?Faith?

[sgettman]

My father raised me to believe that church was a religious cult and all they wanted was money. I grew up believing that God was not real because if he was why would I be in the situation I was in. I was raised in an alcoholic home. I grew up with my own addictions to the drink and drugs. I have been in a 12 step program for over a year. Faith has not come easy to me. Some days I believe with all my heart and other days I wonder. Some people seem to have that instant overwhelming sensation of his touch and others seem to struggle and never get that sensation. This is where I really have troubles with. Why? What is different between two non believers who are trying to learn about god get two complete different responses? I keep telling myself maybe I am missing something. The days I do feel close I begin to feel that I am doing it wrong because I do not have that awe feeling.

[Captain Morgan]

My father raised me to believe that church was a religious cult and all they wanted was money.

No true teacher or follower of Christ walking in the spirit will do anything in expectation of financial reward or gain:

Titus 1
7 For a bishop must be blameless, as the steward of God; not selfwilled, not soon angry, not given to wine, no striker, not given to filthy lucre (monetary gain);
8 But a lover of hospitality, a lover of good men, sober, just, holy, temperate;
9 Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.
10 For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers, specially they of the circumcision:
11 Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucre's sake.

I grew up believing that God was not real because if he was why would I be in the situation I was in. I was raised in an alcoholic home. I grew up with my own addictions to the drink and drugs. I have been in a 12 step program for over a year.

Knowing I did not create myself, I submit myself to the one that created me. I know that even if I decide to fight, be bitter, or resent my creator, it will not matter, because how will I prevail against his power? With that in mind I praise Him, and plead with Him to show mercy on me, and any good thing I receive is a gift I do not deserve(grace). How can I earn it? What can I do for God that He can not do for himself? When I die in this world, I will be subject to His judgement:

Romans 9
20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?
21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?

In order to receive mercy from God, we must show others mercy: in order to be forgiven, we must forgive.This is the commandment of God through Christ, that we love one another:

John 13
34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

Matthew 6
14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Matthew 5
7 Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.

Some people seem to have that instant overwhelming sensation of his touch and others seem to struggle and never get that sensation. This is where I really have troubles with. Why? What is different between two non believers who are trying to learn about god get two complete different responses? I keep telling myself maybe I am missing something. The days I do feel close I begin to feel that I am doing it wrong because I do not have that awe feeling.

I'm not sure how to address this, other than to say God does not promise a sensational experience, or an experience through the senses, but an experience of peace, and a hope not for this world, but for the world to come. God does not promise Christians an easy, problem-free life in this world, but a successful ending:

Romans 8
28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

[best]

Originally Posted by sgettman

My father raised me to believe that church was a religious cult and all they wanted was money. in part that is true but not all churches are like that. I grew up believing that God was not real because if he was why would I be in the situation I was in. the sins of the world are why we all live in troubled times, some more then others but still we all do I was raised in an alcoholic home. I grew up with my own addictions to the drink and drugs. I have been in a 12 step program for over a year. Faith has not come easy to me. and because of that, your reward would be more so. Some days I believe with all my heart and other days I wonder. Some people seem to have that instant overwhelming sensation of his touch and others seem to struggle and never get that sensation. and for those who are shown bigger sensations and believe, then those who believe because of a pure faith Greater will be the rewards in heaven. This is where I really have troubles with. Why? I would think the reason why is satan plays mind games and tries to beat down our faith. You are being honest with your feelings. Doubts come to all at one time or another. When satan tries to bring doubts or tries to remind us of our past... remind him of his future and then tell him to get lost. What is different between two non believers who are trying to learn about god get two complete different responses? from my own experience I would tend to believe God gives us what we need, what each needs to find the path. Some a warm overwhelming feeling, some a simple understanding of life as we walk about. From what you write I would say you understand quick and don't need the warm and fuzzy feelings that others may have gotten. I keep telling myself maybe I am missing something. The days I do feel close I begin to feel that I am doing it wrong because I do not have that awe feeling.

God promise... to give us life when we accept the works of Jesus on the cross. To give us grace as needed. To give us His strength to deal with what ever comes our way in life. His grace, peace, love, joy, and guidance to get us through. He doesn't tell us it will be easy. Matter of fact, He tells us it can and may be tough but that He will never leave us nore forsake us through what ever comes along. He will share in our joys and will share in our sorrows as well. Faith is belief in what we can't see, is what some people say. I feel that faith is a trust in God and over time He has shown me He is faithful beyond measure. I have grown to see He is always faithful and I have no need to ever doubt Him or His word. " I have grown" as you will also. Read His word, study His word and stay in communication with Him daily and your growth will come all the faster.

It's not about the awe feeling sgettman.

It's about a relationship and about the work that God needs to do within us so we can have a relationship. Some of the most painful times in my life are the times I can think back on with the most gratitude. Those are the times when God's word was planted in me and now I can have faith because of it. My walk with God has been with great suffering. The joy that I felt was learning the truth of who he is. It's not an "awe" joy. It's a truth joy. God let me search for years before he started showing me and the path was hard. I used to feel just as you do. Now I'm glad that the awe didn't get in the way and satisfy me.

None of us are good. No one is better than another person. We are all equally sinful. None of us can do it right. Paul said I must decrease and God must increase. You can't do it wrong and block God. He is bigger than that. I've done it all wrong and God still manages to teach me truth and reveal himself to me.

I spent 10 years without any kind of contact with God. The only thing that got me through that was the truth that God showed me and the gift of faith that he gave me. "Awe" would have never gotten me through that.

We don't live by emotions or site or intelligence, but by every word that comes from God. Everything else is building our house on sand. When the wind comes the house falls down.

Hugs,
MG

[Captain Morgan]

Originally Posted by Morning Glory

None of us are good. No one is better than another person. We are all equally sinful. None of us can do it right. Paul said I must decrease and God must increase. You can't do it wrong and block God. He is bigger than that. I've done it all wrong and God still manages to teach me truth and reveal himself to me.
Hugs, MG

MG makes a good point here. There is no level of Christian. We're all the same in Christ, and we're all the same without Him; to put our trust in another human being is a very dangerous thing, whether it be the apostle Paul, King David, Moses, or a church leader with a fancy title; anyone other than Christ.

Romans 3
9 What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;
10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

Also:

Ephesians 4
4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.



When we trust in another human being, it's just a matter of time before we'll be let down. King David, who God in the Bible called a man after his own heart, messed up over and over again. It also leads us open and vulnerable to false teachers:

Matthew 15
14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

Also:

2 Peter 1
20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

I've done it all wrong and God still manages to teach me truth and reveal himself to me.

This reminds me of the story of Jonah. No matter how much Jonah fought God, where did he end up? Right where God wanted him. I sometimes marvel at my own life. It took times of bashing myself against sin and breaking myself into pieces before I was ready to submit to God; it wasn't the times when I seemingly had everything together. We will never be free of sin or its temptation as long as our temple is this vile body, but we have the hope of one day receiving the glorified body God has promised us. We just need to keep our eyes on the prize:

Hebrews 12
1 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,
2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

[sgettman]

Thanks to all of your advise. I understand about half of what you all said but I know that if I continue to learn I will get there. Thanks again.

[TheSandBoxHero]

I completely understand your quarrels, sgettman. I really struggled with that when I first started my walk a couple months ago. I came to the conclusion that there was a God, and waited for Him to give me some sort of intangible "HUZZAH!", that I may know He is with me beyond a shadow of a doubt.

Well, see, it doesn't exactly work like that. I waited and waited for that "HUZZAH!", and it didn't come.

If God would put things like that in our life, things that would affirmate His presense in some kind of physical manifestation, then there would be no need for faith, because we would always have that proof that would prevent our 'faith' from ever wavering.

That might not make sense, but it's kind of hard to explain...sorry.

What I found, however, was that once I obtained a true faith in Him, I get that "HUZZAH!" every single time I notice/think of/recognize His presense in my life at that givin second (which happens about a bazzilion times a day). When I pray, I often get giddy, and get cold chills one right after the other down my spine.

But that's just me. That's the physical manifestation of my faith, of KNOWING that there IS a God, that one of His names is Jesus Christ, and that he knows me and loves me more than I could ever possibly know.

[sgettman]

Originally Posted by TheSandBoxHero

I completely understand your quarrels, sgettman. I really struggled with that when I first started my walk a couple months ago. I came to the conclusion that there was a God, and waited for Him to give me some sort of intangible "HUZZAH!", that I may know He is with me beyond a shadow of a doubt.

Well, see, it doesn't exactly work like that. I waited and waited for that "HUZZAH!", and it didn't come.

If God would put things like that in our life, things that would affirmate His presense in some kind of physical manifestation, then there would be no need for faith, because we would always have that proof that would prevent our 'faith' from ever wavering.

That might not make sense, but it's kind of hard to explain...sorry.

What I found, however, was that once I obtained a true faith in Him, I get that "HUZZAH!" every single time I notice/think of/recognize His presense in my life at that givin second (which happens about a bazzilion times a day). When I pray, I often get giddy, and get cold chills one right after the other down my spine.

But that's just me. That's the physical manifestation of my faith, of KNOWING that there IS a God, that one of His names is Jesus Christ, and that he knows me and loves me more than I could ever possibly know.

Thanks. I am starting to realize that he knows what each of us needs and how we need to gain that faith. My brother needed the AWE smash on the head where I don't. AWE growth. Funny how that works.