markz

I have yet to see a sponsee do the steps and relapse.
I have seen many sponsees go to 5 meetings a day, and relapse.
I have seen sponsees go to a meeting then afterward hit the liquor store.
I have yet to see anyone relapse working the steps!

Importance of meetings? heck no, Importance of working the steps!

Tommyh

Mark,I agree
I would like to add,according to my experience,that making meetings adds to my experience with the steps.It enables me to grow and continue to give back

NYCDoglvr

My first sponsor, when explaining why we do the steps, put it succinctly: "the person who walks in this room will drink again." On the other hand, I've know fellow AA'ers who have double digit sobriety, done the steps but are still morally bankrupt. Cheating on spouse, that sort of thing. Like Bill Wilson

SoberCAH

I enjoy meetings and I wouldn't want to go without them.

But, for me, asking God for help every day (and sometimes all day) and working the steps and practicing the principles are, I believe, what have kept me sober.

WMJ1012

I have seen people drink after doing the steps.
I have also seen them kill themselves.
But I've seen it happen in many, many fewer cases when the steps are done.

tomsteve

Meeting makers make meetings.
Meeting makers that work the steps recover from the seemingly hopeless state of body and mind.

BadCompany

Just buried a guy last year that did 5 meetings a week. Not really big on the steps though. Guy had 42 years of sobriety and had 6 sponsees that I know of with over 30 years of sobriety. It's all important.

Johno1967

I rarely go to meetings but when I do it's like a rare special event that lifts me up. If I went every day I'd probably get blasé about it.
I try to live the steps though on a daily basis and that keeps me sober.
We all find our own way eventually.

dsmaxis10

I know a guy who went to five meetings all the time then when the guy that was working with him dropped him off he would hit the liquor store. He's been sober eight years never give up on anybody that has willingness.

Joe Nerv

Same here, on all counts.

There's something I don't think I ever shared here for several reasons. I feel it's an important part of my story however, so I'm going to put it out. It's MY experience, and perhaps a bit of light shed on why I feel the way I do. It's clearly not medical advice, and I'm not a doctor. Just another sober dude.

Anyone who knows me here knows I came into sobriety completely not functioning. I was full blown agoraphobic, depressed to the point of a suicide attempt, and after being hospitalized was put on a path of aftercare which consisted of outpatient counseling, and AA only. No meds were prescribed (for several reasons), and my choice was to either do as I was told, or drink again and kill myself. I was one of those who took the 12 steps out of absolute desperation. I needed to get better and was offered no alternative. But that's not what my point is about...

After my 1 year anniversary I was talked into going on a camping trip with some AAs. This was a feat for me, as my agoraphobia was not totally yet gone. At about 1 AM I started freaking out in my tent. Panic struck like it was my first day sober.

I had to get out of the tent, and upon doing so I saw a woman who had been sober a while sitting against a tree. By the light of the campfire I guess she could see something was horribly wrong, and she called me over to ask what was up. I told her. In our conversation she asked what my biggest fear was, and I said that it was that one day I would just snap - cross over to the other side - lose my mind completely. When panic struck, it felt like that reality was just a sneeze away. I continued by telling her that even though I worked the steps, went to meetings, prayed, did everything I felt I was supposed to do - I feared I would have a tragic outcome. I feared that although god could, god might NOT restore me to sanity. I feared this because at 5 years sober, my friend Hank (1st person to put their hand out to me in AA) wound up in a mental hospital. Also at 5 years sober, my friend Janet (who's story I wrote in my blog) jumped off a roof and killed herself. My friend Mitch, who I did bigbook studies with was drinking again, and getting locked up (he's sober 8 yrs now). Lots of people that I knew who were sober, were losing their battles, and I didn't want that to be me. What she told me that night was life altering...

She told me to watch and listen closely to all of the people that this was happening to. She promised me, and I believed her because of the sincerity in her delivery, that all those people I'll find were messing with their brain chemistry in one way or another. Either they were playing around on the side, self medicating, or being medically treated for their anxiety/depression. She went on, very convincingly, telling me that if I trusted in the process of the 12 steps, and trusted that I would be healed and brought back to sanity, so it would be.

30 sober years later I've found what she said to be 100% accurate. In MY experience. I've been healed of my desire to drink, my panic, my crippling anxiety, and while I still have some bouts with depression I've learned to manage them where I now consider them like seasonal flues that I have to let run their course. I've also found the medication part to be true, which is not saying that everyone I know on medication has gone off the deep end, or killed themselves. But everyone I know who has wound up in mental hospitals or dead by their own hand (up to and including Robin Williams), had been medicated by either themselves or MDs. And yes, some of them wound up in trouble when they stopped taking medication AMA, but they were far worse off when they stopped the medication, than when they started. Which is something that scared me even more when well meaning therapists tried to get me to go that route.

I know that for me the 12 steps were a solution to much more than just my alcoholism. And while I don't go to nearly as many meetings as I used to, they will always be a part of my life as they add a great deal of joy and richness to it. I also feel a bit indebted to the meetings, because they taught me how to live a comfortable sober life.

Db1105

We can only carry the message that the Twelve Steps are our gateway to recovery.

WMJ1012

My sponsor told me a while back that meds were killing people.

When I got sober I was at a psych hospital and the first night there was stuffed with meds I didn't want. I said I didn't want them but I didn't know I had the right to speak up loud enough and say NO.

I was bamboozled into the psych system for years.

When I started doing the Big Book process what I dealt with from therapists and psychiatrists was some of the sickest manipulative behavior I ever experienced, people wanting me to stay stuck and not trust the spiritual.

I have never worked with a therapist or psychiatrist who could be trusted.

During my 4th step (over 18 months) my need for meds subsided because I was replacing it with a Higher Power and getting well the right way.

Not being a consumer of the mental health system anymore where I could controlled by other sick people was a goal for me in recovery, once I realized the need for it.

WMJ1012

Only an alcoholic can touch another alcoholic in that special way

Ken33xx

I'm glad it all worked out for you.

However, while I'm sure there are plenty of crummy doctors out there I don't think getting medical advice from a fellow AA member is a particularly wise move.

mfanch

Three legacies for a reason. Recovery-Unity-Service

I need all three. Steps-Meetings-Carrying the Message

I don't try to compartmentalize things and say that one is more important than the other. I meet newcomers at meetings and share my ESH. I carry the message in all my affairs and to the detox. I work the steps with other women and also with my sponsor. I can't imagine not doing the "whole package". AA is not a cafeteria.

2muchpain

I think its fantastic that you were able to get of the meds and find your spiritual path to recovery. However, I also think it is risky for anybody taking meds to decide to stop without medical supervision. I've seen negative things happen to people who were told by someone in AA, etc., to stop taking their meds and rely totally on a HP. This might work for some, but not everybody. The reality is that some people need their meds to have a positive and productive life. Also, AA is not a substitute for good therapy. Some people need all three to stay sober and do well in other parts of their life. No recovery program can provide everything a person needs, IMHO. John

WMJ1012

Everything we need is in the BB & other 12-step lit.

I recommend using a dr's help getting of meds if the doc can be trusted and if one needs that. I didn't.

24hrsAday

sounds like a dry drunk.. i'll bet he did not pray on his knees as well.. and dry for 42 years WOW! too bad he was doing it wrong. < (Sarcasm for those to dense to get it)

Joe Nerv

.

That means I changed my mind about this post . This forum needs a delete option for posts we reconsider.

NoelleR

This may be true when using AA/12-step recovery methods for recovery from alcoholism. BUT it's not true concerning life in general, and can be dangerous, as mentioned by 2muchpain previously.............:

"...I think it is risky for anybody taking meds to decide to stop without medical supervision. I've seen negative things happen to people who were told by someone in AA, etc., to stop taking their meds and rely totally on a HP...The reality is that some people need their meds to have a positive and productive life. Also, AA is not a substitute for good therapy. Some people need all three to stay sober and do well in other parts of their life. No recovery program can provide everything a person needs..."

As an example, when I was early in recovery (about 6 months, and I remember it like it was yesterday), I met a woman in one of my regular meetings. She was a really sweet girl, and she was on psychiatric medication that some members were trying to get her off....with the line, "Everything you need is AA/the 12-steps and the BB." I tried to tell her to stick with her doctor, but she went with the (AAers') flow.* Unfortunately, she REALLY needed those meds, and within a few weeks off them, she put a .45 in her mouth and blew her brains out.

Even the BB mentions something along these lines...............:

"...this does not mean that we disregard human health measures. God has abundantly supplied this world with fine doctors, psychologists, and practitioners of various kinds. Do not hesitated to take your health problems to such persons. Most of them give freely of themselves, that their fellows may enjoy sound minds and bodies. Try to remember that though God has wrought miracles among us, we should never belittle a good doctor or psychiatrist..." (ALCOHOLICS ANONYMOUS, page 133)

(o:
NoelleR

*I'm a firm believer in not necessarily trusting 'the flow.' There's as old saying I like.............: Just 'cause the majority say something doesn't make it so; it could just be that all the fools are the wrong side.