Sobriety is not enough

[nandm]

Here are some passages and thoughts from the Big Book regarding this topic. I encourage you to share your experience, strength, hope, and perspectives on this as well.

Elimination of drinking, but a beginning.....

(quoted from There is a Solution chapter of BB)
We feel that elimination of our drinking is but a beginning.

If alcohol was the cause of our problems, quitting drinking would solve them. Why then doesn't it? The reason many alcoholics drink is that we think it is a solution to our problems. Once we remove our failed solution (drinking) we are left to face the underlying causes. We learn to face and successfully deal with life's problems by practicing the steps of this simple program of action.


Jim made a beginning......

(from More about alcoholism of BB)
He made a beginning.

Jim made a beginning--he stopped drinking. This is only the beginning of the solution that the authors have found. A person who is powerless over alcohol must find a Power greater than themselves to maintain permanent sobriety. Left to our own resources we will drink again.


Leaving aside the drink question.......

(from We Agnostics of BB)
Leaving aside the drink question, they tell why living was so unsatisfactory.

The paragraph that includes this sentance offers us a wonderful promise that power, peace, happiness, and sense of direction will replace our current helplesness, anxiety, despair, and feelings of uselessness. For this program to work for us we may do the things that the authors show us they did: "come to believe," "take a certain attitude toward God," "do certain simple things," and "meet a few simple requirements." We are certain to succeed if we follow the path laid out by those who have gone before us.


Our liquor was but a symptom.......

(How it works)
Our liquor was but a symptom. So we had to get down to causes and conditions.

Our drinking and the unmanageability of our lives are symptoms of the fundamental defects of our character. If our problems in life were caused by drinking, then they would go away once we stopped drinking. The improvement in our lives resulting from abstinence is likely a temporary respite if we fail to address the things in us that block us off from our Higher Power.


Unthinking to say sobriety is enough.......

(Into action)
We feel a man is unthinking when he says that sobriety is enough. He is like the farmer who came up out of his cyclone cellar to find his home ruined. To his wife, he remarked, "Don't see anything the matter here, Ma. Ain't it grand the wind stopped blowin'?"

Stopping drinking, while imperative, is just the beginning. The way we think, feel, view and react to the world must change if we are to live happily. Step Nine is an important part of bringing about the needed change.


Bottles were only a symbol.........

(Working with Others)
After all, our problems were of our own making. Bottles were only a symbol. Besides, we have stopped fighting anybody or anything. We have to!

We have found a solution to our alcoholism. We have joined togetehr to help those who desire a solution to find one. We are not religious crusaders or anti-alcohol lobbyists. Our only wish is to be useful. God has given us a great gift that we wish to share with those who would have it.


owes spouse more than sobriety......

(To Wives)
Your husband knows he owes you more than sobriety. He wants to make good.

It does not take much spiritual effort to step out of the way of the tornado that is alcoholism. It takes a great deal of spiritual effort to abandon many of our old failed methods of coping with life and accept the guidance of spiritual principles.


cessation of drinking is but the first step........

(The Family Afterward)
Cessation of drinking is but the first step away from a highly strained, abnormal condition. A doctor said to us, "Years of living with an alcoholic is almost sure to make any wife or child neurotic. The entire family is, to some extent, ill."

Stopping drinking is just the beginning of our recovery. There is a great deal of work to be done as we learn to apply spiritual principles in all our affairs. As we recover, we may go through some of the same situations as have the authors. We can ease our way by following their examples.


My personal experience has shown this to be true in my life. I tried many times to stop drinking and was able to do it for periods of time. Once for a year. The problem was that when I just quit the drinking my life was still unmanageable. I was still miserable inside. I could not stand being in my own skin. My problems didn't change. How I dealt with them did not change as I still tried to ignore them, run from them, blame others for them, etc..... only I did not drink while doing so.

It wasn't until I found the program of AA and listened long enough to learn that drinking was but a symptom of a deeper problem that I began to understand to some degree the depth of change that needed to be made inside of me for my life to truly change.

Today, I still am in that process of change. I am by no means perfect. I still study the book, go to meetings, listen to others, work with others, work the steps, and try do follow the example left by the founders of AA. I am grateful that I was finally led to a solution to my alcoholism.

[CarolD]

Another powerful and thought provoking thread...
Thanks for the quotes and for your insights.

Our liquor was but a symptom. So we had to get down to causes and conditions.

I never could see that I had a cause to drink.
I drank for fun then I became an alcoholic.

Not until I considered my alcoholism is a
condition/malady/disease/mental obcession have I
found peace and healing.

I find I am a happily recovered alcoholic by
living the 12 Steps....and using the Golden Rule.


Thanks for letting me share.

[debs4321]

As I have heard before

"If alcohol was the only problem, then you probably arent a alcoholic"

[jimhere]

We sell the newcomers short when we offer them sobriety. Sobriety by itself is the most intolerable condition of all for alcoholics. The whole reason I drink is because I can't stand being sober. What we offer, or what was offered me is far beyond not drinking.

I was offered a way of life that makes sense to me. I was not offered a meeting or a chair, but recovery.
Jim

[sugErspun]

Thanks for the post Nandm. You see it over and over again with alcoholics - take away the liqour and things 'seem' to get better for awhile. Maybe that is because of the intense focus on the act of drinking and liqour itself as the problem - "just stop drinking and things will get better" - is a lie to a guy like me. "Things" got worse...on the inside...

Today it is so plain to see that liqour is not the problem - it's ME who is the problem. I believe when someone can see this for what it is (in themselves) - it is a great start.

Alcohol cannot make someone an alcoholic - but I do think that 'most' people believe that it does, sadly enough - even in AA.

[zencat]

Without undergoing some serious self-improvement I would most likely still be stuck in active alcoholism. Drinking was only a symptom to my underlying psychological disorders.

[gravity]

From How it Works:
“Though our decision was vital and crucial step, it could have little permanent effect unless at once followed by a strenuous effort to face, and to be rid of, the things in ourselves which had been blocking us. Our liquor was but a symptom. So we had to get down to causes and conditions.”

Initially, I did not understand this concept. I had defined my alcoholism as simply the fact that I cannot control alcohol, the physical aspect. How can a physical condition be the result of a spiritual deficiency? It seemed to follow that if I addressed the spiritual issue, then the physical condition would be eliminated. It really didn’t make any sense to me.

What I have come to understand is that the physical aspect of my alcoholism is really not the issue at all. The fact that I can’t drink alcohol is nothing more that a part of my physical makeup, neutral really, neither good nor bad. The real issue is why can’t I accept this fact and move on, the obsession. All hell breaks loose when I drink (fact) so it logically follows that I should not drink. I fought with this apparent contradiction for too many years. But the answer is not in common sense alone. The answer is also in my lack of spirituality, my reliance on self-will. There is no way that my best thinking alone can offer me a good life, free of alcohol.

I often wonder where I would be today if I did not become a member of AA last December. At best, I would be sober but living primarily on self-will. I would be the same scared, dishonest, selfish, miserable person I was in December. But really, without AA I don’t believe that I would be sober today.


All Big Book quotes are from the First Edition of the Big Book

[CarolD]

What?

Alcohol cannot make someone an alcoholic - but I do think that 'most' people believe that it does, sadly enough - even in AA.

I do beleive I am an alcoholic because of drinking alcohol.
Oh well....

[LosingmyMisery]

What a quandary. I couldn't stand life sober, but I couldn't stand life drunk either. In that case, I was forced to take action, take a look and take a stand. As a result, my life changed for the better. It wasn't easy, but it was well worth it.

[bballdad]

tell it Carol,me too,I sure ain`t a alkie cause of drinking lemonade

Originally Posted by CarolD

What?



I do beleive I am an alcoholic because of drinking alcohol.
Oh well....

[ananda]

I guess why I am an alchoholic is a lot less important than that I am and what am i going to do about it

And yep...was pretty much a complete mess before I drank...now if it were going to be the same I doubt that i would bother staying sober too long.

[bballdad]

yep,main thing is what am I going to do about it..

I had a sponsee once who said,"I have messed around and caught the allergy"

we had a good chuckle..

[sugErspun]

Originally Posted by CarolD

What?
I do beleive I am an alcoholic because of drinking alcohol.
Oh well....

Carol - I am confused. Actually for a couple of reasons, but I will stick to the content of the thread in this post.

Earlier you qouted "Alcohol was but a symptom" and now it has become "I am an alcoholic because of drinking alcohol". Those are two different things - one is a symptom, one is a cause. I tried to be as clear as possible-but it would not surprise me if I fell short of that.

Are you suggesting that if anyone drinks enough they will develop alcoholism? We will probably have to change the big book in that case - because it says alcoholics are physically set apart as a "distinct entity", and that is looking only at the physical effects of alcohol on the body of the alcoholic. Also - the description of the heavy drinker would have to be taken out -he obviously has drank enough to become alcoholic-but our book says he is not..he looks it, he acts it (hard continous drinking) his life is affected (dies before his time) cannot stop (hospitalized detox)...but AA does not consider this man an alcoholic.

Alcoholics Anonymous pp 44.

"In the preceeding chapters you have learned something of alcoholism. We hope we have made clear the distinction between the alcoholic and the non-alcoholic."

The notion that the alcohol itself causes alcoholism is NOT AA. But - like I said - some people believe this and want to blame the substance for their illness. Maybe there could be an alternate first step - "We admitted that we drank too much and became alcoholics"

Has anyone ever heard someone share that they believe they were born alcoholic? The theory that alcohol was the cause does not make much sense unless they were drinking in the womb. But their response to alcohol when they drank and the way they drank alcohol as being symptomatic of something more going on (alcoholism) - makes absolute sense.

Anyhow - thank you for responding in the way you did(bballdad and Carol), it really has made me go over this again- It raised two questions that I had to look at

1 -Do I blame alcohol for my alcoholism?

OR

2 - Do I accept that I am bodily and mentally different than most, and maybe this explains why I drank like I did?

Acceptance has worked much better than blame - in all areas of my life.

Sorry if this seems a bit trite, but when working with someone new - it is crucial to find out if they are alcoholic or not. Never is this found by the outside circumstance of drinking - but what happens inside. You have heard it "Do you take the drink, or does the drink take you?"

I titled this post "Causes and conditions"- this phrase from the big book is in the directions for the fourth step. Now - alcohol did not make my inventory, I hold no ill will towards it, I never did. But I just spent a little while doing an inventory about this subject
"Is alcohol use/abuse the cause of alcoholism, or a symptom of it". I know what the book says- but I needed to take the action in the form of writing a four-column inventory about this today.

Alcohol isn't a cause or condition of my alcoholism: The cause and condition is rooted in selfishness, self-seeking and fear. The answer is always the same when I honestly take a look.

Yes indeed - what am I going to do about it? I hope whatever I do is based on a foundation of truth - that drinking too much did not cause me to become alcoholic - because if I believe that to be true, that means I could have avoided alcoholism- that self will could work.

I would be interested to hear people share who had 'alcohol' in their fourth step - did the resentment and fear remain the fault of fermentation and/or distillation?

~a

[CarolD]

I thank you for the clarification Adam..
if you read my reply again...
I made a distinction between cause and condition.

My reply is exactly how I feel about my alcoholism.
It doesn't have to be anyone elses....
regardless of what is written in our BB.

Alcohol cannot make someone an alcoholic - but I do think that 'most' people believe that it does, sadly enough - even in AA.

Sorry...Adam that is not my opinion
on why I am an alcoholic.

I'm not introspective or a complicated thinker.
Perhaps I take Dr. Bob's last statement too literally.


Soooo... I will continue to live in the joy
of an AA recovered alcoholic.

[Rob B]

Good thread,
My experience is that drinking treats my alcoholism.
Today I have two choices, God or Booze.
I'll continue to walk with God for exactly the same reason I drank, I like the effect produced.

[FightingIrish]

LOL.

Originally Posted by CarolD

I'm not introspective or a complicated thinker. Perhaps I take Dr. Bob's last statement too literally.

[bballdad]

glass in hand we have warped our minds
I believe in all fairness, consideration should be given to both,the underlying cause(s) and drinking booze the way we did.

Father Martin in his chalk talk video mentioned booze as a problem and also mentions a problem behind the problem.So true.
I agree,booze was a problem,but I had other problems.
Peaceful,contented sobriety is still a inside job for me.
If I just try and treat the outside problem,which is my drinking, by trying to quit on my own,which I did for short periods,I end up on a dry drunk as we call it.Good sobriety has to have weight and depth.

[lizw]

Originally Posted by bballdad

Good sobriety has to have weight and depth.

I'll probably be shot BUT the term 'good Soberity' is used a lot in AA and since this thread is about 'Soberity is not enough' (we have to go further) what do people think defines 'good soberity'.

I had this conversation recently with an old timer (30 +) who is as mad as a hatter. Resentful, hateful, bitter etc... She said she defines 'good soberity' as having life events happen, both good and bad and be able to deal with them without drinking.

I think I agree with that statement but I would also add, handle them without drinking and with grace.

At times in my soberity I have NOT been a shining example of this, but at other times I have. I really love people who come to AA and tell the truth about what is happening in their lives (good and bad) and how they are applying the steps/program to it.

So what do you think? What makes 'good soberity' outside of going to meetings, working the steps, having a sponsor and being in service etc...?

[navysteve]

At times in my soberity I have NOT been a shining example of this, but at other times I have. I really love people who come to AA and tell the truth about what is happening in their lives (good and bad) and how they are applying the steps/program to it.

There have been times in my sobriety when I have been an example of just how sick you can be without picking up a drink ( stark raving sober!)

[lizw]