UncleMeat69

Bill Wilson's words on his book 12 Steps and 12 Traditions
in a letter of October 5, 1953:

"At first I was dubious whether anyone would care for it, save
old timers who had begun to run into life's lumps in other areas
than alcohol."
(Pass It On - Page 356)


I have observed a number of sponsors take newcomers
through the steps, for the first time, using the 12X12. It seems
to create a lot of confusion. Based on Bill W's words stated above,
it appears he intended the 12X12 to be used later, for living problems.

What do you think ?

Tommyh

I agree
I never would use the 12x12 on the steps first time thru for someone.I like the simple directions in the big book

UncleMeat69

I think it would be like skipping High School
and going straight to College. Most would be
lost because they wouldn't know the basics.

Tommyh

yep

PaperDolls

I worked the steps with my sponsor using the Big Book and the 12x12. I think the 12x12 was a huge benefit. It was easier to understand for me.

I worked the steps out of the BB but the 12x12 gave me a more info on each step. Helped me understand them better.

UncleMeat69

That's why my sponsor called the 12X12 Grad School
for BB Alums.

Gottalife

I believe the introduction to the 12&12 states that the Big Book remains the basic text, which would seem to indicate that is where we should start.

The 12&12 is essentially one man's take on the steps. It puts different points of view about the steps, goes into great depth about the reasons behind the steps, why we need to take them, and what the result might be, but it does not explain how to take them. Those directions are found only in the Big Book.

I feel it is a very useful publication for developing and deepening our understanding of the program, having taken the steps, particularly in respect of helping the newcomer.

This is where a subtle change seems to have taken place with me. My personal experience, let's say with step two, and my sponsor's experience is not the only experience. The person I am sponsoring can be coming from a completely different place. As a sponsor, I need to understand that and the 12&12 helps enormously in that respect. It give a variety of points of view, about a quarter of which apply directly to me, but the other angles help me understand other ways this step might look to the newcomer.

As a newcomer, it was very little use to me as it talks about many things with which I had no experience. Just like the High School/College Analogy above.

tomsteve

when I got sober I kept it simple and used the BB. I did have the 12&12 and would read it, but I couldn't understand it.
9 years later I have a better understanding of the 12&12, but still don't completely understand it.
that's as for the steps.
but I find it pretty good on the traditions.

MIRecovery

I used both. In fact the 12 and 12 4th step made more sense to me than the BB. In general I think the BB should be first

UncleMeat69

I believe the BB paradigm to be the best for those in early recovery
because it overrides the guilt and shame mechanics of the newcomer.

CousinA

I agree BB is the way to go, at least the first time around. My first sponsor had me read both and we did the steps out of the BB. It wasn't until I was around four years sober when my then sponsor and a friend of his took me through the book and I began to really understand the steps.

I bring my guys through the BB. I tell them to also make at least one step meeting a week and around here that means reading from the 12 x 12 so they get the best of both worlds - that is if they actually listen to me When we've finished the steps I bring them through the traditions in the 12 x 12.

-allan

markz

Yes, no one can work the steps from the 12x12. Just a bunch of Essays. Just a bunch of stories. I know people that say, dont ever read the 12x12 until you have atleast 10 years in of continuous sobriety. When I was going to 12x12 meetings I never got much out of it. Looking back on it now, seemed like a waste of my time. However it got me to where I am today. Recovered. Have been for many a years. I havent cracked open that book in 15 years. I do not get much out of it. Much rather listen to Joe and Charlie tapes, or read the Big Book.

It explains much about my problem. And how to over come it.

Never understood the statement
"Can work any step that begins with One when you come through that door"
I find that statement false. When anyone comes through that door, they dont know about disease concept as stated in the BB, so how can they work step 12. Sure they can admit when they are wrong prompty, and maybe do some prayer and meditation, but step 12. Its a false statement.

Step 12 is the foundation of our program. Helping other alcoholics.
For awhile I thought it was Steps 1,2 and 3.

I have heard other statements in the rooms of AA about the "Foundation of Recovery" but to me thats the same as "Foundation of the Steps". Minor nuances I guess, cant complicate it.