Relapsing - SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information

roxiepoxie · 08-06-2005, 07:05 AM

Hi,I am an alcoholic coming up on one year of sobriety in a few weeks.(one day at a time)I am in a relationship with someone that has been in and out of the program for years.He goes 9,10,11 months and a few times over a year without drinking.When he relapses its for one day and then he's back to sobriety again for another 9 or 10 months.He relapsed the other night.We had been going to 2 meetings a day for 4 straight days! he told me he has never done a 4th step!after all these years of being in the program.He desperately wants sobriety,I can see the pain showing.I guess my question is,do you think not doing a 4th and fifth step has been part of the reason for relapsing?If so,what are some good readings about the 4th step? I know I cant fix him but i do want to help in anyway i can. thanks for listening.
Dianna

BikerBill8 · 08-06-2005, 08:03 AM

Hi, He needs to get a sponcer and work the steps and do a 4th and 5th step with his sponcer and keep going to meettings.

**CarolD** · 08-06-2005, 09:10 AM

Congratulations to both of you on the sober time.

Instructions are found in our Big Book and the 12&12.
Most groups have special Step meetings some have 4th Step workshops.

BB is on target...and
BTW...you are NOT to be his sponsor.

Cathy31 · 08-06-2005, 11:12 AM

I think you are right - and well done on YOUR sobriety! It's great he's going to meetings, but he needs to get on with the steps to really stay sober...has he got a sponsor?
Good luck - it's natural you want to help - as long as you don't lose sight of your sobriety in the process...well done again!
Cathy31
x

collinsmi · 08-06-2005, 02:25 PM

It doesn't matter how desparately he wants it, or how much you or I or anyone else wants it. All that's necessary is to do the work. Meetings are great, but they're not enough. I wouldn't suggest anyone try to do the steps without a guide, that's what sponsors are for. No matter how full of it people with long term sobriety may seem, they almost always have experience working the steps and most will be willing to help. And yes, not doing the 4th, 5th, or any of the steps will just about guarantee relapse. But don't take my word for it, it says so in the big book. Sorry if I sound harsh, I don't mean to. These are, however, harsh truths. Went through a lot of pain finding them out!

vitalsixthsense · 08-08-2005, 12:25 AM

I did my first 4th & 5th steps 13 years ago when I came into the program. It was very easy to do as there are only a finite number of defects and only a certain number of thoughts that can be blocking me from God at a time. So I listed a snapshot everything that was bothering me at the time. People, places, things, institutions, that I resented, feared or harmed. But I did not understand how to give these things to God, and I was shakey on Steps 1 - 3. I thought I could manage my own life, so I did not need other people or God. And I was not willing to go to any lengths for victory over alcohol. I was in control.

Over the next 2.5 years this failure to follow the directions proceeded to make me miserable. An oldtimer in the program said that if I worked the program my life would get a lot easier. Which helped me to now see that I could not manage my life. I could not control those defects on my own. And I needed Gods help. So I was willing to believe, cause I saw it working in others. Minutes later after I completed the 3rd step prayer I wrote my 4th step. I saw that most of my resentments were petty, most of my fears were irrational, and I was harming people due to my selfishness. The AA book suggests that we write it and look at it in one sitting. There are prayers for restentments, fears, and harms all in how it works, so we don't have to try to control it. We can ask God for help. In step 5 my sponsor showed me where I was to blame, not the other guy. I was probably supposed to see this in step 4, but it didn't happen. When returning home I meditated for an hour like it is suggested. Next I looked at steps 6 & 7. When I took steps 6 & 7 and did not try to control it anymore, a great weight was lifted off of my shoulders. I gave 100% to God, all of me good and bad. The AA book says if I skip steps 5 or 9, I may not overcome drinking. In ten God has removed our drinking problems.

After taking the steps up to 9, ten was still difficult for a while. But after practicing it for a while It began to happen automatically. I just have to continue practicing the rest of the principles, and not forget the God is in Charge.

jlo34 · 08-11-2005, 06:31 AM

Roxiepoxie,
Man, I miss chatting with you!!! Apparently the relationship's going well. Have YOU been going to Al-Anon meetings along with AA meetings? He would definitely benefit from doing the rest of the steps: the 1,2,3 shuffle (mostly step 1) can't keep us sober for long - that's why there are 12 steps. Have you finished your 4th and 5th yet?

It's fine to "worry" about him; but remember you are powerless over his sobriety. Youl are powerless over his program. Pray and keep talking about it. It's up to him to change "his cycles". Only he can decide whether he wants to change.

Take care: good seeing you're still around!!!
Love ya, hon,
Jen

Music · 08-11-2005, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roxiepoxie

Hi,I am an alcoholic coming up on one year of sobriety in a few weeks.(one day at a time)I am in a relationship with someone that has been in and out of the program for years.He goes 9,10,11 months and a few times over a year without drinking.When he relapses its for one day and then he's back to sobriety again for another 9 or 10 months.He relapsed the other night.We had been going to 2 meetings a day for 4 straight days! he told me he has never done a 4th step!after all these years of being in the program.He desperately wants sobriety,I can see the pain showing.I guess my question is,do you think not doing a 4th and fifth step has been part of the reason for relapsing?If so,what are some good readings about the 4th step? I know I cant fix him but i do want to help in anyway i can. thanks for listening.
Dianna

He shouldn't worry about the fourth step until he accepts the first step. Apparently he forgets those platitudes and still thinks alcohol has an answer for him. As long as that's the case, it won't matter what steps he works past the first one.

Chance · 08-11-2005, 01:52 PM

I agree with the Music man, he must still be looking to the bottle for a solution and he still is not doing the deal. The steps are in order for a reason Step 1, 2, 3 are the foundation that way we can sit down and do a fourth. It is like the 3 legged stool you can not do a 1 then 12 step program. My question to you is and I hate to say this but why are you there when he should be consintrating on his program, that is not healthy for him he could probably be substituting one addiction for another and not working on him. I will pray for you both

Love Vic

1_day@_a_time · 08-12-2005, 10:24 AM

The answer to your question is YES. And Music nailed it, BIG TIME!

FaeryQueen · 08-12-2005, 10:43 AM

Quote:

He shouldn't worry about the fourth step until he accepts the first step. music

Bingo
It doesn't sound like he did a 1st step. When we really internalize the fact that we are powerless over alcohol, and we know that it is a matter of life and death, we don't see the steps as an option....we see them as something we must do in a quick and thourough manner. We don't mess around. We get a sponsor. We do the steps. We have a personality change sufficient to recover. We continue our spiritual program of action. We live.

08-06-2005, 07:05 AM	#1 (permalink)
roxiepoxie dianna Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: monroe,michigan Posts: 14	Relapsing Hi,I am an alcoholic coming up on one year of sobriety in a few weeks.(one day at a time)I am in a relationship with someone that has been in and out of the program for years.He goes 9,10,11 months and a few times over a year without drinking.When he relapses its for one day and then he's back to sobriety again for another 9 or 10 months.He relapsed the other night.We had been going to 2 meetings a day for 4 straight days! he told me he has never done a 4th step!after all these years of being in the program.He desperately wants sobriety,I can see the pain showing.I guess my question is,do you think not doing a 4th and fifth step has been part of the reason for relapsing?If so,what are some good readings about the 4th step? I know I cant fix him but i do want to help in anyway i can. thanks for listening. Dianna

08-06-2005, 08:03 AM	#2 (permalink)
BikerBill8 Greatful Sober Biker Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Cottonwood AZ. Posts: 521	Hi, He needs to get a sponcer and work the steps and do a 4th and 5th step with his sponcer and keep going to meettings. __________________

08-06-2005, 09:10 AM	#3 (permalink)
CarolD Forum Leader Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Serene In Dixie Posts: 34,835	Congratulations to both of you on the sober time. Instructions are found in our Big Book and the 12&12. Most groups have special Step meetings some have 4th Step workshops. BB is on target...and BTW...you are NOT to be his sponsor. __________________ Each Day Sober Is A Victory!! Joy In AA Recovery!

08-06-2005, 02:25 PM	#5 (permalink)
collinsmi Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Colorado Springs CO Posts: 889	It doesn't matter how desparately he wants it, or how much you or I or anyone else wants it. All that's necessary is to do the work. Meetings are great, but they're not enough. I wouldn't suggest anyone try to do the steps without a guide, that's what sponsors are for. No matter how full of it people with long term sobriety may seem, they almost always have experience working the steps and most will be willing to help. And yes, not doing the 4th, 5th, or any of the steps will just about guarantee relapse. But don't take my word for it, it says so in the big book. Sorry if I sound harsh, I don't mean to. These are, however, harsh truths. Went through a lot of pain finding them out! __________________ "I was violating my standards faster than I could lower them!"

08-11-2005, 01:52 PM	#9 (permalink)
Chance JUST DO IT!! Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Here Or There Posts: 7,393 Blog Entries: 10	I agree with the Music man, he must still be looking to the bottle for a solution and he still is not doing the deal. The steps are in order for a reason Step 1, 2, 3 are the foundation that way we can sit down and do a fourth. It is like the 3 legged stool you can not do a 1 then 12 step program. My question to you is and I hate to say this but why are you there when he should be consintrating on his program, that is not healthy for him he could probably be substituting one addiction for another and not working on him. I will pray for you both Love Vic __________________ With Love and Respect Vic With God and A Little Luck We won't have to use today

08-06-2005, 11:12 AM	#4 (permalink)
Cathy31 1 bite&all resistance crumbles Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: IRELAND Posts: 2,160	I think you are right - and well done on YOUR sobriety! It's great he's going to meetings, but he needs to get on with the steps to really stay sober...has he got a sponsor? Good luck - it's natural you want to help - as long as you don't lose sight of your sobriety in the process...well done again! Cathy31 x

08-08-2005, 12:25 AM	#6 (permalink)
vitalsixthsense vitalsixthsense Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Frostburg, MD Posts: 18	I did my first 4th & 5th steps 13 years ago when I came into the program. It was very easy to do as there are only a finite number of defects and only a certain number of thoughts that can be blocking me from God at a time. So I listed a snapshot everything that was bothering me at the time. People, places, things, institutions, that I resented, feared or harmed. But I did not understand how to give these things to God, and I was shakey on Steps 1 - 3. I thought I could manage my own life, so I did not need other people or God. And I was not willing to go to any lengths for victory over alcohol. I was in control. Over the next 2.5 years this failure to follow the directions proceeded to make me miserable. An oldtimer in the program said that if I worked the program my life would get a lot easier. Which helped me to now see that I could not manage my life. I could not control those defects on my own. And I needed Gods help. So I was willing to believe, cause I saw it working in others. Minutes later after I completed the 3rd step prayer I wrote my 4th step. I saw that most of my resentments were petty, most of my fears were irrational, and I was harming people due to my selfishness. The AA book suggests that we write it and look at it in one sitting. There are prayers for restentments, fears, and harms all in how it works, so we don't have to try to control it. We can ask God for help. In step 5 my sponsor showed me where I was to blame, not the other guy. I was probably supposed to see this in step 4, but it didn't happen. When returning home I meditated for an hour like it is suggested. Next I looked at steps 6 & 7. When I took steps 6 & 7 and did not try to control it anymore, a great weight was lifted off of my shoulders. I gave 100% to God, all of me good and bad. The AA book says if I skip steps 5 or 9, I may not overcome drinking. In ten God has removed our drinking problems. After taking the steps up to 9, ten was still difficult for a while. But after practicing it for a while It began to happen automatically. I just have to continue practicing the rest of the principles, and not forget the God is in Charge.

08-11-2005, 06:31 AM	#7 (permalink)
jlo34 Grateful recovering alcoholic Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Blissfield, MI Posts: 814	Roxiepoxie, Man, I miss chatting with you!!! Apparently the relationship's going well. Have YOU been going to Al-Anon meetings along with AA meetings? He would definitely benefit from doing the rest of the steps: the 1,2,3 shuffle (mostly step 1) can't keep us sober for long - that's why there are 12 steps. Have you finished your 4th and 5th yet? It's fine to "worry" about him; but remember you are powerless over his sobriety. Youl are powerless over his program. Pray and keep talking about it. It's up to him to change "his cycles". Only he can decide whether he wants to change. Take care: good seeing you're still around!!! Love ya, hon, Jen

08-12-2005, 10:24 AM	#10 (permalink)
1_day@_a_time Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Pasadena, CA Posts: 1,492	The answer to your question is YES. And Music nailed it, BIG TIME! __________________ "A A's 12 Steps are a group of principles, spiritual in nature, which if practiced* as a way of life, can expel the obsession to drink/think and enable the sufferer to be happily & usefully whole"* Quote from the 12 X 12, not the BB "Calmness is trust in action"

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