Emergent awareness/recovery stage
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 28
Emergent awareness/recovery stage
Hello all,
I am new to these boards. I just wanted to find a place where I can openly share my new findings about being an adult child of an alcoholic.
Would this be the right place?
I didn't have a typical alcoholic childhood, the one the Woititz describes in her books. My father didn't drink at home. He would leave for days on end to binge. Every weekend I thought this was the weekend he would die for sure. I thought since we (my sisters and I) didn't see the drinking, we didn't have any effects. I thought this for nearly 28 years. Oh how was I wrong. My dad was also very loving an supportive to me and still is ... when he was around. It's just that he was unavailable most of the time.
So when I read books from Janet Woititz I don't exactly click with what she says regarding the kids being blamed for the drinking, but nevertheless, I still have quite a few of the ACOA traits.
So after leaving a very unhealthy marriage (neither of us had alcohol issues amazingly), I feel like the lights are on for me, things make sense and I'm so much happier for being able to work on things in a positive way. I continue to read books and just want some people to bounce ideas off of when I get stuck.
~Sienna
I am new to these boards. I just wanted to find a place where I can openly share my new findings about being an adult child of an alcoholic.
Would this be the right place?
I didn't have a typical alcoholic childhood, the one the Woititz describes in her books. My father didn't drink at home. He would leave for days on end to binge. Every weekend I thought this was the weekend he would die for sure. I thought since we (my sisters and I) didn't see the drinking, we didn't have any effects. I thought this for nearly 28 years. Oh how was I wrong. My dad was also very loving an supportive to me and still is ... when he was around. It's just that he was unavailable most of the time.
So when I read books from Janet Woititz I don't exactly click with what she says regarding the kids being blamed for the drinking, but nevertheless, I still have quite a few of the ACOA traits.
So after leaving a very unhealthy marriage (neither of us had alcohol issues amazingly), I feel like the lights are on for me, things make sense and I'm so much happier for being able to work on things in a positive way. I continue to read books and just want some people to bounce ideas off of when I get stuck.
~Sienna
Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Stumbling toward happiness
Posts: 4,706
Hi Sienna,
Welcome to the group. This is indeed a great place to bounce ideas around. There's a wide variety of experiences here, from terrible abuse to the kind of neglect you write of. I think you may find it helpful, and I know we could learn from you as well.
Just out of curiosity: you don't mention your mother in all of this. What was HER reaction to your dad disappearing? How did she feel about it, and how did she explain to you two what was happening?
Glad you found us!
Welcome to the group. This is indeed a great place to bounce ideas around. There's a wide variety of experiences here, from terrible abuse to the kind of neglect you write of. I think you may find it helpful, and I know we could learn from you as well.
Just out of curiosity: you don't mention your mother in all of this. What was HER reaction to your dad disappearing? How did she feel about it, and how did she explain to you two what was happening?
Glad you found us!
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 28
My poor mom... she is a big co-dependent and a ACOA herself. Grandpa was horrible. She did the best she could but you can't make a normal childhood from that. She is not aware of all these things that I know about her and ACOA. I would love to give her a book to read, but they advise against healing others before yourself, so I just have to sit back for now. If I mention any of this stuff, she'll start defending herself "What, was I supposed to leave with 3 young children and no job? You guys had a good childhood anyway."
When dad would disappear, the household was very tense. My sisters and I did not want to upset her in any way. When dad did return home, my parents would most likely yell and scream and throw things. She did kick him out when I was in 2nd grade. I remember crying with my dad in the living room because we weren't sure when we were going to see him again. He did attend AA when I was in high school, but then quit because he didn't think he was like the others.
I recall us being toted around in our footie pajamas (we waited in the truck) tavern to tavern on Christmas Eve "looking for dad." Holidays were never fun because he always went out on Christmas Eve. She explained it as "dad has a problem, he drinks, do you know what a tavern is?" That's about all I recall talking about it.
He left her for a 3 day binge when I was 4 months old. She confided to me that she probably should have left him then.
So I guess she's done a mixture of fighting him, ignoring him and trying to set boundaries - none of which work.
Luckily, none of my sisters or me have any alcohol or drug issues, but we all are codependent to some level and have picked crappy men as love partners. My middle sister can't see this yet.
When dad would disappear, the household was very tense. My sisters and I did not want to upset her in any way. When dad did return home, my parents would most likely yell and scream and throw things. She did kick him out when I was in 2nd grade. I remember crying with my dad in the living room because we weren't sure when we were going to see him again. He did attend AA when I was in high school, but then quit because he didn't think he was like the others.
I recall us being toted around in our footie pajamas (we waited in the truck) tavern to tavern on Christmas Eve "looking for dad." Holidays were never fun because he always went out on Christmas Eve. She explained it as "dad has a problem, he drinks, do you know what a tavern is?" That's about all I recall talking about it.
He left her for a 3 day binge when I was 4 months old. She confided to me that she probably should have left him then.
So I guess she's done a mixture of fighting him, ignoring him and trying to set boundaries - none of which work.
Luckily, none of my sisters or me have any alcohol or drug issues, but we all are codependent to some level and have picked crappy men as love partners. My middle sister can't see this yet.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Stumbling toward happiness
Posts: 4,706
I walked on a lot of eggshells when I was young too. When it was peaceful - for brief stretches - you sure didn't want to upset anything, and it sure was easy to acquire a lot of guilt & shame just by doing the things that kids do (make noise, make mistakes, etc.)
I'm sure it was much harder to leave in the generations before ours. Even in my mom's generation, the prospect of leaving with five kids and somehow making it on a secretary's salary was just too daunting. She stuck it out too (of course she was alcoholic as well).
I consider myself very fortunate to live in a time & place when I can go to school for anything I wish, get any kind of job I wish, and make as much money as I put my mind to. It gives me so many more choices. Gotta go write that in my Gratitude Journal.....
Welcome again, sienna. Thanks for sharing that.
I'm sure it was much harder to leave in the generations before ours. Even in my mom's generation, the prospect of leaving with five kids and somehow making it on a secretary's salary was just too daunting. She stuck it out too (of course she was alcoholic as well).
I consider myself very fortunate to live in a time & place when I can go to school for anything I wish, get any kind of job I wish, and make as much money as I put my mind to. It gives me so many more choices. Gotta go write that in my Gratitude Journal.....
Welcome again, sienna. Thanks for sharing that.
AKA 'grewupinabarn'
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 471
Welcome to SR!
Although your dad did not drink at home, it really sounds like you got the essentials of an alcoholic home:
Shame
Parents' moods were unpredictable
Dad's presence was unpredictable
Repressed anger
Denial that there is a problem ('at least he doesn't drink at home'), which leads to shame and guilt (because there isn't a problem, although all evidence indicates otherwise).
Fear and uncertainty
At least a bit of manipulation (You didn't actually see any drinking so you have no right to claim or believe it affected your childhood, or your life right now).
Just my duo cents. Keep sharing.
Although your dad did not drink at home, it really sounds like you got the essentials of an alcoholic home:
Shame
Parents' moods were unpredictable
Dad's presence was unpredictable
Repressed anger
Denial that there is a problem ('at least he doesn't drink at home'), which leads to shame and guilt (because there isn't a problem, although all evidence indicates otherwise).
Fear and uncertainty
At least a bit of manipulation (You didn't actually see any drinking so you have no right to claim or believe it affected your childhood, or your life right now).
Just my duo cents. Keep sharing.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 28
Yes, I agree, we really got the essentials of an alcoholic home. I know there are alot worse out there too, but it doesn't make my situation any less affecting. When I was younger I didn't think we were affected that much, but I was wrong and I see that now.
I didn't really get the co-dependency thing until I was well into the journey of leaving my ex. Lots of times when we make positive changes inside an unhealthy relationship, there is retaliation and anger, and the unhealthy relationship is no longer able to survive on the co-dependent traits. I realized I picked an irresponsible person too, and made him even more irresponsible by doing so much for him.
While there were issues early on and red flags I ignored them when dating my ex (adult children taught to deny their perceptions), I thought I was lucky because it was SOOOO much better than my parents. What a low standard I had! (adult children question what normal is). It didn't help that he constantly told me I was being uptight and irrational (these were in reaction to even illegal things he did). And he did things that would probably send other people running (adult children don't know what to get angry at). At the time I thought it was my problem for not being cool or something. Wow, have I changed. I hope now that I understand how I ended up with him, I can repeating avoid that mistake.
I do have a wonderful boyfriend and we have such a healthy relationship, sometimes I find it hard to believe! So this it what is should be like!
So some of the things I am actively working on:
1) My all-or-none mentality. I forget there are in betweens, and luckily I have some good friends that point it out.
2) Taking on too much. It may sound like a good idea when I spew it out, or I hope by doing such and such I'll earn a lost friendship, but that is something I'm working on. I recognize it; I stop and think. I guess I got value out of giving so much.
3) Doing it all myself. I have a very proud self. Right now I have my own house (bought out the ex), am putting myself through school, and working 30 hours/week. I have a dog too (no kids). On top of that I volunteer for a non-profit (animals), have a whole list of hobbies - yet I really, really find it hard asking for help. I was carless for 8 months after the divorce and I only asked for rides about 5 times! Stubborn.
I want to be able to say "I did it all by myself." From what I've read, this is because we want to maintain a sense of control. Perhaps this is true, but I haven't quite put the label on it. I feel good when I do it myself. Like I'm tough or something. But why do I want this? Or I feel guilty for inconveniencing someone else who has to stop what they are doing or go out of their way to help me - this is even when they ask. Or I expect others to jump in and help without me asking, but I have to learn how to ask and be OK with it.
So yeah, that still needs some work. I feel so much better just knowing though.
I look forward to reading your posts and sharing experiences too.
I didn't really get the co-dependency thing until I was well into the journey of leaving my ex. Lots of times when we make positive changes inside an unhealthy relationship, there is retaliation and anger, and the unhealthy relationship is no longer able to survive on the co-dependent traits. I realized I picked an irresponsible person too, and made him even more irresponsible by doing so much for him.
While there were issues early on and red flags I ignored them when dating my ex (adult children taught to deny their perceptions), I thought I was lucky because it was SOOOO much better than my parents. What a low standard I had! (adult children question what normal is). It didn't help that he constantly told me I was being uptight and irrational (these were in reaction to even illegal things he did). And he did things that would probably send other people running (adult children don't know what to get angry at). At the time I thought it was my problem for not being cool or something. Wow, have I changed. I hope now that I understand how I ended up with him, I can repeating avoid that mistake.
I do have a wonderful boyfriend and we have such a healthy relationship, sometimes I find it hard to believe! So this it what is should be like!
So some of the things I am actively working on:
1) My all-or-none mentality. I forget there are in betweens, and luckily I have some good friends that point it out.
2) Taking on too much. It may sound like a good idea when I spew it out, or I hope by doing such and such I'll earn a lost friendship, but that is something I'm working on. I recognize it; I stop and think. I guess I got value out of giving so much.
3) Doing it all myself. I have a very proud self. Right now I have my own house (bought out the ex), am putting myself through school, and working 30 hours/week. I have a dog too (no kids). On top of that I volunteer for a non-profit (animals), have a whole list of hobbies - yet I really, really find it hard asking for help. I was carless for 8 months after the divorce and I only asked for rides about 5 times! Stubborn.
I want to be able to say "I did it all by myself." From what I've read, this is because we want to maintain a sense of control. Perhaps this is true, but I haven't quite put the label on it. I feel good when I do it myself. Like I'm tough or something. But why do I want this? Or I feel guilty for inconveniencing someone else who has to stop what they are doing or go out of their way to help me - this is even when they ask. Or I expect others to jump in and help without me asking, but I have to learn how to ask and be OK with it.
So yeah, that still needs some work. I feel so much better just knowing though.
I look forward to reading your posts and sharing experiences too.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Stumbling toward happiness
Posts: 4,706
I could've written your entire post, word for word, Sienna. (well, not so articulately, but the details are eerily similar) I think we might be twins separated at birth 
Brilliant self-examination - congratulations on making SO much progress in the service of your own joy & fulfillment.
Brilliant self-examination - congratulations on making SO much progress in the service of your own joy & fulfillment.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 25
Hi Sienna,
I am an ACoA, too. This place is AWESOME and you will find so much helpful information here. Definitely keep coming back.
I just read, "Struggle for Intimacy" by Janet Geringer Woititz, Ed.D. and I would highly recommend it. She has a whole series of books specifically geared toward ACoAs and this is one of the best in my opinion.
Every single thing you listed above that you are working on is in that book in one form or another. Those are classic examples of an ACoA. To put it in a nutshell, Woititz says this in her book... "To be intimate, to be close, to be vulnerable, contradicts all of the survival skills learned by ACoA when they were young." She gives good examples of how to change your behavior or training yourself to recognize these symptoms and correct them. She says it isn't easy, but it's possible.
Keep your head up and be proud of yourself!
I am an ACoA, too. This place is AWESOME and you will find so much helpful information here. Definitely keep coming back.
I just read, "Struggle for Intimacy" by Janet Geringer Woititz, Ed.D. and I would highly recommend it. She has a whole series of books specifically geared toward ACoAs and this is one of the best in my opinion.
Every single thing you listed above that you are working on is in that book in one form or another. Those are classic examples of an ACoA. To put it in a nutshell, Woititz says this in her book... "To be intimate, to be close, to be vulnerable, contradicts all of the survival skills learned by ACoA when they were young." She gives good examples of how to change your behavior or training yourself to recognize these symptoms and correct them. She says it isn't easy, but it's possible.
Keep your head up and be proud of yourself!
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 28
I have "Sruggle for Intimacy" the book at home, and another one of hers. I'd like to get "Marriage on the Rocks" for my mom as this is the only book I know of being married to an alcoholic (dad).
I felt Janet tells us what to feel, rather than what you might have felt like. I didn't like this style of writing personally. Although it did bring about several "aha!" moments for me, I didn't feel like it gave enough advice on getting out of the myths. Just "Here's the myth, and here's why it's not true."
For my own personal situation, I liked Recovery: A Guide for Adult Children of Alcoholics by Herbert L. Gravitz and Julie D. Bowden more for the recovery, transformation and integration stages. More detail and more steps to how to transform behaviors.
I'm waiting fot this book to come too: Too Nice for Your Own Good : How to Stop Making 9 Self-Sabotaging Mistakes by Duke Robinson. Not an ACOA book, but probably still useful for me. I love reading these books. I haven't done meetings or anything, mostly books and some counseling back when I was getting out of my marriage.
I find myself on alot of online forums though. Yes, you all are part of my collection now! One in particular deals with relationship problems, and I see so many people in bad situations not knowing how to get out or what to do. I try to share my experiences and new findings (after all it is solicited!), but I think I may be doing it too much. It distracts me at work alot. But it doesn't seem to cause work issues yet, as I'm always the star employee who seems to "juggle it all" - course work, multiple projects. I like my work alot, but maybe it's part of the "emergent awareness" stage where you want to share with everyone (I'm thinking along the lines of settling for crappy relationships part)?
In Gravitz's book he warns against trying to "help" your parent(s) discover their alcohlism. Focus on your own recovery, not theirs.
I can see the similarities in me trying to "help" these online strangers in their bad relationships on the relationship forums. He says it can hinder your own recovery if you focus on others too much.
I am doing this I wonder? I have a sister in a bad relationship, who also doesn't acknowledge the alcohlism gorwing up, maybe I'm compensating with strangers since I cannot reach her. Regardless, recently it's taking up alot of my work time.
I felt Janet tells us what to feel, rather than what you might have felt like. I didn't like this style of writing personally. Although it did bring about several "aha!" moments for me, I didn't feel like it gave enough advice on getting out of the myths. Just "Here's the myth, and here's why it's not true."
For my own personal situation, I liked Recovery: A Guide for Adult Children of Alcoholics by Herbert L. Gravitz and Julie D. Bowden more for the recovery, transformation and integration stages. More detail and more steps to how to transform behaviors.
I'm waiting fot this book to come too: Too Nice for Your Own Good : How to Stop Making 9 Self-Sabotaging Mistakes by Duke Robinson. Not an ACOA book, but probably still useful for me. I love reading these books. I haven't done meetings or anything, mostly books and some counseling back when I was getting out of my marriage.
I find myself on alot of online forums though. Yes, you all are part of my collection now! One in particular deals with relationship problems, and I see so many people in bad situations not knowing how to get out or what to do. I try to share my experiences and new findings (after all it is solicited!), but I think I may be doing it too much. It distracts me at work alot. But it doesn't seem to cause work issues yet, as I'm always the star employee who seems to "juggle it all" - course work, multiple projects. I like my work alot, but maybe it's part of the "emergent awareness" stage where you want to share with everyone (I'm thinking along the lines of settling for crappy relationships part)?
In Gravitz's book he warns against trying to "help" your parent(s) discover their alcohlism. Focus on your own recovery, not theirs.
I can see the similarities in me trying to "help" these online strangers in their bad relationships on the relationship forums. He says it can hinder your own recovery if you focus on others too much.
I am doing this I wonder? I have a sister in a bad relationship, who also doesn't acknowledge the alcohlism gorwing up, maybe I'm compensating with strangers since I cannot reach her. Regardless, recently it's taking up alot of my work time.
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
