How to deal with a Dry Drunk and Post Relapse Fallout

Old 08-28-2016, 05:23 AM
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How to deal with a Dry Drunk and Post Relapse Fallout

Hi everyone. I am in the unenviable position now of dealing with a stbxA who is being the quintessential "dry drunk." Background - 5 years ago we got separated after his alcoholism spiraled out of control, he lost a great job, and went to rehab. Came back, seemed committed to sobriety, went back to AA, got a great sponsor, etc., so we "sort of" got back together. Meaning, he stayed with me and our son a few times a week (with his mom across town the rest of the time), we acted like a family, and I gradually began to trust him again. He got a part time, low paying job with a family friend, and couldn't contribute financially in any meaningful way, but I was just happy he was able to get out there again and get some kind of work after his crisis.

The lull lasted for a while. FF to last summer, he started drinking again on the sly (although he admitted he had a bunch of "slips" prior which I wasn't aware of). This culminated in a full blown relapse in November, sending him back to detox. Ok - if you're still following and wonder why I didn't divorce him then, I guess that's a good question. He said he "needed" this relapse to help him refocus on sobriety and was back on the wagon. His boss even took him back, and things were ok. For a while.

FF to June. I needed hip surgery, and told him that I would need a lot of help, for me and our son, since I was supposed to be on crutches 3 weeks. Well guess what, a few days before my surgery, he relapses, again. This time for over a month. I had to call on my parents and sister to help me post surgery (which they did). So here I am, dealing with a physical and emotional trauma. At this point even a wimpy codie like me said enough, I'm divorcing. This isn't the life I want. I don't want a life where things seem to be "normal" for a while, and then the shoe drops.

After a month of round the clock drinking he checks himself into detox. I told him I want to divorce, he seemed to go along with it, but in his sick mind I think he thought that even if this happens, we could still go back to how things were (him sleeping over with us, blah blah, continuing on as if nothing happened).

I told him that while I agree he should be in his son's life, I can't handle him sleeping over. Ok - fine. Now we are in that "post crisis" period and it is getting very uncomfortable. He is sober, but a jerk. A dry drunk. Attends AA and all, meets with his sponsor, but an irritable malcontent. He is complaining that his current clerical job (which he is lucky to have) isn't good enough for him and he is angry that none has responded yet to his job apps. He is a highly educated, well spoken person who ruined his career himself. He doesn't even want to admit that. Truth is he would never be able to handle any kind of job that has any modicum of stress, given that he can't cope with anything that most people have to cope with.

Sorry if I've rambled up to now. This brings us to now. My challenge is that we can't really do no contact, we have a son. He is 7 and on the autism spectrum. While it is by no means a severe case, he can be very, very difficult, and while I am doing everything I can to find him appropriate babysitters, activities, etc until school starts, I really do need his father's help. Our son acts better with him than with me alone and there are just times I need a break. As his father, I feel he should have some kind of obligation, esp since he isn't helping much financially (save some groceries here and there) and I still need to hire babysitters since I know I can't rely on him, even though he hasn't worked all summer and his job is essentially part time.

We've been keeping visitation "loose" and he's been coming over for a few hours on the weekend. This gravitates between him being nice about 25% of the time, and a dry drunk the rest of it.

Yesterday I asked him if he could come earlier today to take our son outside in the morning (which has been a debacle for me lately) to relieve me and he said "no, I can come at 12:30. I have to do a job search. If you don't want me to sleep over, I have to rebuild my life." Then he huffed off, shook his head in anger, and left.

I could go on, but that's the executive summary. As for why we see our son together, well - I've been advised by my lawyer to keep things loose. I don't want to hand him over to him (he wouldn't have the patience for him anyway for a long time), he lives with his mother (also an A, that's another story), and lets just say I don't feel comfortable any other way. So for now, I am seeing him, such that it is.

This whole situation sucks. He is angry that I don't want to be his enabler anymore. He doesn't understand that after all this, job loss, continued relapses, complete lack of reliability, I don't want to have him stay over and resume our "normal" life which has, up to now, always ended in him being so drunk that he needs detox to get out of it. I have a full time job, and doing everything for our son, which is a job in and of itself, and he is trying to make me feel bad.

This is almost worse than when he was drinking because then I just didn't see him. I feel like I'm stuck in a situation I don't know how to get out of. I want to continue to be positive, move on with life, and this is just a dark cloud. Same time, like every codie, I still do care about him.
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Old 08-28-2016, 05:53 AM
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Tough situation, for sure, but as I see it you have two choices. One is to continue as you have been and work on detaching from his unpleasant attitude. How is he with your son? Is he patient, kind?

The other, of course, is to get a firm parenting time schedule in place, with some kind of sobriety monitoring. Given his history of "slips" and relapses, my bet is that the court would go along with that.

I just don't see how you can have it both ways. You can't make him be nice or considerate to you.

Wish I had a better suggestion.
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Old 08-28-2016, 06:02 AM
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Wow 07, you certainly have your hands full there. I would suggest that no contact might free up a hand that you are definitely in need of. Something that struck me was that you mentioned your drunk was living with an active alcoholic in his mother. Don't see that as a healthy situation for him getting sober. Perhaps you could rely more on your family to get you through these tough times. Also Alanon could be something to look into for I have found it both encouraging and supportive. You call him a dry drunk but he seems to have too many relapses to be considered dry. You are taking care of one child with challenges, you don't need two. Huge hugs and keep us posted.
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Old 08-28-2016, 06:37 AM
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pndm....I can see where having a child, together, with special needs makes the situation much more difficult than it would ordinarily be.
from your description of him...it makes one wonder just how deep he is digging into his recovery...and any additional "dual diagnosis" that he might have.

Honestly, it sounds like you are having a second job just to cope with his "help". You do it alone when he is relapsing. He has his own limitations of how patient and how long and how accommodating he can be when he IS helping...and, you have to put up with the dry drunk type stuff, to boot!
And...when you have needed him badly...like typical alcoholic...they drop the rope!

(and , I do remember the special problems of dealing with your own family).

Could it be that the (understandable) fantasy of having the devoted father pitching in and creating the "happy, secure family feeling" is more of a wish than a reality...and, one that is hard for you to detach from...?
I am just asking....not making a statement..lol....

Yet, I do understand your needing more help from a male that you son responds to. I totally get that.

Have you dug into getting m ore of that kind of help from the autism organizations...and support groups of other parents of autistic children?
Have you ever considered the Big Brother organization....or other volunteer organizations....There are other people who do have a mission for doing this kind of work.

In addition to finding other solutions to compensate for his deficits...maybe it would help to set the bar of your expectations for him just a bit lower...?
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Old 08-28-2016, 06:42 AM
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Just wanted to offer support and say that whoa - our stories are similar, down to autism spectrum part, and highly educated A who screwed up their career, while becoming less employed with each relapse. He also had secret slips.

I felt like I had to have his help with DS, after rehab, and then found out that he drank DS's cough syrup (which he got from his pediatrician and which DS did not really need) while I left them alone for a couple of ours. That was a final straw and I asked him to leave and not come back. He ended up 250 miles away from us

it is comforting that you have your parents close by, I have no one except sitters (and they are awesome), went to boss, explained the situation (high level), able to work VO and flexible schedule when needed now.

He did threaten me throughout marriage that I could not do it without him - I am doing it. First couple of weeks were rough with him not being there, but DS adjusted and his behaviour improved at school very much. He went to a large camp this summer - no problems, and is in 1 new activity and two sports activities now. In fact, DS is in more activities and happier than he has ever been

So there we have it, I take DS to grandma where A resides, once/twice per month, he saw him a whole 4 times since February. Divorced last week. Got a job, going to pay child support. So far so good. Attitude was dry drunk for a long while (stress of divorce did not help), I see inprovements this week.

Hang in there
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Old 08-28-2016, 06:47 AM
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Ugh not easy. I have followed your story and there are lots of similarities to mine. What I have been doing since I moved out 5 months ago...is to have my STBXAH see the kids on a consistent supervised schedule. It took some time to get him to agree to that but he really didn't have a choice since he's still using. He has set days he can come see the kids while my parents supervise (shows up half of the time). I have gone no contact (blocked him from my phone) and he can email me only when it involves the kids. Him not having access to my phone has helped me tremendously! Of course he will still email me regarding other nonsense, but I never engage unless it involves the kids. He has had every opportunity to submit to a drug test so he could have the kids unsupervised...but he has yet to do that. I have decided to proceed with a divorce because this "in limbo" and waiting for him to "change" is only causing me more grief. I know how hard this must be for you and even more so when you have a child and need the help. Is your family nearby to help? As much as I don't like relying on my family for help, they are willing so I feel blessed. It's only temporarily and it takes a village!! Sending you prayers and strength!!!
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Old 08-28-2016, 07:28 AM
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Thanks to all of you for your words of support. You can't imagine how helpful this is. Also interesting how similar many of our situations are. I am so grateful for you guys. Regarding his mom - yes, she relapses whenever he does. She was sober for 20+ years, then when he picked up, she picked up too. A very sick situation. She is as far as I know sober now. Ugh.
Dandy - as always you hit the nail on the head. Yes, I need to lower expectations. I've been doing it for a while on a logical level, but emotionally, it still hurts. As for services for my son, I have been going down that route for a while and am continuing to pursue more. It just often takes a lot of time and red tape to get extra services. He is in a great school however, and until it starts is in camp (geared to children with various needs) and is doing great so far there. The first day was rough but now he loves it and they love him! I still need to find more help on weekends - this is the main problem. I'm working on it, it's just a full time chore.
Nata - wow yes our situations are similar. I did note from reading your story which I've been following too. The fact that you are dealing with ASD makes it all the more possible to relate. I am really glad that your ah is at least stepping up financially and doing ok for now.
Sunshine - I've been following your story too and appreciate your words. You are so right - the "limbo" and waiting/hoping that things will change is such a draining waste of precious life. If they do, well good - but why wait around. I'm finally dealing with this head on. It's so hard.
Again thanks everyone. I'm actually seeing him soon, we have to go shopping for some stuff I need around the house. Not a thing I can do alone with my son. I hope to get to the stage where I don't "need" him so much and where he doesn't use this as a tool.
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Old 08-28-2016, 07:53 AM
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pndm.....I think you are doing a good job of facing your situation...and, have come a long way....probably, more than you realize....

Absolutely...it is a full time job to find services and go through the hoops that it takes! It requires inventive thinking and tenacity and focus....and faith and a glass half full attitude. The faint of heart need not apply...lol....

Maybe, if you got a list from Volunteer Services of America....you could jump start your imagination....
If you had different folks who would donate time to go along on shopping trips, and such practical things....it would be such a help. There are lots of organizations that have volunteers who want the gratification of "helping".....

You need some time for just yourself, also.....
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Old 08-28-2016, 08:09 AM
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This might not help, but perhaps offer some perspective.

My dad was an alcoholic, or perhaps a dry drunk for my youth. I was born when he was 70 and he had been struggling with alcohol all his life, if you listened to his stories. He was an jerk and very damaging to his children. But. . . aside from our issues we turned out to be honorable and stable citizens.

But I adopted a little girl, my great niece, who was a drug baby. I don't know all the drugs involved, but stuff like Meth, Ecstasy, pot, alcohol. We basically knew she was going to have issues. At 6 months she showed signs of "shutting down" when there was too much noise or strangers. Some early evaluations suggested she might be autistic.

So we got her into some modern therapy, floor play, and an awesome therapist and she snapped back. She is 8 now but has been in therapy since she was 6 months. But she is great, aside from struggling some mild OCD stuff like germs and fear of the dark. But she excels at most stuff like singing, art, social skills, computers, schools, and stuff. Yeah, yeah, I'm bragging a little.

My point is, I've learn that alcoholism and autism and bipolar, and stuff, are all sort of related to the same disorder. Here your son is (how did you put it?) very, very difficult. Well, your drunk husband is being very, very difficult too. But for almost the same reasons.

In a way, your husband doesn't have much more choice in this than your son does. The brain isn't processing feedback from the world. Many autistic children start out OK but shut down a little later on around 4-8. Though the details different a little, the reasons are basically the same as what makes an alcoholic. They cannot process all the information coming in to them.

In the case of my daughter, it is more sensory related. So when she was young, every couple of hours we would brush her skin, arms and legs, with a special brush, do joint compressions, etc. Now, when she get "unregulated" I pull her aside and we toss a ball back-n-forth for 10 minutes. She right as rain.

She hates the attention to her issues but she is more aware of what she needs to do. So she will ask me to toss the ball when she needs it. But her sense of justice is on a god-level. Nobody can get away with anything.

But even so, she can get stuck in events. It took us a while to figure it out how to help her process it. But say someone hit her in school, or some kid threw up on the rug. It could take months for her to stop talking about it.

Autism is strongly about the mind not processing information and getting stuck in "obsessive loops." So are many mental disorders. But so is alcoholism.

Way more of us humans have these "quirks" then we might first suspect. We just don't catch them, but instead put people in jail that do stupid things. A study recently revealed that almost 70% of homeless people, and people in half-way houses are on the autism scale. They cannot keep jobs, they cannot focus for long, and they freak out under pressure.

AA works for alcoholics because it provides them a method of processing their emotions. The 12 steps are a diagram of how to work through denial and mental feedback that they have done something wrong.

So even if a person isn't "drinking" they can still have this mental glitch that inhabits normal processing of emotional data, causing build up that causes obsessions, distractions, and such that alcohol gives them a release from. And it doesn't all have be about bad stuff.

Humans can be happy. We want to be joyful and celebrate. But our culture is pretty uptight and so the only way to really let go and let loose is lower the inhibitions with alcohol. Even that "joyful" emotion gets blocked and causes disease.

I won't tell you what to do with your husband, but I'm going to suggest that your child has the same struggle, just earlier in the game and perhaps a little more serious.
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Old 08-28-2016, 09:19 AM
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LordChallen....a very interesting post....
As a side note....I am struck at how your description of "cannot keep jobs, cannot focus for long, and freak out under pressure" fits the description of untreated Adult Attention deficit Disorder".....it is for certain that so man, many, homeless and those in jail/prison suffer from this common and undiagnosed disorder, also.....
thanks for this post....
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Old 08-28-2016, 09:57 AM
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Oh yeah - my XAH is certainly ADD with splash of bipolar. He was on anti-depressants, but still had trouble sequencing steps of daily living, has multiple advanced degrees....
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Old 08-28-2016, 10:00 AM
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Originally Posted by dandylion View Post
LordChallen....a very interesting post....
As a side note....I am struck at how your description of "cannot keep jobs, cannot focus for long, and freak out under pressure" fits the description of untreated Adult Attention deficit Disorder".....it is for certain that so man, many, homeless and those in jail/prison suffer from this common and undiagnosed disorder, also.....
thanks for this post....
I'm with the school of thought that says, ADD, ADHD, OCD, ODD, and other O's and D's and Asperger's all belong what we call the autism spectrum.

Most of my "education" came by way of spiritual pursuit and personal experience with myself and family.

I don't believe in evil in the sense that most people do, but I do have a definition for it.

Evil, e-veil, or even "energy veil."

Basically, we are good people. Life is good. God is good. Anything that falls under the spectrum of "stupid, insensitive, or evil" are mental or emotional blocks in the mind that cut us off from natural feedback from the world.

The mind is inherently designed to process feedback from the world. In other words, if we hurt someone, (according to the rule we have accepted) the mind tries to inform us and correct our behavior. Same with hurting ourselves, as in the mind context our body is actually in the 3rd person. But if this information doesn't come through, then people are "allowed" to do stupid, cruel, and insensitive things.

But even so, that information keeps trying to come through. In the case of alcohol, they are perhaps more equipped to address this stuff. But they don't and they cope by drinking. They stop off the message system that tries to correct their behavior.

The 12 steps is a way of "manually" processing these emotions, as is sharing and talking about them.

People on the autism spectrum . . . . . as a whole, don't have a system to address their needs. But its sort of the same. But because of their social awkwardness the problems compound over time. It takes some pretty serious love and support as well as mild isolation from the real world for guys to be ok.
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Old 08-28-2016, 12:29 PM
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I totally get it. I also think that alcoholic parent is just about the worst kind of parent for a child on a spectrum (any any child for that matter - but ASD kids require consistency and predictability - something that is lacking with A's). Things are so much easier when contact is sparse and only includes fun stuff - like hiking, swimming in the lake.....DS still smells XAH's breath (trying to "hide" it - but is pretty obvious about it). I feel for XAH and his processing difficulties, I really do, but this right here, this breath smelling habit of DS is just confirming that XAH is nowhere near being a good father any time soon. I hope it changes.
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Old 08-28-2016, 12:53 PM
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Nata you're so right. When ah went on his last month plus long bender my son went from seeing him frequently to not seeing him at all. My son began acting out awfully - to the point where his school called a meeting with me and I had to explain the whole crazy situation. That's why I don't want to revert to that kind of situation again. He sees him now but I don't want him to get too used to it. I hope I have the strength. It's not good for me either.
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Old 08-28-2016, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by pndm07 View Post
Nata you're so right. When ah went on his last month plus long bender my son went from seeing him frequently to not seeing him at all. My son began acting out awfully - to the point where his school called a meeting with me and I had to explain the whole crazy situation. That's why I don't want to revert to that kind of situation again. He sees him now but I don't want him to get too used to it. I hope I have the strength. It's not good for me either.
Sending you positive vibes! Any child would act out in this situation, ASD or not. With my DS, every time XAH relapsed, even when I did not know - I could predict by behavior slip. It's like he knew way before me. He would also ask XAH obsessively "are you ok Dad?" and I could not understand why it made XAH so angry. Little did I know, he felt like his secret relapse was exposed.

The whole chaos and popping in and out with addict parent does a number on kids for sure.

I wish strength to you and your little guy - you can do this!
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Old 08-28-2016, 03:29 PM
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Thanks Nata, they are amazingly intuitive aren't they. Sending hugs to you and your son too!
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Old 08-29-2016, 09:04 AM
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Pndm, I feel ya. I'm yet another with a very similar situation as you know from your comments on my posts.

My AH also tries to get me to continue enabling, pushing by not committing to a visitation schedule, spending as much time as possible at our apartment because his current living situation is "unbearable", not dealing with the fact that the divorce IS happening so he won't answer me on if he will sign custody orders, won't figure out a better living situation, won't discuss how to best split our financials.

Yesterday he came over with his back completely out and spent the day laying around the house with a sad, sad victim face while I took care our daughter. When I offered to give him a ride to his home, he told me that he "needs my help to take care of him" until his back is better. He had brought stuff over assuming he'd stay over. When I told him no, he was totally shocked and angry.

Anyway, I've tried the loose schedule as well, I've tried to reason with him, but it's all for naught. The most helpful thing I've heard lately is that I'm acting as if I'm dealing with a rational person and that is so far from the truth. Just that fact has helped me see that there is no point to conversations, that I am going to have to draw a hard line, that I will have to go through the courts to get any decisions made and I'm going to have to deal with the fact that he will view any actions I take as utterly horrible and play the victim. It sounds as if you will have to do the same.

All my best to you. You are doing the best you can and you are doing what's best for you and your son.
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