Johno1967

The article discusses the power of attraction rather than dissuasion in getting the message out. It compares AA with a brutal organization that in my view is complete polar opposites of AA. Interesting none the less.

Islamic State’s rules of attraction, and why U.S. countermoves are doomed

paul99

I don't even know where to begin with this.

My wife's family is Muslim (I converted when I married) and all that stuff about bombings, beheadings, etc. is the complete opposite of what Islam stands for.

And to compare extremist actions to AA is mind-boggling.

Oy vey.

paulokes

Yeesh. Tradition 10 truly does spring to mind...the AA name and Public Controversy

P

nandm

It is frustrating that the author of the article would choose to disparage AA in this manner; by stating that AA is propaganda, comparing the message of AA and an horrible and violent extremist group like ISIL, etc...

Personally I feel this sends the wrong message to anyone who may need AA but has yet to give it a try as it sends a very negative message about AA which has worked for millions of people including myself. It quite literally saved my life. How many people will wind up dead because they will now not seek the help they might have received because of these disparaging comparisons? The author did a disservice to the alcoholic who still suffers with the writing of this article. There were other ways he could have made his point without the disparaging comparisons.

I have written a letter of complaint to the paper about this.

coraltint

wow it really takes some self control not to take his bait on that one. what a tool.

Jfanagle

The writer who put together this painfully constructed analogy really should enroll in some night classes at the local Jr. college for journalism. Perhaps he has been fighting off the urge to attend AA for what I hope is the explanation as to why this article is so far afield. If he isn't drunk then any other reason for this writing suggests a more serious flaw, like no talent.

Just my take on this bizarre piece.

Jon

FeenixxRising

I really didn't see his comments to be disparaging of AA. The author simply pointed out that AA works by attraction (what AA can do for the suffering alcoholic), as opposed to aggressive proselytizing. Now the analogy may be a bit awkward, but I don't believe it casts AA in a negative light.

From the article:

"One way to make sense of all this — bear with me here — is to look at the appeal of Alcoholics Anonymous. AA does not recruit members, it attracts them. Long experience suggests that people who impulsively make decisions that actually require a long-term commitment will almost certainly fail. As the entry point for joining, AA thus asks prospective members to first make a commitment to not drink. Ads for the organization never try to seduce alcoholics into joining. The focus instead is on what AA can do for them. If they want what it offers – sobriety — and are committed to working toward it, AA says, then join."

freshstart57

If you need to refute this article, you refute its points. The author did not say that AA is responsible for the crimes similar to the heinous crimes ISIS has committed. Pulling that out as an objection to the thesis is pointless.

'Freshstart57, you are just like the war criminal and murderer Mussolini.'

'Really? How?'.

'Well, you both prefer pecorino to parmigiano cheese on your bolognese pasta'.

'OK, fair enough'.

The similarity proposed was in the recruitment methods used.

Soberpotamus

All of you who are having a strong reaction to this article... read it again. Really. Come on, people. Critical reading skills. Feenixx & FreshStart nailed it. The comparison is of the recruitment (or in AA's case, non-recruitment) style by attraction.

awuh1

Yes must agree with freshstart. The analogy between AA and the Islamic State makes just as much sense as his war criminal - pecorino cheese example.

freshstart57

And may be equally true. That's the point. The truth doesn't make sense to everyone, it would appear. For example, my wife would never put pecorino on bolognese. She refuses to accept that anyone could do that.

RumHound

I don't see any disparagement of AA in the article. The author is simply theorizing that attraction is better than promotion (or deprecation) as a strategy for recruitment appeals to an audience of potential voluntary joiners.

The man makes a decent point, although the analogy is a little off the beaten path. But the analogy is still pretty logical.

Tradition Ten is not involved in this situation.

Johno1967

Wow I didn't expect to get so many responses. One thing communications experts do concede is that ISIL has some very talented PR people in its ranks. The acts are violent and ugly but it does speak to an alienated and disillusioned minority particularly among some angry young Muslims "seeking to belong to something". The organization uses social media and you tube to get its point out and the productions are slick and effective if shocking. The Kurds on the other hand are just now getting up on social media and it's their acts of bravery on the battlefield that has got them fans and respect. Watching those old men and women defend Kobani makes me want to go and join them. For me that's a strong message, it's like seeing a skid row drunk dismissed as hopeless beat the odds and become sober and productive. That's what I respond to.
I can see where the journalist was trying to go with his article but it sort of fell over for me. ISIL in my view uses propaganda very much the same way Hitler used it that is, pure brain washing and fear. I've never seen anything like it used in AA. Interesting debate.

paul99

I guess my critical reading skills suck. I must be an self-centered alcoholic. lol.

yay AA!!

paulokes

I don't read the article as disparaging to AA. In fact I had a sinking feeling the author is a well meaning member or at least friend.

But it is pretty opinionated, and it draws a parallel, an association that really is none too helpful in the mind of the uninitiated.

Hence Tradition 10. Just no need for that in the public domain, whatever the intention

But it is what it is

P

Carlotta

thank you that made my day

coraltint

I agree with the logical dissections of the guy's example. It just seems to me an unnecessary juxtaposition. A ton of people who read that article are going to "hear" in their minds -

AA.....terrorists