Spouse in denial
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 18
Spouse in denial
Hi there. Without going too much into it at the moment, I have been with my spouse for nearly 6 years and I can clearly see that she has become an alcoholic (or possibly always has been).
I've never looked on the internet for help before but a few days ago I did and found a survey showing that I have been enabling her in 7/12 ways.
I had no idea. The main factor is that I drink with her just to keep the peace and put a smile on her face although the excessive drinking is making me ill.
Two days ago I told her that I want to stop drinking and although she's in complete denial she begged for one last night because she enjoys it and I gave in on the promise it was the last time.
So yesterday came and the day went well, she had an early night without asking or hinting for booze. However, come this morning she has sraight away started the usual process. She has asked for 'something to look forward to' which I know means a drink tonight.
I know unless I give in today will be a nightmare and we'll end up arguing so I'm just looking for some words of advice anc encouragement to stay strong really...
Thanks a lot, Raheem.
I've never looked on the internet for help before but a few days ago I did and found a survey showing that I have been enabling her in 7/12 ways.
I had no idea. The main factor is that I drink with her just to keep the peace and put a smile on her face although the excessive drinking is making me ill.
Two days ago I told her that I want to stop drinking and although she's in complete denial she begged for one last night because she enjoys it and I gave in on the promise it was the last time.
So yesterday came and the day went well, she had an early night without asking or hinting for booze. However, come this morning she has sraight away started the usual process. She has asked for 'something to look forward to' which I know means a drink tonight.
I know unless I give in today will be a nightmare and we'll end up arguing so I'm just looking for some words of advice anc encouragement to stay strong really...
Thanks a lot, Raheem.
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Join Date: May 2013
Location: east coast
Posts: 1,332
Hi,
Welcome to the forum. I am glad your reached out. Drinking just to keep the status quo is no fun. I think you should sit down with your wife and just tell her honestly you don't enjoy drinking to get drunk. She of course is free to do so if she wants but you just aren't going to do it anymore. Don't accuse, blame or point fingers simply state your feelings. Being married doesn't mean we must do everything with our spouses. But we do have to respect them as individuals and accept that they do have the right to live their lives as they want.
Welcome to the forum. I am glad your reached out. Drinking just to keep the status quo is no fun. I think you should sit down with your wife and just tell her honestly you don't enjoy drinking to get drunk. She of course is free to do so if she wants but you just aren't going to do it anymore. Don't accuse, blame or point fingers simply state your feelings. Being married doesn't mean we must do everything with our spouses. But we do have to respect them as individuals and accept that they do have the right to live their lives as they want.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: atlanta, ga
Posts: 3,581
Hi Raheem and welcome, sorry for what you are going through.
The 3C's - you didn't cause it, you can't cure it, you can't control it. It sounds like you have placed yourself in the situation between your wife and her drinking. I am glad you have decided to stop.
Whether your wife drinks is her business. She is an adult. Monitoring her drinking by giving her permission to drink, making the drinks, or telling her when she can and can't drink is not going work (it only did because you were drinking too). trying to manage an alcoholics consumption is crazy making and yes you will fight argue, and in the end she WILL DRINK ANYWAY.
My advice when she comes home tonight is to tell her you won't be drinking. If she wants to drink let her go get it, make it or whatever she does. No longer "put your hands" on her alcohol. Alcoholism is a disease of denial. There are many manipulations that alcoholics do to lie to themselves and others about their problem. Making you part of the equation of drinking yourself , and giving her permission to drink, makes you accountable. If she drinks too much its your fault....if you are bothered by how much she drinks well, you drink just as much! To you, you are controlling and managing the situation (Not), to her, its your responsibility. No Thanks!
Let her drink. You walk your own path. Its time you really looked the situation through sober eyes - more will be revealed. I highly suggest you go to an Al Anon meeting and start working on your codependency.
The 3C's - you didn't cause it, you can't cure it, you can't control it. It sounds like you have placed yourself in the situation between your wife and her drinking. I am glad you have decided to stop.
Whether your wife drinks is her business. She is an adult. Monitoring her drinking by giving her permission to drink, making the drinks, or telling her when she can and can't drink is not going work (it only did because you were drinking too). trying to manage an alcoholics consumption is crazy making and yes you will fight argue, and in the end she WILL DRINK ANYWAY.
My advice when she comes home tonight is to tell her you won't be drinking. If she wants to drink let her go get it, make it or whatever she does. No longer "put your hands" on her alcohol. Alcoholism is a disease of denial. There are many manipulations that alcoholics do to lie to themselves and others about their problem. Making you part of the equation of drinking yourself , and giving her permission to drink, makes you accountable. If she drinks too much its your fault....if you are bothered by how much she drinks well, you drink just as much! To you, you are controlling and managing the situation (Not), to her, its your responsibility. No Thanks!
Let her drink. You walk your own path. Its time you really looked the situation through sober eyes - more will be revealed. I highly suggest you go to an Al Anon meeting and start working on your codependency.
Sober since 10th April 2012
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 6,047
Hi Raheem, I agree with the others in saying you can decouple from her drinking. I'm sure she'd like you to validate her drinking, but if you're over it then stop.
You're saying if you don't give in it will be a 'nightmare'. It sounds like she's used to getting her own way, and is capable of making your life uncomfortable if you don't give in. This is not a relationship between adults but a bully and a victim.
If you're afraid of her, or have just had enough, think about how you're going to handle it when she escalates. Just because she wants an argument doesn't mean you have to buy into it, and you don't have to hang around an listen to abuse either.
You're saying if you don't give in it will be a 'nightmare'. It sounds like she's used to getting her own way, and is capable of making your life uncomfortable if you don't give in. This is not a relationship between adults but a bully and a victim.
If you're afraid of her, or have just had enough, think about how you're going to handle it when she escalates. Just because she wants an argument doesn't mean you have to buy into it, and you don't have to hang around an listen to abuse either.
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
Hi, raheem,
I'll ditto what the others have said. When you drink with her, or accommodate her drinking, that does make you complicit in it (even though it's ultimately her responsibility, not yours).
I'd suggest telling her you are very concerned about her health, that you enjoy her company when she is sober but that her drinking makes you worried and uncomfortable, and from now on, if she chooses to do that, she will be doing it without your help and without your company.
You don't have to give her the silent treatment or anything (in fact, you shouldn't do anything that comes off as "punishing" her), just pleasantly go about whatever you would do otherwise. If she gets angry and hostile, just tell her you won't be treated that way and leave the room.
A couple of other things. Try not to count drinks, don't pour out her booze, and don't roll your eyes or argue with her about it. The idea is to remove you from the drinking, not to pull her out of it. It's about not enabling, not about controlling her.
If you haven't tried Al-Anon, it can be VERY helpful in dealing with the effects her drinking have had on you. And stick around here--there is a lot of great support.
I'll ditto what the others have said. When you drink with her, or accommodate her drinking, that does make you complicit in it (even though it's ultimately her responsibility, not yours).
I'd suggest telling her you are very concerned about her health, that you enjoy her company when she is sober but that her drinking makes you worried and uncomfortable, and from now on, if she chooses to do that, she will be doing it without your help and without your company.
You don't have to give her the silent treatment or anything (in fact, you shouldn't do anything that comes off as "punishing" her), just pleasantly go about whatever you would do otherwise. If she gets angry and hostile, just tell her you won't be treated that way and leave the room.
A couple of other things. Try not to count drinks, don't pour out her booze, and don't roll your eyes or argue with her about it. The idea is to remove you from the drinking, not to pull her out of it. It's about not enabling, not about controlling her.
If you haven't tried Al-Anon, it can be VERY helpful in dealing with the effects her drinking have had on you. And stick around here--there is a lot of great support.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 18
Thanks for all of the amazing posts.
It is most definitely a case of being pressured into drinking just to keep the peace. I've tried to explain in the past how I feel but she just claims that she doesn't force the drink down my throat which is 100% correct, but peer pressure from the woman you love dearly is a strong thing.
I realise now that me drinking along for the sake of it is terrible and gives her the impression that it is normal to share 4 or 5 bottles of wine each night.
I've always thought of us drinking or not drinking as a couples thing but the posts above really help in feeling that I don't need to join in so thank you. Hopefully it will be the same with her and she will stop if I do but that of course remains to be seen.
I like a drink as much as a lot of people but I can drink socially in moderation. Unfortunately it has gotten to the stage for me where I'm ashamed to take her out in public if we're having a drink.
I fell out with my family for over a year because of her drunken behaviour and we no longer get invited places by my friends as she is really vulgar and inappropriate when drunk.
I hate saying all of these things about her as I love her more than anything but I just can't say it to anyone else so sorry for the rant.
I think by the above comments and experiences it's clear I can't change her but I've just been living in a false hope and need to let her be.
Is it likely she'll ever change from other experiences?
Thanks, Raheem.
It is most definitely a case of being pressured into drinking just to keep the peace. I've tried to explain in the past how I feel but she just claims that she doesn't force the drink down my throat which is 100% correct, but peer pressure from the woman you love dearly is a strong thing.
I realise now that me drinking along for the sake of it is terrible and gives her the impression that it is normal to share 4 or 5 bottles of wine each night.
I've always thought of us drinking or not drinking as a couples thing but the posts above really help in feeling that I don't need to join in so thank you. Hopefully it will be the same with her and she will stop if I do but that of course remains to be seen.
I like a drink as much as a lot of people but I can drink socially in moderation. Unfortunately it has gotten to the stage for me where I'm ashamed to take her out in public if we're having a drink.
I fell out with my family for over a year because of her drunken behaviour and we no longer get invited places by my friends as she is really vulgar and inappropriate when drunk.
I hate saying all of these things about her as I love her more than anything but I just can't say it to anyone else so sorry for the rant.
I think by the above comments and experiences it's clear I can't change her but I've just been living in a false hope and need to let her be.
Is it likely she'll ever change from other experiences?
Thanks, Raheem.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 667
raheem,
As a male that has been through the same things, let me reach out and say this. The absolute best thing you can do is what you are doing....learning.
Learning about what you are dealing with. As you do that it will become clearer to you the path that will need be followed.
In addition to alcohol, my ex had a problem with sex. So as you describe needing to drink to keep her happy, interchange that with sex. If I didn't go along with it, she just went out to get it elsewhere. For my ex drinking and sex were coupled pretty closely. If I rejected either, it was trouble for me.
Once you start to see the road map ahead, you will know better where to steer yourself.
Welcome to SR. You won't agree with everything you read here, so take what works and leave the rest. Nobody is here to try and do anything but be of help to you here.
As a male that has been through the same things, let me reach out and say this. The absolute best thing you can do is what you are doing....learning.
Learning about what you are dealing with. As you do that it will become clearer to you the path that will need be followed.
In addition to alcohol, my ex had a problem with sex. So as you describe needing to drink to keep her happy, interchange that with sex. If I didn't go along with it, she just went out to get it elsewhere. For my ex drinking and sex were coupled pretty closely. If I rejected either, it was trouble for me.
Once you start to see the road map ahead, you will know better where to steer yourself.
Welcome to SR. You won't agree with everything you read here, so take what works and leave the rest. Nobody is here to try and do anything but be of help to you here.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 5,450
I am sorry my friend but no one here can possibly predict what your wife's bottom might be. We can tell you that most of us tried anything and everything to make our loved ones realize how much better life could be sober, and that we learned the hard way that there are no magic words or actions that will change another person until they themselves are ready to change.
Many of us also learned that the best thing we could do was focus on ourselves and our own behaviors and choices. Your wife is an adult with the right to drink herself into oblivion if she chooses. You are also an adult with the right to not have a front row seat to that devastation. Next time she wants to spend an evening with three or four bottles of wine, why don't you try re-connecting with some of those folks who gave already enforced their own healthy boundaries about not spending time with someone active in their own addiction? I am sure they would love to see you.
Many of us also learned that the best thing we could do was focus on ourselves and our own behaviors and choices. Your wife is an adult with the right to drink herself into oblivion if she chooses. You are also an adult with the right to not have a front row seat to that devastation. Next time she wants to spend an evening with three or four bottles of wine, why don't you try re-connecting with some of those folks who gave already enforced their own healthy boundaries about not spending time with someone active in their own addiction? I am sure they would love to see you.
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
Agree with SparkleKitty--there is no telling when (or if) your wife will decide she's had enough. Right now she sees nothing wrong with it. For most people (I've been in two marriages to alcoholics and I'm now seven years sober, myself), it takes some negative consequences to realize what alcohol is doing to them. For some it's a health scare. For others, it's a partner leaving. For some, it's a humiliating experience or an arrest. For some people, seemingly NOTHING is enough to stop them.
One of the best things you can do is to allow her to experience the natural consequences of her drinking. That doesn't mean you manufacture a crisis, but if it happens, you don't jump in and save the day to soften the blow. If she gets arrested for driving drunk, she bails herself out and figures out her own way to get around with a suspended license, for example.
Just an FYI, it takes some people years or decades to decide they want to get sober.
One other suggestion, you didn't mention children. Do NOT start a family with this woman. Parenthood will NOT make her more responsible. And once kids are in the picture, they suffer greatly as a result of living with an alcoholic parent.
One of the best things you can do is to allow her to experience the natural consequences of her drinking. That doesn't mean you manufacture a crisis, but if it happens, you don't jump in and save the day to soften the blow. If she gets arrested for driving drunk, she bails herself out and figures out her own way to get around with a suspended license, for example.
Just an FYI, it takes some people years or decades to decide they want to get sober.
One other suggestion, you didn't mention children. Do NOT start a family with this woman. Parenthood will NOT make her more responsible. And once kids are in the picture, they suffer greatly as a result of living with an alcoholic parent.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 91
I was drinking with my husband more often than I wanted to for myself. In the words of my ever so wise deceased AF, "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em!" Ugh!
A few weeks ago I just stopped. I didn't announce it or anything. I just declined if AH offered to make me a drink. I think he's beginning to wonder what's going on, but he hasn't said anything. And just like everyone here says, he just drinks anyway. My not drinking hasn't slowed his down. I don't think he ever really cared if I was drinking with him just as long as he gets to do what he wants.
But I feel better. So much better.
I hope things go well for you at your house tonight.
A few weeks ago I just stopped. I didn't announce it or anything. I just declined if AH offered to make me a drink. I think he's beginning to wonder what's going on, but he hasn't said anything. And just like everyone here says, he just drinks anyway. My not drinking hasn't slowed his down. I don't think he ever really cared if I was drinking with him just as long as he gets to do what he wants.
But I feel better. So much better.
I hope things go well for you at your house tonight.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,103
I’ve lost a relationship with my brother because of his wife’s vile and disrespectful drunken behavior which has grown to every time she drinks. My brother has made a choice to tolerate it which has locked him into a jail cell of isolation.
Several years ago I received a frantic phone call from him saying he had enough and asking her for a separation/divorce due to her drinking. Her response was to have a “dramatic 911 call stating she swallowed a bottle of pills and was killing herself because her husband left her” she ended up in the hospital via ambulance where she begged the staff to call her husband. No drugs were found in her system only alcohol. My brother stated to the mental health people along with her that her drinking has become to the point where he will no longer be around it or her. She chose to go to a 28 day rehab and he thought the problem was “fixed”. He also chose NOT to seek help for himself via therapy or al-anon.
This was NOT her bottom, she began drinking again and the entire cycle is playing out again. All of his Facebook posts are of them out dining and drinking with a whole new set of temporary friends.
The best thing I would suggest is to learn as much as you can about alcoholism, about typical alcoholic behaviors and how manipulation plays a major part.
I would also say that by you not drinking isn’t going to control her drinking.
Much like her having to really want to stop drinking…………..you also need to really not want to be around it and be willing to do whatever it takes to accomplish that.
Several years ago I received a frantic phone call from him saying he had enough and asking her for a separation/divorce due to her drinking. Her response was to have a “dramatic 911 call stating she swallowed a bottle of pills and was killing herself because her husband left her” she ended up in the hospital via ambulance where she begged the staff to call her husband. No drugs were found in her system only alcohol. My brother stated to the mental health people along with her that her drinking has become to the point where he will no longer be around it or her. She chose to go to a 28 day rehab and he thought the problem was “fixed”. He also chose NOT to seek help for himself via therapy or al-anon.
This was NOT her bottom, she began drinking again and the entire cycle is playing out again. All of his Facebook posts are of them out dining and drinking with a whole new set of temporary friends.
The best thing I would suggest is to learn as much as you can about alcoholism, about typical alcoholic behaviors and how manipulation plays a major part.
I would also say that by you not drinking isn’t going to control her drinking.
Much like her having to really want to stop drinking…………..you also need to really not want to be around it and be willing to do whatever it takes to accomplish that.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 18
Thanks again everyone.
Yesterday went well. There were many hints throughout the day but I didn't bite to them and instead of going out and buying wine she sort of confided in me for the first time.
She admitted she has a 'habit' that needs breaking but not an addiction. We decided on an initial 21-day plan to break the habit and then reassess.
We do have kids, and to be honest they are the only reason I've stuck around so long. I can't imagine not being with them every day. I've wrongly apologised and took the blame for a lot in the past just for their sake so I definitely know how complicated kids make the situation.
There's a lot to go into but I'll keep it short for now and see how we get on. 2 and-a-half days and counting which is the biggest break we've had from drinking for a long time.
Thanks, Raheem.
Yesterday went well. There were many hints throughout the day but I didn't bite to them and instead of going out and buying wine she sort of confided in me for the first time.
She admitted she has a 'habit' that needs breaking but not an addiction. We decided on an initial 21-day plan to break the habit and then reassess.
We do have kids, and to be honest they are the only reason I've stuck around so long. I can't imagine not being with them every day. I've wrongly apologised and took the blame for a lot in the past just for their sake so I definitely know how complicated kids make the situation.
There's a lot to go into but I'll keep it short for now and see how we get on. 2 and-a-half days and counting which is the biggest break we've had from drinking for a long time.
Thanks, Raheem.
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
Well, that feeling you're getting about not having any booze in your system is certainly something to keep an eye on. I don't know any people who aren't in trouble with/headed for trouble with alcohol who describe feeling that way.
And her acknowledgement she has a "bad habit" is a start, at least. I don't know anyone who acknowledged being an alcoholic right out of the box.
As we like to say around here, "more will be revealed."
And her acknowledgement she has a "bad habit" is a start, at least. I don't know anyone who acknowledged being an alcoholic right out of the box.
As we like to say around here, "more will be revealed."
Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,452
Hey, Raheem, what do you mean by "I failed"? What's happening at your house right now?
We're all here for you, and many of us have been in similar situations to what you were describing before, and we'd like to support you however you need it.
ShootingStar1
We're all here for you, and many of us have been in similar situations to what you were describing before, and we'd like to support you however you need it.
ShootingStar1
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 18
Hi guys.
I'll elaborate a little on that sorry.
Saturday night I finally gave in after being harrassed all day, I couldn't take it any longer and went out and bought wine just for some peace. It was on the promise that it was again the last time.
Then Sunday afternoon I went and met up with my friends and when I came home she had the usual 4 bottles ready like it was the norm again. I had to drink with her as I'd been out for a couple of hours so she deserved some of my time. That's how she makes it out anyway. If I do something by myself, I have to make it up to her by drinking with her.
Today she was really happy like everything was going her way again. She wants a 'nice night' which I said is great but I'm not drinking any wine.
Since then her whole demeanor has changed and she's trying it all. Moody, then coming on to me, then threatening to go out and leave etc. Etc.
I said do what you want but I'm still not drinking. I've said drink by yourself or whatever but apparently I have to drink with her. I've explained we don't have to at all but nothing is sinking in. It's just going to be one of them days...
Thanks, Raheem.
P.S. After the initial jitters I was fine. I definitely don't NEED to drink like my other half does.
I'll elaborate a little on that sorry.
Saturday night I finally gave in after being harrassed all day, I couldn't take it any longer and went out and bought wine just for some peace. It was on the promise that it was again the last time.
Then Sunday afternoon I went and met up with my friends and when I came home she had the usual 4 bottles ready like it was the norm again. I had to drink with her as I'd been out for a couple of hours so she deserved some of my time. That's how she makes it out anyway. If I do something by myself, I have to make it up to her by drinking with her.
Today she was really happy like everything was going her way again. She wants a 'nice night' which I said is great but I'm not drinking any wine.
Since then her whole demeanor has changed and she's trying it all. Moody, then coming on to me, then threatening to go out and leave etc. Etc.
I said do what you want but I'm still not drinking. I've said drink by yourself or whatever but apparently I have to drink with her. I've explained we don't have to at all but nothing is sinking in. It's just going to be one of them days...
Thanks, Raheem.
P.S. After the initial jitters I was fine. I definitely don't NEED to drink like my other half does.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Pa
Posts: 4,872
I was thinking of the name of your thread, "spouse in denial". I can so relate to that. I'm a RA who was in a relationship with an abusive alcoholic. I tried to keep the peace with him by drinking with him, then I continued with the drinking to self medicate myself while I would be hiding in the garage from him.
I think at one time prior to being with him, that perhaps I did have some coping skills, thing is, none of my coping skills were working with him. I didn't want drinking to be part of my life, but I wasn't able to deal with life with him without drinking. Does that sound familiar?
The reason my coping skills weren't working, was because I really never set any boundaries, and any boundaries that I did have, I wasn't strong enough to enforce them. I was getting weaker everyday.
I know the jitters that you felt. That was withdrawal. I would suggest when you get like that, go to walmart and they have a free blood pressure machine. Use it. This is what withdrawals cause.
I know you just joined here recently, I do strongly suggest that you listen to what is being said here. Do a lot of reading around here also.
I would suggest finding out what boundaries are and how to enforce them. I would suggest that you find out about coping skills. This is the stuff that I am working on now.
You have 2 children, I think you said, and they are watching you and your actions so that they can develop their own boundaries and coping skills.
You have this in you. Here for you.
((((((hugs))))))
amy
I think at one time prior to being with him, that perhaps I did have some coping skills, thing is, none of my coping skills were working with him. I didn't want drinking to be part of my life, but I wasn't able to deal with life with him without drinking. Does that sound familiar?
The reason my coping skills weren't working, was because I really never set any boundaries, and any boundaries that I did have, I wasn't strong enough to enforce them. I was getting weaker everyday.
I know the jitters that you felt. That was withdrawal. I would suggest when you get like that, go to walmart and they have a free blood pressure machine. Use it. This is what withdrawals cause.
I know you just joined here recently, I do strongly suggest that you listen to what is being said here. Do a lot of reading around here also.
I would suggest finding out what boundaries are and how to enforce them. I would suggest that you find out about coping skills. This is the stuff that I am working on now.
You have 2 children, I think you said, and they are watching you and your actions so that they can develop their own boundaries and coping skills.
You have this in you. Here for you.
((((((hugs))))))
amy
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