Cocteau

Hi,

I've read the Rational Recovery books (Rational Recovery: The New Cure for Addiction, The Art of AVRT, and the Small Book) and also have watched the AVRT Live videos. I entirely agree with his ideas and methods, but whenever I make a Big Plan, I end up breaking it. The longest I've lasted has been 3-4 months.

I'm considering attending the live class to see if it would help, though it would be a financial burden with the cost of the class, flying in from across the country, the hotel room, and time off work. And he also requests that the entire family attend but that's not really practical for my wife and young daughter.

Has anyone else attended the live class? What was your experience like? Do you think it added anything beyond the books and videos?

My one fear is Jack's recent rants on politics and other unrelated topics; though I have a lot of respect for his work, he seems to have gone a little crazy lately. If you've read The Art of AVRT, you probably know what I mean. I don't know if his new attitudes will hurt the class. In his older books and videos, he seemed like a nice and compassionate guy, but lately he seems to be angry, grumpy, and intolerant.

Thanks,

Mark

P.S. I've looked into AA, but I really don't think it would work for me, especially after being exposed to Rational Recovery. If you have any other methods of recovery you would suggest, please let me know

Terminally Unique

I haven't attended the AVRT course, but I have read an article on it by someone who didn't "get it" from the books alone. I could probably figure out how a way to forward it to you. I have read "The Art of AVRT," and I do know what you mean about the political stuff, but I don't think he would go into that during the course. I am curious as to your take on the "AVRT: Live" DVD set, however, as I have not watched it myself.

Cocteau

I've watched the AVRT: Live videos a couple times and have listened to them in my car many times (I ripped the DVDs to my iPod). I've also done the same with Smokey the Beast is a Wimp when I was quitting smoking (BTW, I found Allen Carr's method more effective for quitting smoking, but not for quitting drinking).

I think both videos are good and do serve as a good supplement to the books. In both videos, Jack sits with a person one-on-one and teaches them AVRT, helps them to make a Big Plan, etc. One thing that nagged me a little in both videos was the persons going through the sessions with Jack returned a few months later and both relapsed and were drinking or smoking again. Though I give him kudos for his honesty in sharing it in the videos, it kinda deflated my confidence.

I'd appreciate if you were able to forward me the article you mentioned. If it would make it easier, I could PM you my email address.

Thanks,

Mark

langkah

The cost of doing it right and as he suggests is low compared to the value of removing the drink problem for the rest of your lifetime.

Making the full commitment Jack wants you to make to your new life may make the difference between success and failure. Always best to go first class on important matters.

Plus for a little family fun in addition to getting filled up with Jack you'll find Yosemite, Tahoe, the Redwoods, the Gold Country, and the Bay area aren't too far away.

Cocteau

I agree with your points. Have you attended the class?

Terminally Unique

Check your private messages.

kanamit

That does seem like a shame. But do the returning individuals get helped to redo thei Big Plan and move on? If so, I can see why they might be included. I think he (Jack) must have agonised over whether to include the relapse prevention sheet in his book and perhaps did the same for the DVDs.

For my own edification I plan on getting one of the DVDs (the Live or Tune Up one) at some point but it's not urgent since the book and these threads were so useful to me.

langkah

'I agree with your points. Have you attended the class?'

No, I posted that because I believe if something is critically important then it's worth doing completely in order to get the best possible results. If I'd not stopped before Jack did I'd have probably tried out his ideas at some point, knowing me. The guys I learned from and hang with still are the 40-50s years sober crowd. Different deal entirely.

The learning experience of paying serious money to get the secret directly from Jack is worth a lot. This way you'll know you absolutely gave this your very best shot. It eliminates any possible future doubts that might otherwise crop up.

Terminally Unique

I know that the man in the "AVRT: Live!" documentary goes out to test the waters after the initial sessions, and that the set includes a follow-up session to tighten up the screws. I don't see this as a bad thing myself, since it makes the documentary more comprehensive. It does make me wonder just how much newer material is in the "AVRTuneup" set, though, which is half as long as "AVRT: Live" and half the price.

oak

Cocteau,
Since you also asked about other recovery methods, do you have SMART meetings near you? I don't know how similar SMART is to RR currently; I know they have been separate for a while. But, if SMART resonates with you, it would be a free way to gain more tools.

I'm curious about the RR class too. I don't know anyone who has taken it.

I assume you could call and talk to someone at RR to get more info.

Cocteau

No, though I live in the suburbs of the fifth largest city in the nation, all the nearby SMART meetings are at prisons. I'd have to drive a few hours to any open meetings.

I'm sticking with AVRT.

Thanks for the advice though.

mattparadise

I'm curious about AVRT.

Cocteau

If you're interested, go to the Rational Recovery website and click on the link for a "Crash Cours on AVRT". It'd probably take you a 1/2 hour or so to get through and will give you a good idea what AVRT is like. If it clicks with you, buy the book "Rational Recovery: The New Cure for Substance Addiction".

The one thing I'll say about the book though is that Jack added something to AVRT since it was written which makes it even more effective: questioning the morality of drinking in terms of how it affects you, your family and friends, and other people around you. I believe the crash course touches upon the topic though.

Morning Glory

Please remember that we are a peer support forum where we help each other here.

When we start talking about outside resources that cost money it borderlines on advertising.

Terminally Unique

Sorry. Not having gone through it myself, mostly I am simply curious, but I do believe that the requisite information is contained in the RR book. It costs less than $12 on Amazon new, and I do encourage people to buy it used for half that. If people are willing to put some time and effort in, there is no doubt in my mind that they can learn AVRT for about the cost of a six pack of beer.

Cocteau

Sorry, I didn't realize recommending a book broke the forum rules. And I wasn't advertising the class, but rather looking for any information from anyone who might attended.

I'll have to brush up on the forums rules so I remain a good citizen.

Morning Glory

Not a problem Cocteau,


Feel free to discuss the DVDs and phone sessions through private messages.

langkah

'though I live in the suburbs of the fifth largest city in the nation, all the nearby SMART meetings are at prisons. I'd have to drive a few hours to any open meetings.'

Would the officials allow you inside so you could learn from the SMART prisoners there how it is they are able to avoid drinking?

Cocteau

Go hang out in a prison? No thanks.

PJ30

I'm new here. I'm glad to know that SMART is available to those who are incarcerated. I was not aware that SMART had been incorporated into programs at detention facilitites. Finally there's an effective resource for inmates who want to engage and define a path to healthy change. It's very easy to participate in SMART. They have online meetings, very easily accessed using search engine to find and navigate to...as well as some groups that physically meet...and I'm not meaning meet at detention facilitites ;0). SMART 'in person' meetings are growing in number, thankfully. Either way, whether attending in person or via online meeting; I highly recommend self managment and recovery training. It's based on Motivational Interviewing...which works well for very, very many.