Christians...a question please

[leanna]

i have great respect for christianity.
i myself believe ,but i coudnt say im christian really because im not as disciplined in the going to church among other things.
My question is though

If one is saved, and the holy spirit enters that person...
wouldnt that persons addictions vanish. that and also theyre addictive personality, which also includes extremist behavioure, obsession and compulsion exc...you know, the traits addicts are usually cursed with??

I am so curiuse about this...becuaes i ahve a friend that is christian whom agrees that once a person has been saved and has grown close to god ....that person will no longer be an ADDICT. then i have another friend whom saids being close to god isnt enough, that NA or AA meetings are also required.
That confuses me....
If god is ever powerful and loving...i would assume that by seeking and finding him ....one no longer should have to battle with the dizease of addiction.

What is the thruthe here?

is it that friend number 2 just doesnt have enough faith in god and jesus to belivee that god has cured him??

[Captain Morgan]

Hi Leiana, that's a really good question. Many times I find myself questioning my salvation due to my addictions or to some other problems in my life I just can't seem to resolve. I think to myself, "How can I possibly be a Christian and still live the way I do? I shouldn't be struggling with alcoholism, or I shouldn't have said that or acted that way."

Somehow people have come to associate Christianity with perfection. You become a Christian and suddenly your problems disappear and you become the perfect individual that can do no wrong. Where do people get this idea? They probably get it from other Christians, and I think this is one of the biggest reasons Christianity is just the punchline to many jokes. I also think it leads people to reject God and become bitter towards Him because they feel they can't live up to His expectations.

Don't let any "Christians" fool you into believing they're perfect, because they're not. They may be able to appear to have it all together, but only God knows what's going on in their heart. That's why it says in the Bible that "man looketh on the outward appearance, but the Lord looketh on the heart" (1 Samuel 16:7-KJV). Be real, admit your faults as a Christian, and do your very best to follow Christ's example as presented in Mathew - John of the New Testament.

That's what I believe it is to be Christian. I think anything else is misleading and hypocritical, and hypocrisy is the #1 Christianity killer in my opinion. I know from my own experience these were the things that held me back from submitting to God: hypocrisy in the church, and the belief that I could never be good enough. Christ was and is perfect; I am not nor will I ever be in this lifetime. I have problems just like other humans, and addictions that I have to battle every day. But the one thing that keeps me going is my hope in the future. This world has nothing to offer me but vanity, but God offers true hope. A world without worries; a world without addictions; a world without pain; a world without all these problems that we have to deal with now: heaven.

Christianity has become so tangled and twisted that what should be and is really simple somehow seems so complex. In all this rambling I don't feel I've even begun to get to the point. Hopefully someone will come along who can articulate it much better.

P.S. Is Christianity really about going to church? It really is great to be a Christian once we can get past all of the rules and regulations, or the "dos and don'ts," and we can truly enjoy the freedom we have in Christ. That's why Christ came. To set us free from the Old Testament Law. When Christ came, to follow God was no longer about living by the law, but just in admitting we're human, we can't follow the law to perfection, and we need a saviour (Christ). I'm sorry if I've only added confusion, and I'll stop now before I confuse myself, haha.

Hello leiana and it's good to see you Captain Morgan.

I've been addicted to many things and I'm still addicted to a couple of things. I've been set free from many addictions and character defects and emotional damage. The way I was set free was not an easy trip. It was by knowing the truth and seeing the lie. I'm sure that God could just give me all the truth I needed to know in an instant, but I'm sure it would kill me if he did. Truth is hard to process. One little light bulb moment can knock us off our feet.

Jesus spent a lot of time preparing his disciples. Before he left them he told them he had a lot more to tell them, but they couldn't bare it now, but when the Holy Spirit came He would teach them all things. He didn't say they would know all things, but would be taught all things.

In my experience it has been confessing and telling the truth about who I am after God shows me who I am and the sin that I have. Then he shows me truth about who he is and then I can have faith in what I've learned and then I am set free of the issue at hand so I can move on to the next lesson and the next truth of who he is.

I reveal myself to him and he reveals himself to me. It's a relationship not a set of rules. The rules apply, but God in the relationship gives the power to obey the rules and the rules are not burdensome.

So if I'm still struggling with something then I know there is a truth about God that I still need to learn and that the lie still has control of me. Bondage is different from temptation. Bondage is when you're a slave and can't break free. Temptation is there to try to enslave you again. My fellowship is with my brother. He and I keep each other in check. We've learned a lot of truth together on our journey with God.

There is a post at the top of the board titled "Grace" It's really good.

Hugs,
MG

[leanna]

wow.
CAPTAIN MORGAN
thank u so much, as a matter of fact...u didnt confuse me at all.I understood everything u said and agree with many of them.sometimes one direct reply isnt as good as a thousand indirect ones.thank u..

[leanna]

MORNING GLORY

i agree with what u said about the bondage and the temptation,very true and makes much sense.most of all though u encourage hope that maybe i too will be set free someday of all the masks ive picked up along the way..(drug masks)that is.

god bless u and the captain.

thanks alot guys for everything

[leanna]

i wonder why noone else has answered this question...

[NeedingAnswers5]

Ephesians 6
12For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.

What I'm seeing is that an addict struggles with "self" or more like his enemy. Being a Christian is not easy when it comes to walking the walk. The promise is that God wants to prosper His people, and Satan wants to destroy God's people. Knowing that we are forgiven for our sins is what Christianity is all about. I need to have FAITH that Jesus has His hand on every situation, and allows everything that happens for a reason. Out of each lesson there is a blessing and we need to TRUST that the Lord is in control. Letting us go through what we go through to get one more step closer to Him is what it is all about. I have a addict in my life. I know that God has favor for Him. God has BIG plans for him, he has to do is humble himself and ask for God's hand on it. God is bigger than any addiction, but it is really all about how much we love God. Does and addict love God more than that drug? We need to remember why God keeps us here, we are here to draw others closer to God. My A will reach multitudes with his story, his testimony. I had to just stop worrying about the PROBLEM and pray about the solution. GOD IS GOOD and FAITHFUL. This is one of his MANY promises... Jeremiah 29:11 "For I know the plans I have for you," declares the Lord "plans to prosper you not to harm you plans for a hope and a future."

I know that crack can't give my A any of God's promises it can't PROSPER it CAN harm him it can't give him hope or a future.....so the devil is a lie each time he tries to trick my A....oh my I think I'm taking this too far. I guess the bottom line is we have an enemy, if you think you don't you are wrong. We need to use the WORD to protect us and the battle is in our head and flesh. Once the drug is gone and addict needs to fill it with LOVE and everything good! WHEW! I said a mouthfull...Good questions, thanks for letting me sound off!

[Tom Henderson]

Greetings all:

I was blessed with the gift of being clean and sober after my second attempt at AA. I was set free on June 17, 1977. Only once and that was in my first year of sobriety did I have the desire not just for a drink but to get drunk. And God saved me from myself on that occurence.

I accepted the Jesus as my Lord and Savior on June 3, 1978 3 days after my 29th Birthday and 2 weeks before my 1 year AA Birthday.

In February of 1979 I asked God to remove the desire for cigaretts and all forms of Tobacco. I workerd the fisrt three steps and have never had the desire to smoke again.

I have been struggling with Compulsive Overeating all of my life.

I have been in and out of OA since 1976.

I believe it is a matter of how much we are willing to surrender everything to God. To really trust Him and clean house.

The longer I want to maintain control of any thing the longer it will take for complete Victory and Recovery.

In 1983 or 1984 I had the pleasure of praying for a brother in Christ for his alcoholism with a prayer team. God instantly delivered him from alcoholism that night. He never went to any meetings.

Accoding to Hebrews 13:8 "Jesus Christ is the same Yesterday, Today and Forever."

God is available to deliver any of of instantly if we are wiiling to receive that from Him.

Keep Smilin & Keep Prayin!!

BigTom

[Nina Kay]

Leiana,
When you are saved by the grace of God through Jesus Christ, you are given the gift of The Holy Spirit; The Comforter & The guarantee of eternal life. We are saved because of Jesus's perfection (not ours) & because He died for our sins in our place. The Holy Spirit is our Seal Of Approval.
That does not mean that God turns us straight into His puppets. He gave, each of us freedom of choice, which is what makes us higher than the animals. He is plenty powerful & loving enough to take away our troubles & addictions, but then we would be like puppets & He wants us to be free. His enemy, Satan, challenged Him with the idea that we would want to do worldly things more than we would want God & righteous, so he set out to prove himself to be more powerful than God, using people as pawns. God loves us enough & gives us the dignity of letting us make our own choices, He trusts us with those choices & this is our proving ground, while his enemy is busy trying to get us to do what he wants with lies & temptations. God will help us to overcome His & our enemy, if we ask Him to, sincerely & truthfully, & He knows our hearts & minds even better than we do. He always gives us a way out of the temptation, & we will see it, if we truly want to, & then lean on His power & strength, because He is the only one that is more powerful than the enemy, but we have the power of our freedom of choice, & then the safety net of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ & His shed blood for our sins (forgiveness), if we fail while we are truly trying. AA & NA works because is teaches you to accept your own powerlessness over the enemy & his deception, (by your own choice) & turn to The Almighty God because He is all powerful & will work all things together for your good, as soon as you admit that & do turn it over to Him !!!

[steve4432]

Leiana I excepted Jesus as my savior When I was 13 and still had a 27 year drinking and drug career and that is because God gives us free will. wether we want to believe it or not every time we use it is a consious choice to do so. Our minds first believe satans lies that to have fun to fill the emtiness to rid our fears to rid our social phobea's we need to drink or drug and after the addiction takes over the battle in the mind begins your brain becomes hard wired differently. In your mind there is a default mode to make it simple and that default mode is survival and when you become chemically dependent the same survival mechanism kicks in the exact portion of the brain that says I am starving I need food.Or I am getting hurt I need to get away or I am tired I need rest all the survival systems now say I need drugs. That is why the word tells us to" renew our minds" and to meditate on the word day and night and to write it on our door posts. Yes God can and does deliver people in an instant he did me after 9 treatment centers and working a treatment plan formed by professionals and getting on antidepressants I have no compulsion to drink or drug at all. And others have an experience like the appostle Paul.
I think more than not some people have the desire to let go and let God more than others they are open to the power of God where others fight to hold on to there comforts no matter how sick those comforts are. Nothing can fill the void that our father gave us that was ment for him if you want to here more about what to do about that void you can pm me anytime .
I do love you and God loves you................I hope to hear from you
(((((((((((((((((((((((((((hugs))))))))))))))))))) ))))))
Steve

[BLJ]

Great post---I needed to read this today. I have 8 1/2 years sober and I am really struggling with this---and my sponsor is really not helping me-----I totally believe Iam a christian and she does not think that I have accepted Christ as my savior. And This is really bothering me a lot...it's messing with my head a great deal....I don't want to drink...but I sure am in some pain and felt I needed to share it-----The church thing is a problem also in my life...I believe if I keep doing the "do"--meetings, prayer and steps etc. on a daily basis, all this will clear up...but I am sharing it is really difficult right now and I understand how people get confused and feel like a "have not" instead of a "have".

God bless you all on your journey!

[leanna]

steve
yes i agree with everyhting youve said there...what if i wanted to give up my free will??would god allow that?

BLG
hey have u thought of changing sponsors??i mean...i thought i had the coolest sponsor when i was going to meetings, and then i found she was helping me at all.

[BLJ]

I did change sponsors!!

What you need to do is confess your sins to Him or another person of Him. Think about the religon you were born into, go back there, that is where you will find your peace.

I haven't found my peace yet, but it is coming soon.

Peace and love, Nike

[leanna]

i dont belive in religion...i think its a seperatist belief.i dont feel it brings unity....and i think god would want unity above all things.

[MENDER1]

Well salvation comes in John 3:16 being a addict church never could keep me clean.
Christians believe that when you are save you are healed a person with cancer is not healed a person with diabetes is not healed.
I also have a terminal illness addiction and like the others who take medication for thier illness I must also in the form of fellowship and meetings.

[steve4432]

In fact leiana Jesus was a seperatist, He came to devide households as far as beliefs go and he was not into religions doctrines or philosephies.He said "I am the way the truth and the light no man cometh unto the father but by me". And as far as unity yes that is important too that we are sanctified through grace and not by works however we must grow in the Lord and to do so comes through community and accountability with christian brothers and sisters and we find these people in churches and normally there is a denomination so we must be prudent to find a church that is fundamentally sound and if the doctrine can not be tested by the inspired word of God (bible) it is not sound and then false as there will be many false doctrines.
I hope and pray that you will be led by the holy spirit to research a place of worship and that you find the peace that only the spirit of God can bring us through his son Jesus the Christ.
I love ya Lieana.....................Steve

[EAGLEWOMAN]

WOW, LEIANA, THERE IS SOME POWERFUL STUFF HERE......I AM NOT AT ALL SURE THAT I COULD ADD ANYTHING DIFFERENT OR MORE APPLICABLE. I ESPECIALLY AGREE THAT BEING SAVED AND HAVING THE HOLY SPIRIT DOES NOT "CURE" YOU FROM ANYTHING. THE ONLY THING THAT RELEIVED YOU FROM ALCOHOLISM IS ABSOLUTE ABSTENENCE. THE BIG BOOK TELLS US THAT AND I HAVE SEEN SOME PEOPLE WHO SAID THAT GOD HAD CURED THEM AND THEY ARE BACK OUT AND DRUNK. GOD KNOWS YOUR HEART AND YES HE KNOWS IT BETTER THAN YOU DO AND THE HOLY SPIRIT WILL GIVE YOU THE ANSWER BUT WILL YOU LISTEN. GOD SPEAKS TO ALL OF HIS CHILDREN AT ONCE; SOME OF THEM ARE NOT LISTENING! GOD DID, IN FACT, GIVE YOU FREE WILL AND HE WILL NEVER OVERRIDE YOUR FREE WILL; IF HE WERE TO DO THAT HE WOULD NOT BE GOD, NOW WOULD HE???? HE WOULD BE A DICTATOR; NOT A KIND AND LOVING GOD. SO, IF ONE IS LOOKING FOR AN EASY WAY OUT: GOD TO "CURE" THEM; IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN........GOD EXPECTS THAT YOU DO THE FOOTWORK AS WELL. HOPES THIS HELPS. KEEP COMING BACK; MORE WILL BE REVEALED.
EW

[AvieG]

I would not class myself as a Christian, but I do know many sober members of AA who are priests, clergymen, and nuns, who still regularly attend meetings, so I would say NO - Christianity does NOT remove the addiction??

One little thing I hear often in AA is 'Christianity is for people who are afraid of going to hell - Spirituality is for those of us who have already BEEN there'

[leanna]

STEVE
i agree and i found your info real useful.i didnt know he was seperatist....i love that ...makes me feel closer to him. (iloveu2 bro)

[leanna]

One little thing I hear often in AA is 'Christianity is for people who are afraid of going to hell - Spirituality is for those of us who have already BEEN there'
AVIE G....thats real cool ..i like that,though im not so sure all christians are afraid of hell.ive met some (like my friend robert)whom arent afraid at all because theyre faith in god is so powerful.they have a belief that theyre shielded...i had that belief once too. i think one is shielded when tehy walk with god.

[angelwings]

after reading all these letters what i say might not be that lightbulb - the reason why we all found this website, and ultimately found each other is because god led us. he led us to show each other that we are not alone, not even close. for all the nights i layed awake and begged god to show me where he was, blaming him for what i had done to my life, for all the choices he had let me make (silly isnt it?), screaming just show your face! the fact is he did show his face, he has let me live through this addiction and face all these challenges, and make all these choices, and been there the whole time - in my heart - he is your conciscience - the voice that asks you why are you turning away? you know that i am here - its the voice that i ignored for along time, and its taken the last two nights to really see - again - that he is right here, he's in each and every one of you and has led me to you, to show me that i am not alone. it was by chance that i found this website, by chance that i am actually using the computer=), but not chance that i now realize that he was there all along. we are the friends that will join him in heaven. i love that
angel

[best]

Originally Posted by leanna

That confuses me....
If god is ever powerful and loving...i would assume that by seeking and finding him ....one no longer should have to battle with the dizease of addiction.

What is the thruthe here?

is it that friend number 2 just doesnt have enough faith in god and jesus to belivee that god has cured him??

What I have found in my own life... When "I" give up and ask for God's help in my fight to overcome. That is when God helps me. God won't push himself on me. He waits for me to ask of Him and then gives me the strength as I need it.
By seeking and finding Him, my sinful ways or addictive behaviors decreased. A renewed desire for needed change. The closer I get to Him...I more I want to change.
God gives the increase. His love and grace fill my life and because of His love, my desire to please Him increases.
That desire that He puts in me has me want to come and ask for His help.
That desire is when I ask for His help is where He will put the increase that gives me strength.
Today I say Yes Lord... it may be 1 day, 1 week, 1 year, or 1 lifetime before my addictions and sins all leave from within me.
As we grow and ask, he gives us the strength.
He will always do His part... we must also follow through and do our part as well.
Two times, two different issues and as I sat on the edge of my bed and cried out from my heart... Lord, I can't change this...I need Your help because I don't have the strength within me to change what needs be changed and we both know things need change.
I am still in awe to this day of the changes He has brought in my life. Changes that came almost instantly. A change that I felt at the moment and another time a change that after a few days I knew He had fully made in me.
God will do His part, we need do our part.

[splendra]

I believe it was Gods power that got me clean. My soberiety is the biggest miracle of my life. I believe God helped me to find the 12 steps and it is His will that I work them.