Walked out of a meeting tonight

[navysteve]

Hello,
I have heard it said many times that there is no such thing as a bad meeting. I have never agreed with this and have often replied to those who say it that they don't go to enough meetings. I was at a meeting tonight where the speakers main theme was that "if you are not happy you are not working the program right". He then spoke about how the sixth and seventh steps imply that God will remove our defects not that we work on them ( that is almost verbatim for what he said not my interpretation). Now I believe that asking God to remove defects does not take away my responsibility to correct my behavior. He brought with him his fan club, which contained one old timer who loved to tell you how much time he had ( can you tell that annoys me?) Now, when I am in such a meeting and feel that I can bring nothing to it, I leave. Because in my opinion it is not an AA meeting. Why do I feel that way. At an AA meeting, we share our experience, strength and hope. We do not dictate how others should feel. We do not tell them how the steps will work for them. We share our experience, strength and hope....
Now I have played the role of AA police. When folks have shared in ways I believe is unhealthy, I have appointed myself protector of the message and shared to straighten them out ( this is not my place).
I also do not buy into the psycho-babble bull that no matter how bad a meeting is, I can find a message if I choose to, or that I should see what I could bring to the meeting. I am speaking at a meeting tomorrow night ( I don't get offended if people walk out on me) and I am thinking of responsibility as a topic, responsibility to share our experience, strenght and hope. I think that is our greatest tool. In the past I have decreed myself to be an expert on many subjects related to recovery. I have been a relationship expert, theologian etc...
Today, thanks to the 12 steps I have been freed, and, like a bad movie, I am free to walk out if the meeting sucks. And some of them suck real bad

[daydream]

When I was in early recovery and deeply depressed, I heard a lot of people in aa meetings say that if ya weren't happy you weren't working the program. It really hit my self-esteem hard, what little was left after destroying my life in active addiction. It did make me question myself and it felt sh*tty to know that when I was down, others were thinking I wasn't working the program. I quit sharing my pain in meetings and that had a really bad effect on my recovery. It took quite a long while to muster the confidence to speak out against that statement. I knew I was working my ass off at recovery and secretly I dared anyone to try and tell me otherwise. Today I am not happy. Ya know why? My dog f'ing died. I have feelings. I use my recovery program so that I can deal better and not relapse, but my recovery program does not numb me out when bad things happen. The person who made the statement is an idiot.

[lizw]

You're a legend Steve (I say that as a compliment) and I have been to plenty of bad aa meetings.....



Hope you are okay.

[Tazman53]

Steve I have not been to a meeting that was that bad, but I can see why you walked out!

daydream I have found that part of sobriety is the ability to feel pain, to experience emotions and to have the ability to work through problems today rather then drink through them. I use the steps, my HP, & the ES&H of others to do that.

Not being happy all of the time is not an indication of working a good program, the signs of some one working a good program to me has been someone having the ability to walk through the worst of times accepting what they need to accept and taking the actions they can take and not drinking over it.

Over all my life is good, but I have my bad days, my sad days, those days when I start out with the purpose of draining the swamp and finding myself knee deep in gators, but I do not drink over the gators, with the help of my HP, the program, and others I wade through the gators, I feel the pain, and I get through it.

Over all I am happy, but the reason I am happy is because I now have the ability to live life on lifes terms, taking the good with the bad, and asking for help and guidance when needed.

[stone]

Saying that if you are unhappy you are not working the program right is pretty annoying!

However, step 7 doesn't mention us working on our defects, it just says we ask for them to be removed. My sponsor says that when he says the step 7 prayer he believes they are removed at that moment but that they come back and so he has to work on them constantly. I am not sure what I think about it myself except that I know I need to work on them all the time.
If they really were removed there would be no need for step 10 and 11, so what is the point of step 7?

[navysteve]

Daydream I am truly sorry about your dog passing away.

Liz, you are a scream!!! Legend??? Me!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

A good legend or a bad legend?????

Has my reputation extended all the way across the Pacific???

[tkdan]

JMHO! If you do not experience some unhappiness from time to time you do not live on the same planet as me. I do not care how a person works the program life is going to happen. For me the plus about the program I can better accept life when it happens for what it is rather than relying of alcohol to give me the illusion of making things better. Now I can live in reality and sometimes that reality is not all roses but it is the reality I choose.

[tommyk]

I leave meeting sometimes too, Steve.

And the message I receive is that "some people giving leads believe their own bullshit so much that they try to pass it on to others".

The second message I receive is that I'm really glad when I can see through their schlock clearly enough to get up and leave, lol.

In my opinion all leads should focus on the individual's own experiences and NOT what he/she knows/thinks what will work for others.

[Tazman53]

If they really were removed there would be no need for step 10 and 11, so what is the point of step 7?

Stone taking the steps the first time we do the 7th step prayer asking that they be removed, but just before we do that prayer it says:

If we still cling to something we will not let go, we ask God to help us be willing.

In the 12 step it says:

Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.

The principles we are to continue to practice are the steps, so we should be continually working on our shortcoming and becoming willing to let them be removed. They will be removed as we become willing to let them go. None of us are willing to let go of every one of them, but we strive for spiritual progression knowing we will never acheive spiritual perfection.

[stone]

I see what you mean Taz, it is just the wording, "Humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings." means to me that if He did as we asked then our shortcomings would be gone...end of story, lol.

However your way of putting it is pretty much how I see it myself.

[RufusACanal]

Have I left a meeting, sure. In the past, I left meetings for a variety of reasons; most of the time it was to drink. Today, I stay in meetings and at times I am forcing myself to listen and be in the moment. Why? In this New Life, I have made certain agreements with myself and the responsibility I assume for carrying the message. Notice, I am talking about what I do, not what you do. When I hear experience in a meeting that I do not agree with, I now listen anyway.

"And we have ceased fighting anything or anyone - even alcohol. For by this time sanity will have returned. We will seldom be interested in liquor."

This one statement reminds me of my place in the scheme of a New Life. I enjoy sanity! I want to retain sanity and frankly I tend to go downhill when I am at odds with others.

Years ago, someone told me not to leave before the miracle could take place. Today, I know that I need to be here, where ever here is, at this moment listening and being available for God to use me as he would. If I cannot resolve the situation, I better inventory it to find my place. When the world is filled with ass****s, I am most probably at the center of the issue.

[DSodaNow]

This is a good topic to bring up. There have been many times that I have felt like leaving a meeting because of what the speaker says or sometimes in a discussion meeting the chair lets the talk get outside the focus of recovery.

I personally try to remember that everyone in AA is an alcoholic and only human. I take from the people who speak what works for my program and leave the rest behind. If anything, it sounds like this speaker probably prompted a lot of discussions with sponsors.

As for... if you are unhappy then you are not working your program. That is a pretty blanket statement that should be used with care. Many of us, including myself, suffer from anxiety and depression. Working the program helps me handle these things, but it is something I will always have to deal with.

It really drives me nuts when people stand up there and say how perfect and wonderful their lives are. Life still happens when you are sober and sometimes it sucks!

I hope that I didn't offend anyone with my comments... I guess this just touched a spot with me.

[todd6138]

I have been to alot of meetings where the same people show up every time and say the exact same thing every tie which would be all right except they take 25 min. of the meeting to do so . and most of the time it is filled with the f word or some other ridicculous nonsense and nobody ever stops them and tells them to shut up just because they have some sobriety which i have to laugh when they call that sobriety because i want absolutely nothing they have. I have found meetings on the other end of town and it has been well worth the extra effort.

[navysteve]

I hear experience in a meeting that I do not agree with, I now listen anyway.

I understand, the meeting I left was not because I disagreed with the speakers ESH. I didn't hear it. He was telling folks what they should be thinking and feeling. IMHO, that is not an AA meeting

[DSodaNow]

Originally Posted by todd6138

I have been to alot of meetings where the same people show up every time and say the exact same thing every tie which would be all right except they take 25 min. of the meeting to do so . and most of the time it is filled with the f word or some other ridicculous nonsense and nobody ever stops them and tells them to shut up just because they have some sobriety which i have to laugh when they call that sobriety because i want absolutely nothing they have. I have found meetings on the other end of town and it has been well worth the extra effort.

Yes! Yes! Yes! I hate that....

[RufusACanal]

Dsodanow, I have had those sobriety rushes and still do from time to time. It's like God injected me with short acting goodness shot and the world is damn near perfect in everyway. When I used to hear Father Martin give his lead, I would have one of these moments. When I gauge my insides with someone's outsides I tend to think that the goofy pink cloud syndrome is a fake, until God wraps me up and applies the same to me.

Steve,

No need to justify, I understand. It gets better...

[lizw]

My idea of a legend is someone who despite what others think, does what is good and says what is good for them.

There are lots of sheep and/or parrots in AA.

These days if I am in a meeting and a 'fanatic' is speaking, well dictating, I stop listening and start thinking about things I need to get done at home.

[RufusACanal]

"We have three little mottoes which are apropos. Here they are:

First Things First

Live and Let Live

Easy Does It."

[Peter]

I was at a meeting tonight where the speakers main theme was that "if you are not happy you are not working the program right".

This is not the language of AA but rather a member expounding an opinion.

Frankly I never could stand to hear this expression either. Working The Steps never was a guarantee to happiness and as far as I know it still isn't.

My happiness is a byproduct of recovery and a life lived well.

[navysteve]

This is not the language of AA but rather a member expounding an opinion.

I agree and feel very comfortable leaving because it is not an AA meeting

[Freedom1990]

I walked out of AA a few years back when a member, now cured and no longer attending, found it necessary to take someone else's inventory who wasn't present, under the guise that he was 'concerned'.

I stood up and told him that is not AA, he started to argue with me, and I walked out.

[sugErspun]

You are right Steve - that is not an AA meeting. I can't recall the promise where we enter into a life of neverending happiness (sounds like a Prince song to me).

My OPINION on step 7. We humbly ask God to remove our shortcomings, erm defects of character. Also - this does not imply that we go into auto pilot mode, never falling short of what we should do, or doing something that we should not (shortcomings and defects as I understand them, simplified). Right after the seventh step prayer on page 76 it says "We have then completed Step Seven." This is immediately followed by "Now we need more action"

I believe that something does happen at steps 6 and 7, even if it means that we just become utterly aware that our problems are of our own making and begin to feel uncomfortable about some behaviors that used to just be a normal part of our makeup. We ask they be removed. It is not promised that they would be, as that implies we begin living a life with no defects/shortcomings - a level above human.

Step 7 is a lesson in humility, admission that we can't do this alone. By 'this' I mean live life. As far as working on defects - I think it implies some time taken away from the design for living to use self-will and help ourselves. Only through grace can these things be removed. If someone has made a list of ammends - is making them, praying and meditating daily- and CONTINUING to take personal inventory, there is a transormative process that could not possibly be made by just 'trying harder'.

Great share Steve.


Big Book references taken from http://www.aa.org/bigbookonline/en_bigbook_chapt6.pdf

[bballdad]

Steve,if i had traded places with you,and I did the same thing you did and then talked to my sponsor,here is what he would have told me,more than likely
1-it`s all about you,ain`t it Tommy?
2-Tommy,if you take your inventory like you are supposed to,you won`t have time to take anyone elses.
3-Tommy,it`s not what we receive thats brings happiness,it`s what we contribute.
4-remember,we have a fatal illness
5-Tommy,when you left,you may have missed what God wanted you to hear,and now you`ll never know
6-Tommy,you and he is excally where you are supposed to be,concerning your spiritual condition

[BP44]

I have not walked out of a meeting in a long, long time. However, I thought about it earlier this week. We have a newcomer's meeting on Monday night's. And group conscience decided long ago on a format for the newcomer meeting specifically to stick with a topic on the first 3 steps AND to encourage newcomers to share before opening discussion up to people with 6 months or more. In other words, asking for shares from folks with 30 days or less, 60 days or less etc. And then open it up. Well, one of my best pals int he program was leading discussion, and somehow in his lead went off on a tangent on inventory and character defects. And then opened it up to everyone. I've been guilty as well of leading the discussion recently and bypassing the newcomers by opening discussion up to everyone. Well, on this night my sponsor's wife had just had enough of us bypassing newcomers. She shared flat out that this was a newcomer's meeting............in other words, follow group conscience. Well, my buddy had an, " how do I salvage this" look followed by long winded shares by folks trying to salvage it for him. There were some bruised egos to be sure. A number of us had a discussion the next day, and saw where we had been wrong in straying from the group's decision on how to run a newcomer meeting. And my sponsor's wife was right and she did the right thing. Sometimes the right thing isn't comfortable, but it needs to be done anyway. Maybe the next time you encounter an AA meeting that seems more like a BB meeting or anything other than AA, speak up. It may not be popular, but it will be right. I don't walk out of meetings anymore. I'm there for one reason either to hear the message or carry the message.

[AW2486]

I have never really walked out of a meeting. But will admit to not returning to a few "Group Depression" meetings, The kind Joe and Charlie describe, where the last thing they want to discuss is AA and the steps.

This past summer my sponsor asked for some help getting his home group back on track. So we would pick the topic (always a step) and 3 or 4 of us would start it off to set the tone. After a few months its now back on track.