The Real Alcoholic

[nandm]

But what about the real alcoholic? He may start off as a moderate drinker; he may or may not become a continuous hard drinker; but at some stage of his drinking career he begins to lose all control of his liquor consumption, once he starts to drink.

Am I a real alcoholic? Can I always maintain control of my liquor consumption once I have started drinking? These last three paragraphs are here to help us decide for ourselves if we are in fact alcoholic. This definition of an alcoholic does nto include any of our stereotypical thinking of what an alcoholic is. This definition does not rest on "living on skid row" or "drinking all the time." It bases its definition solely on one's ability to always control one's consumption and one's ability to stop drinking altogether if a good reason exists.

Here is the fellow who has been puzzling you, especially his lack of control. He does absurd, incredible, tragic things while drinking. He is a real Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. He is seldom mildly intoxicated. He is always more or less insanely drunk. His disposition while drinking resembles his normal nature but little. He may be one of the finest fellows in the world. yet let him drink for a day, and he frequently becomes disgustingly, and even dangerously anti-social. He has positive genius for getting tight at exactly the wrong moment, particularly when some important decision must be made or engagement kept. He is often perfectly sensible and well balanced concerning everything except liquor, but in that respect is incredibly dishonest and selfish. He often possesses special abilities, skills, and aptitudes, and has a promising career ahead of him. He uses his gifts to build up a bright outlook for his family and himself, then pulls the structure down on his head by a senseless series of sprees. He is the fellow who goes to bed so intoxicated he ought to sleep the clock round. Yet, early next morning he searches madly for the bottle he misplaced the night before. If he can afford it, he may have liquor concealed all over his house to be certain no one gets his entire supply away from him to throw down the wastepipe. As matters grow worse, he begins to use a combination of high powered sedative and liquor to quiet his nerves so he can go to work. Then comes the day when he simply cannot make it and gets drunk all over again. Perhaps he goes to a doctor who gives him morphine or some seditive with which to taper off. Then he begins to appear at hospitals and sanitariums.

This is by no means a comprehensive picture of the true alcoholic, as our behavior patterns vary. But this description should identify him roughly. (from the chapter "There Is A Solution" Big Book

Does this depiction roughly identify us? Of course, we don't fit this description exactly. Perhaps we don't expect we will ever exhibit some of these symptoms. Though, we never expected to be exhibiting the symptoms that we are suffering right now. If some of this description is too accurate to deny that it describes us and if we are having these things happen to us, perhaps we are alcoholic also.

Why does he bahave like this? If hundreds of experiences have shown him that one drink means another debacle with all its attendant suffering and humiliation, why is it he takes that one drink? Why can't he stay on the water wagon? What has become of the common sense and willpower that he still sometimes displays with respect to other matters? (from "There Is A Solution" Big Book)

These are not rhetorical questions. They are placed here so that we will ask them of ourselves. Our lack of an adequate answer to these questions, that ring so soundly of the truth, shines a bright light on our predicament.

Perhaps there never will be a full answer to these questions. Opinions vary considerably as to why the alcoholic reacts differently from normal people. We are not sure why, once a certain point is reached, little can be done for him. We cannot answer the riddle. (from the chapter (There Is A Solution" Big Book)

Have we reached the point where little can be done for us? Have we reached the point where there is little hope for our recovery? Having arrived at the point where there is little that can be done for us, where is it that we can turn for a solution? Admitting that we have arrived at this point is the first step in recovery.

[nandm]

When I read the paragraph in the Big Book that speaks of Dr. Jekyl and Hyde, I have no trouble relating to it as I lived it. Dr. Jekyl or You Better Run And Hyde.....that was how I was known during the last few years of my drinking. I never knew who I would be once I started drinking. I also was really proud of a hat that I had, it said "Instant *******, Just add alcohol" and too many times this was way too true. Today, I know who I am. I don't have to worry about who I might become because alcohol has hit my system because today I no longer feel the need to add alcohol to my body. Today, I have the ability to stop and think before I respond. I don't have to strike back at people when I feel slighted, I can choose to apply the program and work the steps around it. I am grateful for the kit of spiritual tools that AA has provided me.

[dgillz]

Great post. The Big Book addresses this very well while allowing you to make your own diagnosis. There are so many posts by newcomers asking if they are alcoholic or 'have a problem" that I this ought to be a sticky in the newcomers forum. Just MHO.

[RufusACanal]

When I first saw your post Judith my thoughts soared. This is the message of change that the Alcoholic must grasp if they are to recover.

"The tremendous fact for every one of us is that we have discovered a common solution."

[Music]

"but at some stage of his drinking career he begins to lose all control of his liquor consumption, once he starts to drink."

This was all I needed to be convinced. Right from the first time I drank at age 18, I had no control after I took that first drink. Funny I never gave it much thought until I read it in the Big Book.

"If anyone questions whether he has entered this dangerous area, let him try leaving liquor alone for one year." This is what really sealed the deal though. I knew I couldn't not drink for a year, at least without help.

[Pinkcuda]

I had been to Drunk Driving Classes several times. A handful of times in Detox, Therapists, Counselors, Judges, Doctors, Lawyers Etc..
Nobody would ever explain exactly what an Alcoholic was. I thought I was just undisciplined among other things.
Sadly enough I was in AA for almost 2 years before it was explained.

[RufusACanal]

I can appreciate that Cuda.

[nandm]

Originally Posted by Pinkcuda

I had been to Drunk Driving Classes several times. A handful of times in Detox, Therapists, Counselors, Judges, Doctors, Lawyers Etc..
Nobody would ever explain exactly what an Alcoholic was. I thought I was just undisciplined among other things.
Sadly enough I was in AA for almost 2 years before it was explained.

You bring up an excellent point. Unfortunately unless people in the meetings are actually reading, using, and studying the book things like the definition of the real alcoholic fall by the wayside. Many of these things are key to understanding and accepting who we are as alcoholics so we can work on the solution.

The best advice that was ever given to me in AA was when I was complaining about a problem and wanting them to give me a solution they told me "The solutions in the book, find it."

[RufusACanal]

...is that not the truth. I was told the same thing numerous time while still trying to manipulate others to do the work for me.

[laurie6781]

When I first came to AA I had no problem saying I was an alcoholic. After all I had died. What could be more real than that?

Then as the weeks went on, and the insidious python started rearing it's ugly head I like any good alkie had doubts.

Thankfully some pretty wonderful people had been put into my life. My sponsor and her husband INSISTED that I read these passages several times a day as a reminder.

Let me tell you, that within a week of reading those passages sometimes as many as 4 times a day, I had NO DOUBTS left. And like Music said "quit for a year?" Heck without help I couldn't quit for one day.

Yep, REAL ALCOHOLIC here, lol may have used some 'stuff' along the way so I could drink more, but ALCOHOL was DEFINITELY my problem.

J M H O

Love and hugs,

[Boleo]

Chris R. of Ingram TX said it this way:

If you ARE NOT a "real alcoholic" and detox, every day gets easier for you after that.

If you ARE a "real alcoholic" and detox, every day gets harder for you after that.

[Dean62]

In the past I have used the definition found in "The Doctors Opinion".

that the phenomenon of craving is limited to this class and never occurs in the average temperate drinker.

Today I see myself both in the problem and the solution throughout the BB. If the BB was written for "real alcoholic's" then I am one.

[RufusACanal]

You either are a real Alcoholic or you are not. This semantics crap about the term gets truly old. It's in the Book! Some people will debate over the length and breadth of a single hair as if the continuation of the world depends on their much vaulted opinion.

Of course this does not apply to those posting here....LOL

[SelfSeeking]

I have been a real b!tch about this topic before. I wanted to post and explain a bit.

There's this thing they talk about in psychology. 'Projection'. When you're uncomfortable about a feeling you're having, so you suppress it and project it onto other people.

I kept interpreting posts on this topic as being accusing me of not "qualifying", of saying I wasn't a real alcoholic. It made me so mad and defensive!! Why are all these d@mn big book thumpers trying to make me leave AA and start drinking again?! blah blah blah <<insert profanity here>>

Then last week I relapsed and had a very vivid reminder of how I drink when I drink... and how bad I want to drink. How hard I've had to work and how many meetings I've been to to stay sober, when I was staying sober. I have realized I was still, deep down, unsure if I'd earned my seat. I'm sorry I spewed a lot of venom. I'm trying to be more conscious of where my anger and frustration stem from now... that I need to take a longer look at myself before assigning thoughts and emotions to others.

So, thanks

[nandm]

Originally Posted by SelfSeeking

I have been a real b!tch about this topic before. I wanted to post and explain a bit.

There's this thing they talk about in psychology. 'Projection'. When you're uncomfortable about a feeling you're having, so you suppress it and project it onto other people.

I kept interpreting posts on this topic as being accusing me of not "qualifying", of saying I wasn't a real alcoholic. It made me so mad and defensive!! Why are all these d@mn big book thumpers trying to make me leave AA and start drinking again?! blah blah blah <<insert profanity here>>

You are not alone in this feeling. I too would get somewhat defensive when I would hear someone in a meeting introduce themself as "a real alcoholic". It was only after doing some research that I realized that any alcoholic is a real alcoholic. That is what I like about this definition from the Big Book. It clearly states what the "real alcoholic" is without making someone who doesn't fit the definition exactly anything less than a "real alcoholic". I finally realized that an alcoholic is an alcoholic.

I would love to learn why when the Big Book was written that they chose to use the words "real alcoholic" when describing the alcoholic. It almost seems to imply that there is something less than a real alcoholic. My thought is that since this paragraph describing the real alcoholic is preceeded by the paragraphs describing the moderate drinker and the heavy drinker using the wording "real alcoholic" is a way to reitterate that just because someone may drink heavily it does not mean they are alcoholic. The key difference being that the "real" alcoholic loses control of their drinking when they take that first drink.

Just my couple of pennies worth. Thanks for bringing this up though as I think many people have struggled with the terminology. Today I realize that being a "real alcoholic" does not make anyone else anything less than me. An alcoholic is an alcoholic regardless.

[Boleo]

Originally Posted by RufusACanal

You either are a real Alcoholic or you are not.

If you ARE NOT a "Real Alcoholic"it is not important to know about what it says on page 24 of the Big Book:

"The fact is that most alcoholics, for reasons yet obscure, have lost the power of choice in drink."

Those who can "choose" not to drink can make use of any old program so long as they are diligent and stay motivated.

For the "Real Alcoholic" is is not a matter of motivation but rather a matter of staying in fit spiritual condition:

"We will see that our new attitude toward liquor has been given us without any thought or effort on our part. It just comes! That is the miracle of it. We are not fighting it, neither are we avoiding temptation. We feel as though we had been placed in a position of neutrality—safe and protected. We have not even sworn off. Instead, the problem has been removed. It does not exist for us. We are neither cocky nor are we afraid. That is how we react so long as we keep in fit spiritual condition. "

Source:Alcoholics Anonymous
First Edition

[doorknob]

Originally Posted by Boleo

Those who can "choose" not to drink can make use of any old program so long as they are diligent and stay motivated.

Those who can simply 'choose' not to drink are probably not alcoholics at all, 'real' or otherwise. It's insulting to imply that those who use other programs of recovery are somehow not real alcoholics.

[Boleo]

Originally Posted by doorknob

Those who can simply 'choose' not to drink are probably not alcoholics at all, 'real' or otherwise. It's insulting to imply that those who use other programs of recovery are somehow not real alcoholics.

A fellow named Jack Trimpey was told by his wife that he drank too much. He used psychological tricks & tips to help him stay motivated enough to resist alcohol and found it so easy that he founded "Rational Recovery".

Is he a real alcoholic? Not in my opinion.

Does his program work? Yes - for those who can "choose" not to drink.

"Whether such a person can quit upon a nonspiritual basis depends upon the extent to which he has already lost the power to choose whether he will drink or not." (page 34)

[ananda]

I don't know if i am a "real alchoholic" and don't care....i am an alchoholic and AA, SR and my spiritual path lead me toward sobriety and away from drinking as a solution to my problems.

The dr.s opinion is probably the part of the bb that i most relate to.

[nandm]

Ironically, it appears that the words "real alcoholic" in the title have wound up under some people's skin. It would help if rather than prejudge the thread and responses by responding to the title, people would read the OP. Nowhere does the term "real alcoholic" mean that anyone is less than a real alcoholic. In fact if someone feels they are an alcoholic they are just as real an alcoholic as the next person.

The title came about because I was posting a series of passages from the Big Book that started with the "moderate drinker", went to the "heavy drinker", and finally ended with the "real alcoholic". The terminology was not my own, it is straight from the Big Book. If one will note in this series of passages there is no reference to the "NOT Real alcoholic". By that one can assume that the term is being used soley for the purpose of helping the reader to decide if they have an alcohol problem or not.

To those that have been offended by the word "real" please accept my apologies. If one will read my OP it should be clear that I was in no way infering that there is such a thing as a "Not real alcoholic".

[Tazman53]

This topic is a real "Let us get wrapped around the axle really tight" for some folks.

In a nutshell according to the BB if you are an alcoholic, then you are a real alcoholic.

I will not call someone an alcoholic anymore then I will say some one is not an alcoholic. There is only one person that I need to determine is an alcoholic or not........ that is me! The BB & other people who have determined they are alcoholic have helped me to determine I am an alcoholic.

You know even in the doctors opinion there are several classes of alcoholics, I fit into most of those, I also fit almost every description of an alcoholic in the BB.

I have no need to take my alcoholism as far as some have, nor does any one need to take theirs as far as I did. Compared to some I was a high bottom alcoholic, to others I was a low bottom alcoholic. It does not matter, an alcoholic is an alcoholic and can not begin recovery until they have admitted to their own self they are alcoholic.

How much we drank, how long we drank, what we drank does not determine to us whether we are alcoholic or not, it is what happens to us when we drink.