Perhaps I should be a bit more targeted in terms of what I am needing help with.

M