Johno1967

What's the difference in your view. Right now how I feel about work and family and life in general I can't tell if it's apathy or equanimity.

biminiblue

Well, like the doctors' pledge, "First do no harm."

There is a balance to be struck. For sure, I don't always get it right and even when I do there is always a golden opportunity to be misunderstood.

I think the key is to be aware of my motivation. As soon as I switch to self I've gone too far.

It's easy to take detachment too far. It's difficult to discern how far exactly that is. I have to pray about this regularly.

Great question, and one I have often pondered - especially coming from a bit of a codependent family.

biminiblue

dbl post

Tommyh

Johno,I was familiar with apathy but I had never heard of equanimity before
so I went to the online dictionary to see what it meant.

with my experience and those definitions in mind,here is my take
I see apathy as me not giving a sh#@.
I just didn`t care,like indifference.

Now when I got to AA I felt emotionally frozen most of the times and many alcoholics I have talked too since have shared the same thing.I guess I was a alcoholic zombie.Over the years I think I have moved into more of the detachment and equanimity states of life and mind.It is a growing process and can take us many years to go from one to another.That proves to me I was wayyyy sicker than I thought.





equanimity
mental or emotional stability or composure, especially under tension or strain; calmness; equilibrium.


apathy
noun, plural apathies.
1.
absence or suppression of passion, emotion, or excitement.
2.
lack of interest in or concern for things that others find moving or exciting.
3.
Also, apatheia, apathia
[ap-uh-thee-uh] (Show IPA). Stoicism. freedom from emotion of any kind.

indifference

1.
lack of interest or concern:
We were shocked by their indifference toward poverty.
2.
unimportance; little or no concern:

detachment

the act of detaching.
2.
the condition of being detached.
3.
aloofness, as from worldly affairs or from the concerns of others.
4.
freedom from prejudice or partiality.

dox

The distinction often appears, to me, to be a very fine line.
Because I spent most of my life repressing feelings and emotions, I have to be careful not to fall into old ways of dealing with life.
When I think that I am handing a difficult situation over to my higher power, I might just be sweeping my troubles under the carpet.

I think it comes down to acceptance.
If I am accepting the situation and dealing with it, then accepting the outcome, I have achieved equanimity.

If I am ignoring the situation, denying it, or repressing my feelings then you might call it apathy.
That means that I don't care.
And that may be what it looks like.
But, in reality, I care more than anyone.
It's just that anxiousness (fear) prevents me from dealing with the situation in a healthy way.
It can be fear of my ego being tread upon or fear of my own angry reactions.
Nevertheless, it is fear that sent this alcoholic into apathy or feigned indifference.
My mantra used to be: "Oh, well."

The old me sought an easier, softer way to deal with life's ups and downs.
I sought tranquillity through fantasy, drugs and alcohol.
Apathy was easy.
Or was it?

Now the sober me tries to accept life as it comes.
I seek serenity with the help of my higher power.
For me, equanimity needs to be worked for and prayed for -- along with other positive character traits.

Sometimes it's extremely difficult.
Sometimes the old me takes centre stage.

Out with the old and in with the new.

Johno1967

Guessing that a "can't be bothered anymore" feeling is probably closer to apathy.

Ifnotforgrace

Indifference is "unkind" and Detachment according to CAL is "neither kind nor unkind"

Gottalife

Tommyh's definitions reminded me of a treatment centre medication experience many years ago. Equanimity was the hoped for outcome, apathy and indifference were the reality. Turns out this alcoholic could not get equanimity out of any kind of bottle.

Andante

Equanimity = having the serenity to accept the things you cannot change

Apathy/Indifference = lacking the courage to change the things you can

paulokes

Any chance there's a little listlessness and depression going on here johno? No shame in it and there is help out there, both spiritual and practical.

As for detachment and apathy...I like a lot of the definitions folks have posted here...they make useful distinctions.

I'm going through a little detachment myself. Someone close to me who insists on self harming, blaming, venting and criticizing. After some time things aren't getting better and I have to recognise it's affecting me, and I'm not helping.

Time to detach...Let Go with Love like they say. But believe me, it's not Apathy theres a little too much feeling going on for that

I truly wish I could Accept this person and situation exactly as it is. But I'm finding it hard...so I'll detach. Stay or go I need to let go of outcomes and expectations. I think we call one "Acceptance" and the other "Detachment"

P

WMJ1012

Was just going over some stuff with my guy spiritual teacher and dug this thread up again

He was saying to be open to people in AA (for friendships) who've been through some major trials and tribulations in sobriety but came out of it with a deeper richer experience and understanding. Lightheartedness, sweetness, equanimity and real inside emotional/spiritual heart recovery

skg

Here's a stab at an example...

I am apathetic to children and their success (or failure) in organized sports; I am not invested in the outcome.

I am detached from my grandson's success (or failure) in organized sports. I will love him regardless the outcome.

Soberpotamus

I see detachment as being emotionally unaffected by outcomes. When I detach, doesn't mean I don't care or I'm unconcerned. I do what I can do and then let the rest go.

Indifference means that I am somehow emotionally unaffected by a thing (or person, situation, etc). Moral judgement being relative to what it is I'm indifferent to within context.

There's a connotation of neutrality and objectivity for both terms though. But I also relate detachment with outcomes for whatever reason. I "detach" from my dysfunctional family in order to keep healthy boundaries and take care of my own mental health, for example. I am not indifferent to their suffering, however. I still care.

WMJ1012

Indifference was a big word in the '60s; (a real no-no).
VS
Detaching (is done with love)

Boleo

Indifference = I don't care - at all.

Detachment = I still care about my part. I still do my part. I recognize that I only play a limited part. I don't pay attention to other peoples part. I trust my HP to do it's part. I detach from the outcome.

WMJ1012

Yes but indifference has a negative connotation, (i.e. ignorance.)

This is why greats like RFK & MLK would speak against it.