Mo S

It never ceases to amaze me how insensitive people in AA are about mental health issues. One guy says if you work all the steps "you will cured". Another really old timer guy once told me (I was 21 years sober) : if i worked all the steps I wouldn't be depressed anymore.

I've been under the care of a pyschiatrist and recieving the appropriate medication for 21 years. It ticks me off you mention the word anxiety or depression and some people spout off that steps are the cure all when people don't know your personal situation. My big mistake is sometimes sharing my own experience - even when its relevant.

That's invalidating and it sucks.

johnny2times

I know what your saying Mo, but on the other hand i know what their getting at, i believe it does work for some conditions, but not for all, I'm an alcoholic and a former soldier , been on medication for ptsd/anxiety/depression in my past, id think to myself, 'if you lot would have been through what i have you would be either dead/in prison/gone nuts or still drunk!' and they'd all sit there moaning and whining about how next doors cat shat on their lawn or whatever...which would really wind me up!

this was my experience of that sorta thing, the steps tools (especially a prayer life) really helped me to snap out of the depression side of things (self pitty) and id turned my thoughts to other people i care about whenever i felt i was dropping again, it really worked for me, i call it 'getting out of self' ...now this was all good, but with reference to ptsd/anxiety ...nope, that was very much still there, nothing stops that, apart from coping mechanisms i learned in counselling sessions....which in time have massively reduced that stuff , TIME is the greatest healer in my book! anyway so to sum it up...yeah they have a point...but it doesnt work for everything...everyones different...horses for courses and all that!
dont let their self righteous thinking bother you or keep you out of the meetings, they're selfish addicts/alcoholics ...just like the rest of us at the end of the day!
hope i helped
johnny

Threshold

Mo, that is really hard to hear, over and over and over and over. Not only in the program, but from well meaning people all over.

There are forms of depression that seem to truly be addressed and dissapated by living the 12 steps and I am happy for those people. I believe they once felt horribly depressed and no longer do, and that they are trying to share their E,S and H. But...aaarrrrgggghhhhh

It's not a cure all. Living the steps can help us meet the challenges life throws at us, but it doesn't MAKE THEM ALL GO AWAY! oh, wait, I hear that in a 12 step meeting...but I still hear people in the program, newbies on their pink cloud and old timers tell me that if I would just pray better, harder, to THEIR HP, more often, with less self satisfaction....

I can shrug it off sometimes, but when my depression is to the point where dragging myself to a meeting is about all I can manage, and someone comes up afterwards and tells me I "look down" and starts with the "if you'd do the steps, no I mean REALLY do them...well, suffering is optional..." it makes it way harder to pull my butt to the next meeting.

Then I remember that I've heard them tell people that about their marriages, hospital bills, parking places "If you'd just work the steps and pray harder, your wife will come back, the hospital will forgive your bill and you'll get the best parking place in the lot! that's what my HP does for me"

I believe it has been their experience. But it has not been mine. I breathe, breathe, and remind myself that recovery is not a competition. My experience is as valid to me as theirs is to them.

There have been times when it has been counter productive for me to go to a meeting, when my mental state is such that I cannot appropriately filter out those things.

Of course I get accused of isolation, but I look at it this way, I am practicing self care. Just like others might be when they turn down an invitation to a bar. Are they "isolating" or are they protecting their sobriety? Honesty is the key.

Mo S

Thank you Threshold...I will isolate away from AA meetings too when I am having a really bad bout. I also have heard alot of "if you'd just get down on your knees and pray....."


I go to Dual Recovery Anonymous which helps alot: I can adress my alcoholism recovery as well as my mental health diagnosis.

Thanks for your input guys.

BlueMoon

I’ve been sober for 20 years.
I was diagnosed as Bi-Polar when I was 24yo – 30 years ago. Thru various clinic and doctor changes over the years, I’ve had at least 8 ‘new’ p-docs re-evaluate and confirm the BP diagnosis. 10 years ago, I went thru the 2.5 year process of being put on permanent, total disability due to BP.

Hmmm – I think I just MIGHT be Bi-Polar!

I have had the misfortune of having people tell me all the things mentioned – and more - I’ve been told that I am NOT REALLY BP – I just need to work my program - etc. etc. The first couple of times totally cut me to my core – I was hurt and angry beyond words.

Now, when supposedly well-meaning AA’s try to shove THEIR beliefs down MY throat, I take a deep breath, I smile, I thank them and tell them I’ll be sure to let my doctor know of their diagnosis – and I turn and walk away.
Let them talk about how rude I am – I seriously don’t care any more.

As for people telling me to “get on my knees” – how presumptuous is that? Not everyone prays or prays/talks to their HP in the same way. Statements like that are SO not in keeping with the principles of AA. I ignore them.

Threshold – thank you for your comments about isolating! Sometimes I have to do that too.

AD33

Great thread, thanks. So hopeful to this newcomer to know there are others in the rooms who have mental illnesses in addition to alcoholism, and who are sober.

I was at a meeting today and the chair shared about having clinical depression. Quite a few people shared back that their depression lifted when they worked the steps, got involved in the programme etc. Someone else said they didn't use any medication for their depression, just worked the programme. That's true for them, so fine, all I know is, in the past, I would have assumed I was working the particular programme I was working incorrectly.

Several years ago I abruptly came off medication after reading out a Step 5, having experienced hallucinations while writing a Step 4, and it wasn't a good thing.

I'm still pretty defensive about sharing that I have borderline personality disorder in meetings, when I do I get shame kickbacks. Sometimes people have identified and it helps. Other times, I feel judged.

I totally hear needing to stay away from a meeting sometimes to protect my sobriety - that is sound advice.

NYCDoglvr

It irritates me when people offer unsolicited advice too. And, I don't know why recovering alcoholics are so quick to do it. I've been treated for depression for decades and I don't discuss it in meetings because it's no one's business. I go to a shrink for that.

fragileflower

Thanks so much for this thread....I can relate SO MUCH. I've suffered from depression/anxiety/OCD since I was a teenager, long before I began to drink. I have periods of remission in my mental illnesses, but sometimes the culmulative effects of stress in life triggers them back and WHAM, I'm mentally very sick again, even though I'm in AA and taking my meds. Then I get so frustrated I self medicate and end up having a relapse into drinking.

Then I go back to AA and all I hear is "Oh no wonder your depressed/anxious/panicky" that's what alcohol does. Yes, it does make it worse. But in my case (and in others like previous posters) the mental illness came first.

Sometimes, I just so aggravated hearing the same stuff over and over. "Just don't drink and to to meetings and work the steps and it will be alll fine. I get told I'm not trying hard enough.

And I can totally relate to how meetings can sometimes make it worse, by the things people say.

I wish they had a dual diagnosis group in my area....I live in a semi-rural area and it's just AA.

The mental health care is pretty scarce too, especially being uninsured.

So, today I do not drink because if I know it will make my mental illness worse. Period. Because to be perfectly honest, my worst drunk was not nearly as bad as a day I was totally sober and whacked out of my mind with panic and depression.

Thanks for letting me vent!

Mo S

Thank you all and to fragileflower. I agree; my wost drunk was not as bad as the diagnosis and coping/recovering from bipolar/anxiety disorder and PTSD. I tried going off my meds once because i was so young i thought maybe "they" were right. Well, I ended up in R Wing. Hats off to anyone who can heal/cope with mental illness by just using the AA program and AA meetings.
Thanks again for your feedback- very helpful.

NYCDoglvr

When my shrink suggested meds in early sobriety, someone with a great deal of time told me she ended up in a locked ward because she thought she could function without medication. I've learned to keep depression in therapy and alcoholism in AA. According to research I've read it's more common than not for people to suffer from alcoholism and another mental illness.

AlwaysGrowing

I think often people say just get sober and all will be OK is because the feel for you and want the best of life for everyone. Often we just don't know the right words, right timing or know what the other is going thru.
I personally believe life will be better for people who not only get sober but work a program and find God. No where that I remember is says Cured. I come and believe a better way of life. A peaceful ease that is stronger than before. Cloud 9... Oh.. No.. But life on lives terms.
Mental issues aren't removed by the bottle, just not masked anymore if you ask me.
We are a work in progress till we die. There are other parts of recovery that aren't just about us.. Working with others... You know.. get out of self and the pity pot. So we aim to balance everything and EXPECT that cloud 9. Just not promised by anyone in AA lit or even in the bible..

AG