I'm the daughter of an alcoholic mother

[Mandjas]

Firstly my apologies for my life story on-line but I felt it therapeutic to objectively review everything that has happend over the last 16 months. Hopefully someone will recognise something in what I have written and can offer me some advice, so here goes.

My stepfather has been telling me for years that my mother was an alcoholic but she has managed over the years to successfully manipulate the situation by telling me how bad he is to her (although I never really saw that as I was a teenager when they married and moved out in my late teens). Due to this I have never really been that close to him and refused to believe what he was saying, often defending my mother and being her shoulder to cry on.

I had been living in Australia for 7 years and used to get these odd and bizarre messages from time to time and we used to put that down to the fact that my mom was a bit ‘unbalanced’. She has a history of anorexia, bulimia, addition to slimming pills and speed, which obviously have had a detrimental effect on her mental health over the years. Having said that though my mother and I had become quite close after I got married and had a baby. She used to be quite obsessive about my son and her life seemed to revolve around him, constantly buying things for him and wanting photos.

It was only when my husband and I moved back from Australia and decided to live with my parents for a year or two to try and save money and allow them to be active in their grandsons life that the real situation unveiled. Within a few short weeks my parents had a loud and very aggressive (verging on violent) argument whilst I was in the house, thank goodness my son and husband weren’t there to see it! My dad again told me she was an alcoholic and had been drinking since I’d been back and she did actually admit that she had a problem and didn’t want to live her life like this but would try her hardest to sort herself out. I decided not to tell my husband out of fear of him judging her or wondering what on earth we had done by moving our family in. At this stage the plan was that my son would only go to nursery 3 days a week and that my mother would have him 2 days per week.

There was a small improvement over the coming weeks but I caught her out on a couple of occasions, there was one instance when she took my son to the local shop and I just happened to walk in and see her put a litre bottle of vodka in her handbag, whilst giving my son sweets. I felt sick to my stomach that I had let her walk to the shops with him, to fuel her ‘dirty habit’. I didn’t tell my dad about any of these occasions out of fear of her thinking I had betrayed her or that she couldn’t trust me, so I kept her secrets and she again told me she would get better because she had managed to get sober in the past. I then decided to share this with my husband, as I needed someone to talk to about it and it was also his son, not just mine and we needed to be mindful of his care and safety. We made the decision that we could no longer trust her to look after him on her own, so we put him into nursery full time.

After this there seemed to be a period of sobriety for a month or two and we started to reward her with some responsibility of picking him up from nursery on some days. But then there would be some sort of trigger and she would fall off the wagon. The whole thing exploded one day when my husband came home from work and my mom had just pulled up onto the drive at the same time. He went to the back of the car and my son didn’t have a seat belt on, when I got home I could smell alcohol on my mother and asked her if she had been drinking – she denied this for an hour and then finally caved in. So not only had she not put my 3year old sons seat belt on, she also had been drink driving with him in the car!!! It transpired that she has lost her licence twice in the past for DD. I got very angry over this and I had a VERY bad argument with her.

After I calmed down I realised that I needed to help her because she was lost and she couldn’t do this on her own. I took some time off work and she got some sedatives from the doctor to detox and help the withdrawal symptoms. She detoxed for a couple of weeks and was in a terrible state, shaking legs and could barely walk, sweating profusely and pretty much lay on the couch for a week. I researched rehabs, AA, alcohol action teams, therapy etc etc to get her the help she needed. She gave me empty promises of looking into getting help and went as far as going to one AA meeting with my father, to never return again. My dad said that they had done all of this before, he had tried counselling and AA, she had a sponsor but he was against re-hab because he thought she would escape. Apparently after a heated drunken argument she was taken to hospital in an ambulance and then ran out of the hospital after he had left. He found her wondering the streets with hardy any clothes on. He even considered getting her sectioned once but she threatened that he would never see her again if he did and has threatened to kill herself.

I started to talk to my dad about what was going on behind my mothers back and as soon as that happened she saw that as us ganging up on her and she stopped talking to me for a couple of weeks. She constantly lied about not drinking and whenever I asked her is she was ok, she would just reply “yes I am fine”. In moments of sobriety she admitted to me that she didn’t want to feel this way and that I needed to keep an eagle eye on her as she will not miss a trick to get vodka if she wants it! She requested we got a breathaliser to test her and she could prove that she wasn’t drinking, so we started testing her and she was ok for a week or so, then it became such an awful thing to do, driving home from work everyday knowing that you have to breathalise you own mother is not a pleasant experience. Not even knowing if you are going to come home to normality or a drunken argument was very stressful. But I thought she is my mother and I have to do everything I can to help. Even if I start getting tough and she hates me for it, then if the end result is a sober, healthier mother then so be it!

When I suspected she had been drinking I would always tell my dad and bring it out in the open, so there were no more secrets. We would then breathalise her and she would fail but still deny drinking, saying that she’d had cough medicine or that it was broken. We then made a decision that she wasn’t allowed to be alone with my son and that she could not drop him off or pick him up from nursery because she just couldn’t be trusted. I felt awful about this and thought that I would be making the problem worse by doing this to her, afterall her world revolved around him, or so I thought! But how could I possibly ever forgive myself or her if there was an incident or accident due to her clouded alcoholic judgement.

She seemed fairly ok for a couple of months but still didn’t seek any professional help, she went to the doctors a couple of times, returning with different hormone tablets or anti-depressants, which led me to believe that she wasn’t exactly telling the doctor the whole truth?? We were on a cycle then, she would seem ok, we would give her some responsibility for my son, then she’d relapse, we would argue over it and then no more ‘alone time’ with my son. She would lie and offer false promises but still not seek any help. By this stage I was feeling that I had failed her and had given up on my own mother, how could I do that?

Again another aggressive argument erupted between my parents, this time my husband and son were in the house, it almost seemed like it was coming to blows and my son was asleep in bed, I asked them to think about him and what he would think if they wake him up. My dad turned on me in his anger and told me that he had already seen them argue like that. I was furious!! My son has never seen his parents argue like that and I was damned if I was going to let him be exposed to that type of behaviour from his grand parents. We stayed in a hotel for a couple of nights, just to get away from the madness and collect our thoughts. During this time my mom was emailing me at work to see if she could have my son at the weekend, I told her that leaving my son with them was the last thing on my mind. So then I had an email war from her, telling me what a bad person and daughter I am and turning some of what had happened back on to me. I refrained from responding to this email and made a decision to move out. This didn’t go down well and my mom told my dad that everyone hated her and that she might as well kill herself, part of me felt that she would be putting herself out of her own misery – when I look at her I see a tortured soul.

We moved out, which was very stressful and our relationship has been tense to say the least but I do allow my parents to see my son a couple of times a week (but only if my dad is there). Surprise, surprise we now have another relapse and my parents had a shouting match in front of my son when he was over at their house. We have now decided to not let them see him until they have sorted themselves out, properly this time.

From what I can gather from what I have read, it appears that my dad is enabling my mother and in turn I am enabling both of them because there are no clear consequences of such behaviour? This pattern seems to be normal for them as they have been living it for the last 10 years but it is not normal to me or my family. My dad won’t enforce rehab and my mom won’t volunteer to get help, so are they as bad as each other for manifesting this bizarre reality?

I feel so harsh for not letting them see him because on the whole they are great grandparents and he adores them but what options do I have left? I just can’t talk to my mother anymore because she just lies, it generally ends up in an argument and she refuses to get professional help. Am I doing the right thing? Or am I giving her the reason of a lifetime to turn to the bottle hard?

[Learn2Live]

Hi Mandjas,

I am so sorry you are going through this with your Mom. It sounds like you have been thru the ringer! I was very glad to get to the end of your post and see that nothing happened to your little boy. I believe that you are doing the right thing. What we learn about alcoholism in 12-Step programs is that we did not cause it, we cannot control it, and we cannot cure it. So, while in her mind you may have given her an excuse to continue drinking, in truth, you have not.

I hope that you will give Al-Anon a try.

Best wishes.

[LucyA]

I dont feel comfortable giving advice here, but you seem to be doing it anyway, you need to keep your son safe, whatever happens and whoever it is, your son needs to be safe. Kids dont ask to be involved in this disease but they're often the ones who suffer from it the most and have the least protection.
If any other person drove your son while drunk what would you do?
We often think because it's family we should keep it quiet or give them another chance, why should we? If someone puts our kids at risk it doesn't matter who it is!
Protect your son and yourself, your mom is grown up and will do whatever she wants, whatever you do.

[Pelican]

Welcome to the Sober Recovery family!

I'm sorry that the living arrangements with your parents did not work out. Your decision to move yourself and your family out of that environment was a healthy move.

Please read some of the sticky notes at the top of this forum. Ask as many questions as needed. We are here to support you.

You said: Am I doing the right thing? Or am I giving her the reason of a lifetime to turn to the bottle hard?

She is already blameing everyone else for her problems. That is addiction. She will drink because she is happy, she will drink because she is sad, she will drink to celebrate, she will drink to de-stress, she will drink because the sky is blue today, etc.....She will always find a reason to drink.

The truth is that she is the one making the choice to drink. It is up to her to stop. Until she is ready to stop for herself, you can not control or cure her addiction.

You can protect yourself and your family. You are doing a great job in recognizing the alcoholism and removing your family from it's path of destruction.

Keep on keeping on!

[takincareome]

Yes, in taking care of yourself, your son, your marriage, you are doing the right thing.

Here's the sad truth: You can't change your mother. You can't control her drinking, no matter if you kept an eye on her 24 hours a day. You can't make her stop. Only she can do that. And forgive me for saying so, but it doesn't seem as if she wants to.

Alcoholism is crazy-making behavior. It makes her husband crazy, and it made you crazy for the time that you were staying there. You fall into a pattern of wanting to control their drinking, and you think, "if only they would stop, everything would be fine."

I would encourage you to try an al-anon meeting. The program might not be for you (I'm still making up my mind myself), but I've found some of its messages incredibly useful. You can care for your mother and refuse to enable her drinking.

But in answer to your question, yes, you did the right thing and there is no reason to feel guilty about this, no matter what manipulative tricks she tries. Do NOT put yourself, your son, your family in jeopardy because of her drinking. If she wants to see your son and you want to let her, you might want to consider some restrictions -- as in, their visits are supervised by you and UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES is she to drive him anywhere.

Do some thinking about what you will and won't put up with, but don't allow yourself to be guilt-tripped or manipulated. This is a disease, and if she wants to drink, she is going to drink, no matter what you do. However, she will make you crazy in the meantime if you continue to try to control her behavior. All you can do is learn to control your response to it and work on detaching from the situation. We can help you with that here, but we can't do it all. So think about going to an al-anon meeting, or pick up some of the literature -- there's al-anon literature, and there is also some other good literature about dysfunctional families and families of alcoholics.

I'm sorry to hear about your mom, and I know that you are deeply hurt and upset by this. Please take care of yourself and your family at all costs, and keep posting here. We are here to help, and we understand.

Lots of luck to you. Welcome.

[Iwanttoheal]

Hi Mandjas

Glad you found SR - this place has been so helpful in helping me sort out my own head in regards to my alcoholic family of origin. Have a good read around, there's lots of useful stuff on this site.

You will hear a lot about the 3Cs:

You didn't cause the alcoholism
You can't control the alcoholism
You can't cure the alcoholism - only the addict can do that.

Originally Posted by Mandjas

so are they as bad as each other for manifesting this bizarre reality?

Yes - a very wise man on this forum once told me that an addict will always find their enabler. My codependent mother never left my alcoholic father - she adjusted and endured continually, always believing that life would be wonderful when my father gave up drinking. What a waste of a life.

Originally Posted by Mandjas

I feel so harsh for not letting them see him because on the whole they are great grandparents and he adores them but what options do I have left? I just can’t talk to my mother anymore because she just lies, it generally ends up in an argument and she refuses to get professional help. Am I doing the right thing?

Yes - you are not being harsh, you are doing what any good mother would do and are protecting your son. Take the emotion out the equation - think responsibility and common sense. Don't leave your son alone with your parents and certainly don't let him alone in the car with your parents.

You'll see I said parents - I did this on purpose. If you think of them as a sick partnership that may help you. What you don't want is for them to be caught up in their alcoholic chaos when your son is in the room / car because their attention and focus will be on each other, not your son. That is not a safe environment for a child.

The sad fact is that alcoholism tends to get worse before it gets better and it does sound like your mother and father haven't reached their bottom yet.

Originally Posted by Mandjas

Or am I giving her the reason of a lifetime to turn to the bottle hard?

Take yourself out of the equation. You are not responsible for your mother's behaviour. She is an independent adult who makes her own choices in life. Read the 3Cs. Your job is to let her go and to concentrate on yourself, your child and your hubby.

Good luck. Come back often and let us know how you are getting on,

IWTHxxx

[Mandjas]

I have had a lot of great advice throughout a few of the forums. I almost felt like I would recieve negative comments in return for my lack of humility over my mother disease, I am plesantly surprised to hear that I am heading in the right direction.

The 3 c's is very powerful but one thing I am struggling with is detaching with love. Just the fact that I am detaching will make my mother think I hate her and don't care. I must admit I can't bare to be around her when she smells like she has had a drink (she may not even be acting odd) but I know she's not fully there. I keep reaching out to include her in my life, like the other month, after we had moved out (which was pretty tense anyway) I was taking my son to the movies and asked if she wanted to come along but she got into the car smelling of alcohol and acting a little hyperactive, I thought to myself why do I even bother. Since then I haven't invited her anywhere. When she calls me and sounds not quite sober I can't be bothered to talk to her. I'm sure that must be hard being rejected by me a lot - especially as I was the only person that she felt she could talk to.

So how do you detach? Just detach your self emotionally or remove yourself from the situation? How can you continue to feel love and care for someone that has consisently chooses alcohol over everything and everybody else? Someone who shows no remorse or guilt over what they do to people around them?



A popular recommendation is to try al-anon. Good news! I have found a meeting in my area for tomorrow night and I will be attending to see if I can learn more about detaching with love.

[Mandjas]

I have had a lot of great advice throughout a few of the forums. I almost felt like I would recieve negative comments in return for my lack of humility over my mother disease, I am plesantly surprised to hear that I am heading in the right direction.

The 3 c's is very powerful but one thing I am struggling with is detaching with love. Just the fact that I am detaching will make my mother think I hate her and don't care. I must admit I can't bare to be around her when she smells like she has had a drink (she may not even be acting odd) but I know she's not fully there. I keep reaching out to include her in my life, like the other month, after we had moved out (which was pretty tense anyway) I was taking my son to the movies and asked if she wanted to come along but she got into the car smelling of alcohol and acting a little hyperactive, I thought to myself why do I even bother. Since then I haven't invited her anywhere. When she calls me and sounds not quite sober I can't be bothered to talk to her. I'm sure that must be hard being rejected by me a lot - especially as I was the only person that she felt she could talk to.

So how do you detach? Just detach your self emotionally or remove yourself from the situation? How can you continue to feel love and care for someone that has consisently chooses alcohol over everything and everybody else? Someone who shows no remorse or guilt over what they do to people around them?



A popular recommendation is to try al-anon. Good news! I have found a meeting in my area for tomorrow night and I will be attending to see if I can learn more about detaching with love.

[Learn2Live]

One thing that helps me Mandjas, is when I realize I need to work on anything like detachment, I have to break it all down so that I can look for the "Why am I doing this?" in my thoughts and my behavior. Because so much of how we think and what we do is AUTOMATIC. Sometimes we have to go back DECADES to determine why we feel the way we feel, think the way we think, and behave the way we behave. Of course, this is only how I do it; I'm not sure how everyone else does it.

At first, before I can even start this, I have to allow myself to STOP and NOT REACT. At first doing this took what felt like years to teach myself. Then, I was able to become AWARE of what I was doing in the first place. You develop conscious awareness of yourself over time. There are many ways to develop conscious awareness. Once I had been able to become aware of what I was doing and how I was thinking, I could ask myself in earnest why I was behaving the way I was with the alcoholic or addicted person.

So, for example, in response to YOUR behavior:

I keep reaching out to include her in my life

Your Mother:

got into the car smelling of alcohol and acting a little hyperactive

And here was your reaction:

I thought to myself why do I even bother.

Until you become aware of what is going on and decide to change YOURSELF, you will continue to react in a manner that is unhealthy to YOU.

TRUTH: Thoughts like these are negative and unhealthy, negativity breeds stress, and stress degrades the human body and kills.

So, now what you can do is, search for the WHY you think things like, "Why do I even bother?" Search for your inner feelings, desires, motivations, experiences, etc that create this negativity in your brain.

It sounds cumbersome, I know, but once you practice it a couple times, it gets easier and much less cumbersome.

Of course, other folks I'm sure have other ways of doing this that are much better than my way described above. Sorry to say I have certain limitations that CAUSE me to have to break EVERYTHING down in life this way. Sometimes it is to my detriment, like in personal relationships, but in other ways it provides valuable benefit, like in my career.

Best wishes with your situation and I am VERY glad you are going to give Al-Anon a try. It is a valuable social support mechanism that will provide noticeable results.

Take care of yourself! You are a unique and loving individual, I can tell!

[reverse]

Mandjas,

You had stated, "Why do I even bother?" It appears to me that maybe you bother and put yourself on the line for her because you hope and believe that maybe she will change and get better. And more and more each time, it appears that it is just one dissappointment after the other after the other.

My mother has been an alcoholic for 25 years. I'm 27 years old. All of my life, my mother has been a heavy drinker. For most of my early, adolescent, and early adult life I spent so much of my time hoping and thinking and praying and begging and crying and arranging and plotting ways to get her to change. Maybe if i react or respond in this way it will be better. Perhaps we can have the relationship that I've always wanted and I can have my mom back.
The sad truth is, with alcoholism, it doesn't get better, it gets worse--or at least in my case. Things get uglier, the alcoholic/addict does even more things to cross your boundaries and violate you even to the point of emotional, physical, and verbal abuse----ALL of which are undeserved. The minute I would put my foot down or try to assert a boundary, the response I would get were the following ones at any given time:
rage
coercion
belittlement
condescending-how dare you tell me what to do
how dare you share your feelings
how dare you have feelings and limits
you do what i say when i say
you do what i want when i want it
you go along with what i want u too
physical outlashings
verbal outlashings
you must not care about me and our family
guilt trips
fake tears
lies, lies, and more lies.

ALL OF THESE THINGS were NEVER DESERVED. I did nothing to cause it being treated that way. But it still happened.

I've always looked at my situation with my parents as a catch 22. I can never win. Either I'm damned if i assert myself and put boundaries up....or i'm damned if I go along w/ the dysfunction and get sicker like them (my mom and step-dad and older sibling). So which is the lesser of two evils? LOL Seriously....to protect myself, seperate myself, and learn to deal with the guilt as a result of doing so.

In my life right now, it is difficult for me emotionally to face each day (especially with a newborn baby who is now almost 2 mo. old and her grandma refuses to get her driver's license to come see her...which is a long story under the thread "moving on") without a mother. However, I've been grieving the absence of a mother since I was age 2. She's never had my feelings, thoughts, concerns as her priority. Her priorities have always revolved around her habit....and everything and everyone must conform to suit her lifestyle and if they don't, they are a criminal. It's sad, but that's what it does--it tears families apart. Does it kill me that grandma doesn't want to have anything to do w/ her grandkids even tho she says she does (actions speak louder than words)? yes. Did it kill me that my mom always chose the bottle over me? yes. I thought that once I became an adult, it wouldn't bother me anymore. NOw that I have children the pain is almost unbearable at times...and even worse considering I don't have much of a social support network....therefore absolutely no one to celebrate the joy of the birth of my child. I know no one who will come over to a birthday party for my chidlren, etc.

For me in my life, I am grieving still to this day...never having a mother....but I am sure glad to be rid of a creepy destructable person who is not my mother. She has become someone else and someone unsafe for me to associate with...unfortunately. There is no trust and for me to continue in a relationship where trust has been broken and destroyed, would be putting myself and my family in a vulnerable position emotionally and mentally...and even physically depending on the circumstances. It's amazing how much more energy and happiness I've had once I invest something worth investing in: MY FAMILY (husband and children). To invest in someone who is on a spiral downward is only going to drain me of everything I am. So...I stopped giving. As a result of this, I obviously have become the worst person ever to my mom and sister. Go figure....as to be expected because they never can do any wrong. LOL

You asked earlier "how do I detach with love." To be honest, you can try to set a boundary here and say it as politely as possible and even put a pretty pink bow around it and the truth of the matter is they still will think you are trying to hurt them. It doesn't matter how nicely we try to break the news. The truth is, they are suffereing the consequences of their behavior. When they drink and lie, etc....other people either stop coming around or they enable. They don't like it when people no longer enable. They don't like boundaries being set and all of that. Detaching with love doesn't mean it's going to be peachy...most always its' like coals over their head and salt on their wounds. It burns and there's no other way to say it. I've done the best I could in my situation...I was as white as snow and as blameless as I could be and I still come out looking like a criminal. It has only been fairly recent that I stopped being nice to my mom and just gave her the truth of what I thought in raw form. After all, just because she's drunk, I'm somehow supposed to be considerate of how she feels when shes doesn't care about anyone elses? Hogwash. Besides, i felt better standing my ground and not treating her like a princess for once in my life. If i wouldn't tolerate being disrespected and treated poorly by friends, why is she somehow entitled to? Simply b/c she's my mother? Hogwash.

Sorry for rambling, those are just my thoughts. I feel your pain and you sound like a sincere and wonderful person/mother with a wonderful husband and son. keep protecting yourself and your family. That is all you can do right now. I know it's painful to see your mother and father like this, but you;ve done all you could. Take care of yourself and try not to take your mom seriously. If she wants to be drunk all the time, there is nothing u can do to change that. And make sure you lean on ur hubby for support...that's what he's there for...when ur angry, need to cry...or whatever. Friends are also good for that too.

Anyway...I hope I was able to shed some light on some areas for you and encourage you. Please take care and god bless u.

[Mandjas]

Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts and experiences with me. I do hope you keep the courage to stand by your convictions and the guilt eases over time. It must be incredibly hard for you with such a young baby and I admire you.

I must admit that I am currently obsessing about the situation I find myself in. I go to bed thinking about it, I can't concentrate at work, I wake up thinking about it, I even feel like hitting the bottle myself when I get home from work!! If I didn't have these encouraging notes and thoughts I think I would have:

a) Told my mom to go take a running jump
b) Once again brushed it under the carpet never to spoken about again
c) Let her continue to see my son and worry about what mood she is in

There is not doubt on this earth that she utterly adores her only grandchild, her entire house is full of photo's, she constantly talks about him, she watches DVD's of when he was a baby all the time. She buys him presents and constantly looks for things he will like, she absolutely spoils him rotten! AND THAT'S WHAT MAKES THIS SITUATION SO HARD

Having read some heart felt stories on here, I also find myself doubting whether it's that bad? She doesn't go missing, or stay out, or throw up, or pass out, or become abusive towards me or my family, or steal from me. She's just not quite right? Either manic or over emotional, or moody but these aren't extreme. Is this because I was on the merry-go-round with her when I lived there, so some of it seems to resemble some form of normality?

But then I just take a look at my first post and take inventory of all of the things that have happened and although not extreme (apart from the Drink Driving) it has probably caused as much damage. The lack of trust, the constant lies, the walking around on egg shells, the guessing game, giving her a kiss to see if I can smell anything her, the wondering what state she will be in when I am about to meet her, the worry that she may say or do something after alcohol has clouded her judgement?

I now have had the courage to enforce two weeks of no contact but my difficulty is that I haven't spoken to my mother about this. All of the conversation has happened with my father, as I can have a rational, non-confrontational discussion with him. So god knows what she thinks about the situation, she probably thinks I hate her and am punishing her for her behaviour. I still need to have that conversation with her and I understand your comment.

"To be honest, you can try to set a boundary here and say it as politely as possible and even put a pretty pink bow around it and the truth of the matter is they still will think you are trying to hurt them. It doesn't matter how nicely we try to break the news. The truth is, they are suffereing the consequences of their behavior."

I want to be clear about my boundaries but am worrying obsessivley how I have that conversation?

From some of the al-anon literature it seems that my behaviour and reactions won't aid her recovery, so I am confused?

I intend on working on changing my attitude towards her as I know it's not healthy to react the way that I do and I hope that Al-anon can help me with that but for now I can't see the best way to appraoch it

Take care of yourself
Mandjas

[takincareome]

Think of it in terms of a dance. You and your mother have a dance that you have been doing for years now. You both know the steps very well. But you have decided you want to start doing a different dance, one she doesn't know the steps to. She doesn't like that, because she wants to keep dancing with you the way you did before. But that's not working for you anymore. Her choice is HER choice, not yours. But you need to do the dance that is best for you.

[reverse]

Originally Posted by takincareome

Think of it in terms of a dance. You and your mother have a dance that you have been doing for years now. You both know the steps very well. But you have decided you want to start doing a different dance, one she doesn't know the steps to. She doesn't like that, because she wants to keep dancing with you the way you did before. But that's not working for you anymore. Her choice is HER choice, not yours. But you need to do the dance that is best for you.

i love the analogy!

also, if u don't know how to confront her, try doing it in a letter and keep it simple and to the point. Don't argue her points if she puts on a guilt trip or gets defensive, etc. In my case, it is better to write in a letter b/c on the phone and in person it is easier for me to lose focus...give in, accept her lame excuses and just continue in her dance that leads to nowhere genuine....and onto a path that enables, excuses, and justifies her actions. Plus, on the phone and in person, i might be more prone to get emotional--cry, yell, and end up getting more upset--wasting more energy, etc. This way, it will allow u to take a step back and look at the overall picture without getting sucked into her world. Theres nothing wrong w/ taking a step back, seperating urself to evaluate a situation/relationship. good luck to u!

[Mandjas]

Originally Posted by takincareome

Think of it in terms of a dance. You and your mother have a dance that you have been doing for years now. You both know the steps very well. But you have decided you want to start doing a different dance, one she doesn't know the steps to. She doesn't like that, because she wants to keep dancing with you the way you did before. But that's not working for you anymore. Her choice is HER choice, not yours. But you need to do the dance that is best for you.

I love it! I just read this to my husband and we both said how simple but profound at the same time.

Funny enough I just looked at a post about someone needing help writing a letter to her AS and whilst I was folding the washing I started to compose my letter in my head. The when I sat down I saw your post - is this my higher power that al-anon talk about? I really don't know but all signs point to a letter and a big weight has been lifted off my shoulder already.

May I run this past you guys as you all seem to know from experience
the pitfalls of such things?

[reverse]

Originally Posted by Mandjas

I really don't know but all signs point to a letter and a big weight has been lifted off my shoulder already.

May I run this past you guys as you all seem to know from experience
the pitfalls of such things?

Mandjas, I'm glad you sound more at ease with the letter method. This truly has helped me. Certainly it never changed my mother (although throughout the years she learned that bullying me isn't going to get her anywhere--so that eventually stopped lol), but it helped me take a step back from the situation. There's nothing wrong with expressing concern to your mom in a letter and setting future limits. I look at it this way. When a person begins changing their behavior-for good or bad--we take inventory of the relationship and ask ourselves how much do we want to continue investing in this. What do i like about it...what don't I like. If we are not getting a good return on our investment, something needs to change. Either we start investing less time in the relationship or we set more limits on it. Nothing wrong with that. It is always good to take a moment to step back and ponder the direction that things are going. Sometimes we have to make adjustments in relationships because people are always changing--either for the better or worse.

Not sure what you meant by ur last question, but if u mean u would like to share ur letter--go ahead. I posted mine the other day. Feedback was very helpful to me b/c it was a big step that I was taking and needed encouragement. I love my mother, but not the negative things she has become.

[neverachild]

I can totally relate. My mother is a functioning alcoholic as well. Yes she can hold a job and seem quite normal to most people. I'm a grown woman 34 and married now but I'm lacking something in my life. I have learned that nobody can change her. Only she can change and she will NEVER change so I've just learned to limit my time with her. She hardly ever calls anyway. I actually feel like I don't have a mother at all. She's just not that into hanging out or interested in my life. I've only gotten upset and angry and she has been nothing but a total let-down for me my whole life. I could go on and on about some of the BS she has done or not done over the years: DUI'S, drunkin' behavior around my friends, drunk dialing, lying, destroying my room and belongings, verbal abuse and on and on. Yes she had gone through some bad things in her younger years and I get that but she really needed to work those things out. She chose the bottle instead. I've just learned that it will always be the same outcome with her. I see her for holidays and maybe we'll do a girls weekend in the summer with my younger sister but that's about it. I do feel an emptiness inside. I wish I had another mom. Someone who gave a damn. She wasn't even interested in helping me plan my wedding I planned the whole thing by myself. She spent most of the time up stairs tending to my brothers baby the day of our wedding. My husband wanted a traditional wedding and his mother wouldn't travel to Anguilla. That's another story in itself. His mother is a hypochondriac. No joke! She's been a sickly person her whole life. So I have no support there. It's all about her. Every week she has something new. Needless to say I was stuck in a rut and a hard place for the wedding. I didn't enjoy any of it. See why I wanted to elope in Anguilla? As far as my dad, he's been around but never a father figure. Can't hold a job never been there econmically for me etc. Not a drinker though but has his own issues as well. Deadbeat dad I guess you can say. They divorced when I was 5.

I guess I'm here because throughout my life I have found it very difficult to have female friends for one reason or another. Some betrayal (on their part) or some because I just don't have the patience to hang out for too long when a problem arises in a friendship. I would actually love to have girlfriends but I have a hard time warming up to women or vise versa. Any suggestions? Is there a group or place for people like me?

[neverachild]

Is there a place for women like me? Are there women out there that feel like I do?

[reverse]

Originally Posted by neverachild

Is there a place for women like me? Are there women out there that feel like I do?

OMG....I am right w/ you all the way my dear. I know exactly what you are going through and how alone you feel. If you ever want to talk you can hit me up on msn messenger: miss_amanda2005@hotmail.com

Let me know ok...u are totally not alone. My mom, step-dad, bio father, and father in law are all deadbeats. My mother in law has her issues as well...but not nearly as bad as the prior people I named. She still has a lot of issues. I'd love to talk w/ u sometime and offer encouragement and support...even if it is online...it does make a big difference.

-Amanda

[lightinmypath]

I too am the daughter of a alcoholic mother I have was given the advise by a therapist 20 years ago to join a adult children of alcoholics support group and then he would be able to help me with my life and the anxiety and the insanity I felt. I did not do that and now 20 years later here I am I wish I would have surrendered that feeling that it was not my problem and I would deal with my own feelings. Much has happened in that 20 years and I am now starting down that path. I could not leave my young children with their grandparents either because of my mothers drinking. I went through all your same emotions It was exhausting. I support you in your venting it is healthy. Seek out a group and allow yourself the support and education they have to offer. I can not turn back the clock but it would have saved me and my family so much heart ache. Trying now to heal you are in my prayers.

[Carol Star]

One thing I learned here that I LOVE and helps me so much is LET GO OR BE DRAGGED>>>>They have the same higher power I do. I pray for them. I don't do holidays with them anymore. That was like the paddle with the rubberband and ball on the end getting"hit,hit,hit" with the ball.....I take mini vacations on the holidays and don't spend them with chaos,crazies,poor me,pour me a drinkers....I am so thankful and grateful to now live in the solution instead of the problem....