jsprplc2006

I've been pondering this lately. Take a moment to consider smoking, and drinking. From what I perceive, and correct me if I'm wrong, most people who drink do not become addicted to alcohol, yet most people who smoke DO become addicted to tobacco.

Yet, when the time comes for the an addicted person to quit both, different people seem to have differing opinions on which was more difficult.

Thoughts?

PS - I should point out that I'm aware the likes of Allen Carr and Jason Vale assert that virtually everyone using alcohol is addicted to it, although I don't buy into that. Particularly since former me used to have no difficulty being completely sober for many weeks to write exams, etc.

jdooner

It sounds like you are struggling with your own acceptance.

Many people who smoke do not become addicted. There are millions that have a smoke with a drink at a bar and yet never buy a pack of cigarettes. To them this is like drinking in the morning. So I think the argument is flawed or based on wrong assumptions.

The same could be said about Heroin but then there is that damn Vietnam study, which proves not everyone that uses heroin becomes addicted.

The substance in my experience does not make the addict.

Soberwolf

Both will kill you

Makes a lot more addicts than you think i know that

IOAA2

Hi. For me with an addictive personality it’s really unimportant as both are killers.
Many people are light social drinkers which translates to drinking around a liter of vodka/whisky a year.
OMG that was a days feeling awful for me then not having another drink for a year!? My life would have been very unmanageable!

BE WELL

KateL

I was addicted to alcohol and cigarettes in equal measure. However, I have had to use many drugs over the years for my health but have never become addicted to them. If I feel ok pain wise, then I stop the pills for a few days and never have withdrawal or anything. I have never met an occasional smoker either. I think cigarettes are the hardest thing to give up, but I don't know enough about drug abuse to comment on that. x

Bailey3

I was a solid pack to pack and half smoker for over 20 years. Quit about 15 years ago. It was the hardest thing I ever did. There are still times when I have the urge to smoke but, except for a brief week long relapse about 14 years ago I've managed to abstain. I read somewhere, a long time ago, that quitting smoking is harder than quitting heroin.

It's to early in my sobriety from alcohol to comment on which was harder to quit. I think I had minor DT's when I first quit. Still would love to sit down with a case of good beer and try to polish it off. But I won't! Both have completely different effects on the body when you quit.

This is a good thread. I forget what I went through when I quit smoking. I'm now hoping to use that experience to help me in my sobriety. Thanks.

pulltight

I don't smoke, however I do use snuff/smokeless tobacco. I'm in the process of ending that disgusting habit as well.

Drinking and tobacco use has always been a time and place thing for me, couldn't mow the yard, grill out, work around the house or do something fun without a beer and a dip.

It's a willpower, self control issue I'm beginning to practice and for me they are equally tough.

Altoids

Just my 2 cents, but I think food addicts have it the worst. I'm not one, but I have a friend who struggles with it. Like with alcohol, smoking, heroin. . .we don't need those to live so can give them up, not partake and have a real life outside of them. However, we have to eat. Can you imagine having to manage your intake of a substance you are addicted to??? I know I could NOT manage drinking. How on earth food addicts manage their food intake and not succumb to their AV is beyond me. BTW - my friend with the issue is doing really well. I tell her all of the time that I take my hat off to her. What she does daily is amazing!

Yeah, just my 2 cents.

Pete55

If looked up in a dictionary, the modern medical definition of addiction is separated into 2 parts,
1. Physical
2.Psychological

For the layperson alcoholic, to understand their drinking issues and to break the habit, then search out
2.Psychological / Obsession.
An obsession is the inability of a person to stop thinking about a particular topic, in this case it's alcohol.

If,
I can go without a drink for 6 months then obsess over the thought/s;
"this time it will be different, there won't be any consequences", then drink, as usual for me it's blackout or the money ran out, or get arrested for disorderly behavior and then not drink again because I've gone into hiding due to guilt, shame etc etc,
how then can I be physically addicted to alcohol?
I'm not craving it. I only crave for more alcohol after the first drink of alcohol.
The effect just makes me want more and it's never enough.

Eventually after a certain time I will obsess and entertain the thought/topic, "this time it will be different, again".

I have no understanding why the professionals don't want to enhance on this, they put it in one general box, and label it, Addict for both alcoholics and drug users.

Excuse me, but I'm (plural) not an addict as in addicted to a drug or stimulant that I crave for before I take a certain drug/s so to take the craving away till the drug wears off.

Alcohol has the reverse effect, one drink and it can start the craving for more. That's the nature of it.


Point is, to get clarity use the words "Obsession over alcohol" rather than "addicted to alcohol" and know the difference.

Neither do most I know buy into it either once the definition of addiction is clearly defined.

pulltight

That's what I was thinking about too. It's odd, I'd drink like hell but I won't touch a coke/pepsi or some other stuff.
I'm treating drinking like soft drinks, something I just don't drink. I don't sit around and worry when I'll drink my next coke so I'm not gonna worry about where my next beer is gonna be.

PurpleKnight

I used to have the odd cigarette when I drank and on a heavy night out would have a pack of cigarettes, the time between smoking could have been weeks or even months at a time.

But when I quit alcohol, smoking fell by the wayside, I would say looking back I wasn't really addicted to them, they were just a habit that went with my drinking, but I wasn't too far down the road that things had progressed to needing to smoke on a regular basis, I haven't given smoking a second thought since!!

I have no idea on the figures, but I guess non addictive substance use can work both ways!!

zjw

I might take heat for it but I think you can apply the same or at least simlier concepts to quit booze, cigarettes, start an exercise program, create other better habits, start a healthy diet and stick to it etc.. the list goes on. I think if you can beat one addiction whats holding you back from beating the rest? Do you know if your even addicted to other things? IE lots of folks have bad food addictions and dont even realize it. Or are on meds for wtvr and dont realize they have an issue with them till you take them away.

I tried beating cigarettes years ago a few times and had a couple periods of being smoke free 8 months here 10 months there etc... When i beat booze however a switch was thrown it was like that eureka moment and i was like what am i doing still smoking why am i still eating as if my body is some kind of a garbage can I started going throught hese habits and cleaning things up using the same concepts and principles i applied to beat booze.

I can sit in an AA meeting see a guy with many years of sobriety smoke cigarettes and chug coffee and I think ciggarettes caffine? he was able to escape the claws of booze but he cant beat those 2 things?

Of course there are plenty who are happy to smoke and drink coffee etc.. But there are also many who dont realize how unhappy they are because of these vices.

I thought my life was fine with all those vices till it wasnt anylonger the reality is it was not ever fine I was just dillusional.

Boleo

I have met many people who smoke only a few times a year without being addicted. I did that myself for about 20 years when I only smoked cigars that were given to me as a gift or celebration event. I did go on to smoke about 6 cigars a day and pipe tobacco in the evening for about 10 years, but the question remains "Was I addicted?"

It took me a few tries to quit and the cravings were worse than what I experienced with alcohol withdrawal but to those who smoked more than I for a longer period than I, some would say that I merely had a habit and that it never crossed into full-blown addiction.

Altoids

THIS! I was watching a program on fitness/wellness the other day and the guy said something like "this isn't a decision you make once and done. It is a decision you make every morning." I think it is true for everything we do whether is it a fitness program, educational program, healthy eating. . . We don't just decide "I want to be a ______________" and it happens. Whatever it is we want in life is a daily decision to apply ourselves to it.

Guess that is a bit off topic. But this helped me see alcoholism in the same light as everything else I choose for myself.

zjw

I think the sad reality is its so simple to do what is right. I mean in some cases it couldnt be any better spelled out. Mama told you to eat your fruits and veggies etc.. yet here so many people sit shoveling in bad foods complaining they cant loose weight and have no idea why etc.. I know I grew up and saw alcoholics and was told how terrible that was and they where too and how I should never allow alcohol to do that to me that it runs in my family and I should steer clear of it etc.. But I drank my self to oblivian anyway. It would have been so simple to just not drink why did i? Why did I smoke? Why was it so hard for me to clean up my diet?

Because we tend to over complicate very simple things in our heads we are awesome at making excuses and justifying bad behavior and doing what feels comfortable etc..

Why does one guy smoke cigarettes and suffer from a caffine and food addiction but yet has 5 years sobriety. While another guy has beat those habits in a much shorter period of time? Because He is in a different stage of his journey is all. Its the same reason a guy on this board with 1 day sober could say something to a guy with 20 years sober that is so incredibly helpful and meaningful. The guy with one day sober might have just grasped a concept and been able to put it together into a meaningful way for that 20 year guy. Each person has a different journey and is at a different spot in there journey etc..

But theoretically if you can really beat one of these vices you should be able to beat all of them in short order. I'm not going to say it is easy but its very doable by applying the same thigns you learn to beat the one in order to win the others.

I'm still using the concepts learned by sobering up to win other battles in my life. its an on going journey. It cant all happen at once. But it can all happen 1 day at a time.

BackToSquareOne

I have known people all over the spectrum but most of the heavy drinkers I have known were also smokers. Many more smoked or used other forms of tobacco than drank alcohol and by a big margin. My father for example was always a heavy smoker but never a drinker, he died of lung cancer in his late 50's. My mother never smoked or drank and lived into her 80's. From my experience most drinkers were smokers but only some smokers were drinkers.

dwtbd

It is an interesting question, it made me think about how I use the concept/term addiction. I use the term now to mean doing something against one's own best wishes or desires.
Part of me didn't want to keep getting drunk, but for a long time a bigger part did. There were times when no part of me did not want to get drunk, especially when younger , getting hammered was the "fun" , it was the goal.
Drinking alcoholically for a period of time begins to build its own complications into the mix
of addiction, physical and psychological changes occur after prolonged periods of abuse. Addiction means using a substance and or taking actions against one's will or desire to stop.
Point being using an "addictive" substance without the actual desire to stop is not addiction. Withdrawal symptoms notwithstanding , and especially with smoking I believe many claim addiction without "really" wanting to quit, they know they should for long term health concerns, but they do not actually want to give up smoking day to day. I know I was/am this way with nicotine. I smoked since 17 , I didn't want to have health problems because of it , but I like it and don't plan on stopping . Using nicotine I mean, I use ecigs now, smoking the 'old' is too harmful with noticeable effects day to day.

Nocturnal

Your question is........?

fini

i quit smoking after about thirty-five years and many many tries, finally, ten years ago.
i quit drinking, after a gazillion tries, finally, almost eight years ago.

when i quit drinking, i expected the process to go much like quitting smoking: discomfort for a while, some new habits needed to be formed while old ones were broken, a certain amount of re-programming, the thing would be done with in six months.

that was my working theory.
you'll notice i'm participating in a forum like this. quite steadily.
i never even looked to see if there exists a forum for quitting smoking-support. didn't occur to me to chat with others about it.

i found the two to be entirely different, when i'd thought they'd be the same. not the actual quitting of the actual substance, but what they did for me, in a manner of speaking.
drinking touched me in an entirely different place, in an entirely different way. drinking got to me, the "me" at my core. smoking never touched me there. at all.

Nocturnal

im trying to quit drinking ....befor id smoke a pack in one night of drinking....now im smoking 6 cigs a day without alc and THAT IS BAD....im weak ..i gave up one for the other ...its gonna kill us one way or another..ADDICTION has to be stopped.