How do you know for sure

[allport]

Keith and One for the Road why don't you take this disagreement to PM

Amazingly this thread isn't about either of you.

[Learn2Live]

Hi Bug,

Welcome to SR. I've just starting getting onto the Alcoholism forum myself.

Usually, people who AREN'T alcoholics don't have to go around asking other people whether or not they're alcoholics.

Maybe you could look at what your wife is saying another way: If she's telling you that you are MEAN to her when you are drinking, perhaps you could BELIEVE her and care enough about her to NOT drink around her or stay away from her when you are drinking. Nevermind that the nice and loving thing to do for someone who is trying to sober up is to not drink or be drunk around her.

And you could look at it another way: At least she's being considerate enough to let you know you may have a problem instead of just dumping your a$$. Have some love and respect for another human being, will ya'? Especially one who agreed to marry you.

[Groucho]

I wouldn't presume to offer marital advice, but there's a line in the Big Book of Alcoholics Anonymous that kind of sums it up for me:

“The idea that somehow, someday he will control and enjoy his drinking is the great obsession of every abnormal drinker…"

I've known, beyond any doubt, that my drinking patterns are unhealthy for years (see my join date), but I still struggle with the definition of alcoholism and I am still not sober. I think trying to figure out if I qualify has done me much more harm than good. I do know that I can either enjoy my drinking (at least until the next morning), or I can try to control it, but I can't do both. It is certainly possible for me to stop after a few or even skip a day, but it is always an effort. Other than hunger, sleep, and possibly my guitars, I can't think of anything that creates such an absence when it's not available.

My suggestion is not to try to answer the question right now. Instead, I'd probably read some of the threads and just see how much of this you relate to. I've sometimes found it instructive to read the "friends and family" area too. The folks on this section of the board have a lot of nuanced discussions about the nature of alcoholism and who qualifies. Oddly enough, they seem to have no such uncertainties over at the F&F area. For that matter, I'd be very surprised if there are not folks over there who have had a newly-sober person in their life attempt to diagnose them with a problem.

[McGowdog]

Originally Posted by bugsquawsher

From what I read if you deny it, You are one.
If you say you are, You are.
Kind of a catch 22 isn't it?

I so agree. From what you say in your original post here, I don't think you're an alcoholic. You may not even be a hard drinker. You may be very lucky.

I wish I could drink 6 beers and think that's enough and stop. I don't think I know any alky's who can pull that off... ever, much less many times.

If it progresses, you will know.

Here's my definition of an alcoholic... as I recall it from the A.A. book;

1) Can't control the amount once you start,
and
2) Can't stay away from the 1st drink on your own when you honestly want/need to.

Have a good life.

[Pinkcuda]

Simple! Based on your past experience with drinking, can you guarantee the outcome after you pick up your first drink with any regularity?
By guaranteeing the outcome I mean, Can you stop after a couple or a few drinks. Can you stop after a couple because that's what you're made of or is it because you're trying to prove to yourself or someone else that you're not an alcoholic?
If you can stop or moderate, you're probably not an alcoholic.

[bugsquawsher]

Originally Posted by Learn2Live

Hi Bug,

Welcome to SR. I've just starting getting onto the Alcoholism forum myself.

Usually, people who AREN'T alcoholics don't have to go around asking other people whether or not they're alcoholics.

Maybe you could look at what your wife is saying another way: If she's telling you that you are MEAN to her when you are drinking, perhaps you could BELIEVE her and care enough about her to NOT drink around her or stay away from her when you are drinking. Nevermind that the nice and loving thing to do for someone who is trying to sober up is to not drink or be drunk around her.

And you could look at it another way: At least she's being considerate enough to let you know you may have a problem instead of just dumping your a$$. Have some love and respect for another human being, will ya'? Especially one who agreed to marry you.

Your post started out Nice. But toward the end you start to sound like my wife. LOL
Thanks for your input though. I'll take it into consideration. Actually I have been lately. Just kinda sucks That I have to give up all my friends just so I can come home with out beer breath to be ignored by her anyways.

[mumbai78]

If your drinking affects you or the people around you significantly then you have a problem.

Remember AA membership does not require that you be alcoholic, it only requires a desire to stop drinking.

Read The Doctor's Opinion and More about Alcoholism in the Big Book online at this location

Big Book On Line

[smacked]

Originally Posted by bugsquawsher

Your post started out Nice. But toward the end you start to sound like my wife. LOL
Thanks for your input though. I'll take it into consideration. Actually I have been lately. Just kinda sucks That I have to give up all my friends just so I can come home with out beer breath to be ignored by her anyways.

Maybe you should find friends, instead of drinking buddies! When I quit drinking, I felt the same way.. no friends. But the only thing that changed was that I didn't drink, and that's all they did to "socialize". The couple of real friends I had, could care less if I still drank or not, and it didn't effect our friendships because they weren't based on drinking activities.

To me it doesn't sound like your wife is your priority.. perhaps I'm wrong and you're just upset you 'can't' drink now.. but really, is it THAT important to you?

Might be a good opportunity for you all around.

Beer breath is disgusting anyways.

[McGowdog]

Bugs... you seem to have more of an issue dealing with your wife than dealing with your drinking situation.

I've given you my opinion on what you might be and that's that. I could be wrong. Like someone says, there may be a loophole into the A.A. program that lets other than alcoholics be in the A.A. fellowship. I'll give you another one besides the weak form of the short-form 3rd Tradition; "Most alcoholics for reasons yet obscure have lost the power of choice in drink." For me, losing the power of choice in drink is a big part of MY definition of whether you're an alky or just a hard drinker. But it don't matter what my definition of an alcoholic is. We let the person diagnose themself anyway. Let you draw your own conclusion. We can't drink for you. You have to do that on your own and only booze can give you the desire to stop.

What I can do is help you determine if you want to do anything about it. If you don't want to do anything about it, we're done. I'm not a recruiter. I didn't know that was our job in here or in A.A. I could go Mr. Makey and say, "Drugs are bad. Mmmkay? Don't do drugs. Because drugs are bad. If you do drugs, then you'll be bad. Mmmkay? Alcohol's bad..."

So short of helping you with the desire to drink differently or to abstain entirely (the A.A. method), I'll give you my advice/opinion about your wife. Put your drinking aside for a second and maybe just acknowledge and praise her sobriety. It's obviously a big deal to her. Maybe just taking a different attitude towards her recovery and stuff would go a long way in your relationship with her. IDK for sure.

And not to get nosey, but you're not driving after more than 2 drinks, are you? Because if you are, that's breaking the law and being stupid. I'll talk to you about some DUI experience if you'd like... from the wrong side of the bench too.

[bugsquawsher]

Originally Posted by smacked

Maybe you should find friends, instead of drinking buddies! When I quit drinking, I felt the same way.. no friends. But the only thing that changed was that I didn't drink, and that's all they did to "socialize". The couple of real friends I had, could care less if I still drank or not, and it didn't effect our friendships because they weren't based on drinking activities.

To me it doesn't sound like your wife is your priority.. perhaps I'm wrong and you're just upset you 'can't' drink now.. but really, is it THAT important to you?

Might be a good opportunity for you all around.

Beer breath is disgusting anyways.

I hope my responses don't sound like excuses.Just trying to fill in the holes where there seem to be holes.
My friends are truely friends , Not just drinking buddies. Ok some of them are. Others are friends that I have made since moving out to this little town. They often are guys that can help when I need something. I in return have skills to offer them and we barter a lot. Towing, Heavy equipment or other skills I don't have. None of my relationships with them are one sided. Actually I do my best to make sure they don't feel taken advantage of.
So sometimes its a social network so to speak. Because of the friends I have made here, I feel better when I leave town for work and get a call that something is broke at home. I can call one of my friends and they take care of me. Usually for nothing.
If I hadn't hung out when them over a few cold ones and socialized with them and befriended them I would have spent Untold amounts of money on repairs. Not to mention I would have been no help on the phone because I have no one to call. Others are riding buddies. I have tried riding with church bike clubs and was bored to tears. Not because we didn't drink but I had nothing in common with them. In life or Riding style.
Sounds like what I hearing from my wife and at the least the women from here is that even though I am the same person I was 20 years ago when she "agreed to marry me" I'm not good enough now.
At 46 years of age I may be getting tired of having to get permission to do everything. Or made to feel guilty over everything I don't get permission to do.
Why can't some people just except you for who you are. I am not mean. I am how ever blunt and too the point when need be.
Thanks guys and gals. Yall just answered another question I had in mind.
This has been good.

[Pinkcuda]

Remember AA membership does not require that you be alcoholic, it only requires a desire to stop drinking.

Tradition 3 as it was written

3.) Our membership ought to include all who suffer from alcoholism. Hence we may refuse none who wish to recover. Nor ought A.A. membership ever depend upon money or conformity. Any two or three alcoholics gathered together for sobriety may call themselves an A.A. Group, provided that, as a group, they have no other affiliation.

[littlebluedog]

I knew I was an alcoholic because normal drinkers don't usually question whether or not they are. That and the weekend blackouts.

[tomvlll]

Originally Posted by bugsquawsher

. But I do enjoy the buzz I get after 3 or 4 and feel I have had enough at 6. Skipping days is not a problem. ?

No phenomena of craving.

No obsession.

Not an alkie .

OF course this assumes you are being honest about your drinking.Most alkies aren't.

[tomvlll]

Originally Posted by Pinkcuda

Tradition 3 as it was written

Yep,AA is for alcoholics. But that takes care of itself-if you aren't, you'll leave.

[bugsquawsher]

It has been good reading some of the stories on here. I'm glad yall are here and getting help. Your stories helped me realize, I don't have it that bad at all.
This is In no way a jab at anyone, I'm glad there are places like this and AA to help.
People can be awesome sometimes.