Cafeteria style recovery???

[lizw]

I've heard this term used a few times recently and wonder what it means.

Is it the short way of saying, I don't need a sponsor or the steps, I'll just go to meetings?

If anyone could explain?

Ta
Liz

[sugErspun]

I think it's

" a little of this, a little of that"

Kind of "choose your own recovery, rather than follow the directions of those who have had the problem removed"...

[Dean62]

I thought it was referring to the very common saying "Take what you need and leave the rest."

[AW2486]

"Pick and Choose What You Can Use" is another saying.. Too many do this with the program of AA.

Its meant more for AA meetings.. with what people share at the table.. It's OK to Pick and Choose from others ESH.. Not from the actual program.

JMO

Andy

[ananda]

It simply means that the person isn't doing AA the way that someone else thinks they should.

[lizw]

Originally Posted by ananda

It simply means that the person isn't doing AA the way that someone else thinks they should.

That's pretty funny.

But one of the reasons I asked is a friend of mine (who I sponsored at one time) used it in refference to herself, the other day. I asked how it was going with her sponsor and she told me she'd dumped her then 2 days later rung her back and asked her to sponsor her again. Then she said she thought she done it cause she must've been doing 'cafeteria style' recovery.

Then someone here used it the other day.

[Ago]

Originally Posted by ananda

It simply means that the person isn't doing AA the way that someone else thinks they should.

well no comment on other people, but here's my experience with that

years ago, I went to some big book seminars three years in a row, they laid out "precisely how we have recovered" and for the next year or two i don't know if I have ever been so unhappy in my life...I was running around book thumping yelling at everyone and sharing at meetings "you're all doing it wrooooong!!!"

I was a mess!!!!and I couldn't understand why I was so unhappy!

finally I was working the steps again, got to step three, about the actor:

In trying to make these arrangements our actor may sometimes be quite virtuous. He may be kind, considerate, patient, generous; even modest and self-sacrificing.

then: What usually happens? The show doesn't come off very well. He begins to think life doesn't treat him right. He decides to exert himself more. He becomes, on the next occasion, still more demanding or gracious, as the case may be. Still the play does not suit him. Admitting he may be somewhat at fault, he is sure that other people are more to blame. He becomes angry, indignant, self-pitying. What is his basic trouble? Is he not really a self-seeker even when trying to be kind?

A HUGE light went on...even if I was virtuous, kind, considerate, patient, self sacrificing...whatever...I am still trying to run the show.

Doing kind things but having expectations, "giving gifts with strings", having conditional love, for me, soon makes me as sick as I have ever been.

I mean ILL.

I call that "the good actor blues" and I still struggle with it today on occasion in my personal relationships...as a matter of fact, I'm struggling mightily with it right this second.

It was funny, I was talking to a sober friend, and he was like Blam, third step, go read, so I did, and was like oooooh yeaaah, the good actor blues, cool, ok, let go let god walk away buh bye.

That sh1t is PAINFUL for me, because I think i'm doing the right thing.

It's just best if I work on my own program...it really is, If I'm not manager material for my own life, I'm Dammed sure not fit to run yours.

the really sad part, some of these granola eatin, step 4 burnin, chantin, doin it all wrong fools?

they stayed sober, and I drank.

I still see many of these folks around, and they changed, they really got a spiritual awakening, AA, done p1ss poor wrong (IMHO back then) actually worked for them...I mean crazy stuff...tying your fourth step on a balloon and letting it go on step 5......I can't even remember half the ways I've heard the steps being worked...but some pretty bizarre stuff (this IS Marin....)

but now we have thousands upon thousands "kids" in their early twenties and even teens putting together some pretty impressive sobriety, I go to the local chip meeting and every week there is someone who doesn't barely look old enough to shave (exaggeration, but not much, they look YOUNG) getting a twenty plus year chip.

Plus, it's not always the messenger, I have a buttload of old sponsees that I was their first sponsor and took them through the steps the first time, out there with anywhere from 7 to 15 years of sobriety. It's the message that's important.

Quote: Alcoholics Anonymous
First Edition

[Cathy31]

Originally Posted by AW2486

"Pick and Choose What You Can Use" is another saying.. Too many do this with the program of AA.

Its meant more for AA meetings.. with what people share at the table.. It's OK to Pick and Choose from others ESH.. Not from the actual program.

JMO

Andy

I agree with this Andy - pick and choose from shares, sure...but the program is the program. My view : it's another version of the easier softer way, i.e. I'll go to meetings, but I'll choose not to have a sponsor, do the steps or service...I'm taking what I like and leaving the rest...for me that's not AA.

[Boleo]

Originally Posted by lizw

I've heard this term used a few times recently and wonder what it means.

Some say it this way "Take what you need and leave the rest".

The problem is that those who are new to recovery simply don't know what they need or how serious their situation is;

"Remember that we deal with alcohol-cunning, baffling, powerful! Without help it is too much for us." (page 58)

" Half measures availed us nothing. We stood at the turning point. we asked His protection and care with complete abandon" (page 59)

[Last Call]

Originally Posted by Cathy31

I'll go to meetings, but I'll choose not to have a sponsor, do the steps or service...I'm taking what I like and leaving the rest...for me that's not AA.

Interesting topic and an interesting comment. Just my 2 cents as I close in on 7 months sober. This is my second quit of any length (IE over 2 months) and the second time I have included AA in my quit.

The first time I tried to be a good trooper and wade through the steps, and somewhere along the line between inventories and therapy it started feeling like I was just picking at scabs that didn't need to be picked and I slipped. For a while I blamed AA and therapy, not any more. I do not think I was ready for that kind of introspection.

So this time I have not reconnected with my sponsor, not done any steps beyond I think fully grasping the meaning of powerless and unmanageable, step 1. But I have been attending occasional meetings, and I do feel like others shares help me with the things I am going through. I especially enjoy speaker meetings. I will probably decide at some point to get with the program and do it "right". I feel like it's taken me this long to start to understand what living sober is really like, and to grasp the things I need to work on.

Tradition Three - "The only requirement for A.A. membership is a desire to stop drinking."

So per tradition three if I get something from attending meetings that helps me stay sober, and chose to delay or not work the steps today. Am I really doing anything wrong?

Obviously I can't express this in a meeting or the veterans will ambush me chanting "dry drunk" and "half measures availed us nothing"...

LC

[Cathy31]

Well done on your 7 months! You are so right - the requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking...the program though to get the full benefit is steps, sponsor, service, HP amd meetings...thats my understanding. I think for me if I didn't do the aforementioned (which does happen!!) then I just get less quality of life for ME...less serenity, less usefulness, just less joy really. That's how it works for me. But sober is first step and you're doing that - well done!!!
Cathy31
x

[ananda]

LC....we are alchoholics sharing with each other to get sober and recover...we each share our own expereince.

Different people in my aa groups have different expereinces with getting and staying sober...thats one of the great gifts of AA....and the more will be revealed part too!

We have a number of members with close to 30 years who never had a sponsor. Back when they started there was really no emphasis on sponsorship. They aren't "against" it and see the advantages...it just isn't what their expereince of the AA program was. They have freinds and mentors in the program and work a program...

[sugErspun]

Thanks for sharing Last Call...I couldn't help noticing your signature line.

"No, try not, do or do not...there is no try...Yoda"

That seems like that is what this thread is all about. You are correct about that short form of the 3rd Tradition - the only requirment for membership is the desire to quit drinking. My book clearly says that the only requirment to be a member will not keep me sober (if I have alcoholism as described in Alcoholics Anonymous - I happen to be one of those whom "the book will appeal to"). So - for me, AA was not about 'trying' it was about doing. Also somewhere it came to be important as to what I was doing right as opposed to what I was not doing wrong - I believe there is a difference.

As far as someone doing the steps right or wrong, or how I think they should do them, or how they should be done...this isn't what comes to mind when I hear a term like 'cafeteria' style recovery. Specifically I think of someone saying "I am gonna do this my way", when "my way" has been nothing but failure, it's not really a reasonable approach.

I don't know how many saw that "Intervention" show last night (it may have been a re-run for all I know)..but it was a panel of people who had previously been on the show. One guy was not able to stay sober, but he was there. They started asking him some questions about his "program" and his response was "I do what works for me." It seemed like what he was doing wasn't working - so he was really doing what doesn't work.

I support anything that can solve the problem for an alcoholic. I have not seen many who do it completely by themselves - and lasted. Somewhere along the line I had to accept help, and do things anyway but "my" way.

Congrats on 7 months.

[Jfanagle]

Last Call,

I am going to piggy back my comments with sugErspun if I may. I too commend you on your 7 months and hope that you will have success in the future. I was struck by your statement: "So per tradition three if I get something from attending meetings that helps me stay sober, and chose to delay or not work the steps today. Am I really doing anything wrong?"

I don't think it is a case of doing something wrong, certainly attending AA meetings is better than not attending, simply because you are in a mode of addressing the problem of alcohol as it relates to your life. I think it is more an instance of "are you doing enough?"

You can be ON a submarine or IN a submarine, but when the boat submerges it is much more desirable to be IN than ON. AA for me is the same thing. If I am taking the steps and participating in service to others I am IN the program, but if I am sitting in meetings and listening I will certainly absorb many good ideas, but I am ON the program and not IN it.

The saying of "take what you want and leave the rest" has always been one that I adhere to, but as was previously stated, I use that for those ideas that I hear from others in meetings and not in regard to the actual steps or other suggestions that comprise the core of AA.

My best guideline for the time sober that I have has been based on the statement, "If you want what we have you have to do what we did." This was crystal clear to me the day I first heard it in a meeting. It was so simple to this alcoholic; find someone in the rooms that had the life that I was looking for and find out what they are doing and what they did to get where they are! In my case several members including my sponsors, took all 12 steps as quickly as they could, continue to work 10-11-and 12 on a daily basis in their lives and seem to never tire of trying to progress year after year.

Since they have what I want, I am doing what they are doing. It has worked for a few years now, and even though AA is a "big cafeteria," I make sure that I take some of everything and when I notice a deficiency in my AA diet, I go back for seconds to that station.

Best of luck and remember all of the above is just my opinion.

Jon