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Originally Posted by joedris  Dear Bugsworth, I apologize if my comment about Plan B sounded condescending. It certainly wasn't meant to be. I take alchohollism and recovery very seriously. While I'm a proponent of AA, I also recognize that many people do get sober without it. I applaud them for having the ability to do that. And I despise the term "dry drunk" which is often used in referring to someone who got sober without using the AA program. Unfortunately, I've seen too many people over the years dismiss AA without having an alternative plan. And trying to conquer this disease without some sort of plan in mind is usually futile. I earnestly hope that anyone who wants to get sober is successful in doing so. Hence my comment.
As the the 5% figure, I've heard it applied to those who fail to stay in AA for a year, for those who attend a meeting and never return, and for those who stay in AA and reach 5 years of sobriety. I still encourage everyone to be very skeptical of any statistic concerning success and sobriety, regardless of how that sobriety is achieved. No really knows how many people are successful in getting and staying sober, and I doubt that there will ever be an accurate figure here. And believe me, AA will never shout anything from the rooftops. If you read the 12 Traditions of AA you'll understand why.
Dear sfgirl, My objection to Dr. Willengerg's comment stems from his contention that there's a condition of temporary dependence on alcohol. I'm familiar with the DSM-IV definition and would like to point out here that nowhere does DSM-IV indicate that dependence on alcohol can be a temporary condition. Alcoholism is not temporary. The AMA defines it as "a primary chronic disease...". The word "chronic" meaning permanent. And I agree that the doctor is an intelligent man, well qualified for his position in NIAA. But while it's possible that there may exist a condition of temporary dependence, the doctor is going to have to give some supporting documentation to back up his statement.
And lastly for Boleo. The Irishman your were referring to is Matt Talbot. |
Chronic does not mean permanent it means long lasting. Alcoholism refers to the overconsumption of alcohol. nothing more nothing less. If you are not drinking you are not suffering from alcoholism. I think is very important point. This is the generally excepted medical definition which experts refer to when talking about alcoholism.
Something I found annoying in AA is people describing any mental illness as the ism of alcoholism. It encourages the one size fits all solution, it makes people reluctant to get specialized help as they believe everybody is suffering the same mental problem as everybody else. Even ones who don't have any mental health unless you call lack of discipline and selfishness a mental illness!